Art copying suggestions

[JammyHeff]

Hey there. I'm new to this but it certainly seems like a great forum. I have some large format experience and I'm looking to set up an art copying (photographing in a studio with 5x4 original paintings) and scanning service for local artists. I would also like to use the camera for my other landscape/documentary work.

Can anyone recommend an affordable bundle of equipment: camera, lens, scanner? I was kinda interested in these Fotoman cameras, a 150mm or 135mm lens and an Epson v750 scanner. Complimented with an entry level Bowens Esprit setup.

Any advice would be appreciated like a Sunday morning cup of tea with a bicky or two!

James

[Greg Lockrey]

There many ways to approach this. Most people who get into this usually work with the equipment that they already have. If I were you and knowing the subject they way that I do (I make my living copying artwork) I would first purchase a copy of "Copying and Duplicating". It is put out by Kodak. Much of the really good films that I used to use in the past are no longer made. My work flow is now 100% digital whether I'm using a scanner and stitching the pieces together or using a high end digital camera on very large pices and stitching those pieces together. This book will give you the funadmentals of the process. Many people think it is just taking a photo of a flat object, it's more than that.

[Ted Harris]

Jammy,

Let me underscore what Greg just said and further point out that the "entry level" equipment requirements for this rather specialized segment of the market are way different than what you are thinking, as are the skill requirements (as Greg mentioned). IF you ar going to do this right then, while a Fotoman camera is not a bad idea you will still be much better using it with a dedicated digital back. If you are going to go the film route then I wouldn't recommend one of the consumer scanners. I certainly wouldn't recommend any beginning lighting setup and would strongly recommend learning a lot about the lighting requirements before jumping in.

To give you a concrete example, I have been working with a client who is in the midst of setting up just such a business. His setup will include a Betterlight digital back on a Linhof Kardan GT rail camera, a dedicated laptop computer, a studio stand, necessary lighting and a 44" HP Z3100ps GP printer to deliver output. Total investment in the range of $25,000-30,000. You can leave off the digital back and substitute a used high end scanner but you will still be pushing $20,000. I'm not saying you can't do it on the cheap, you can but what you save in equipment costs you will spend in time and less than professional results.

[JammyHeff]

Thank you Ted and Greg,

I definitely don't have that kind of money (wish I did). I have used £10,000 Imacons before and regularly pay for my negs to be drumscanned. The thing is...there are many local painters where I live and many galleries and I believe they aren't using anywhere near 5x4 reproductions. At most the odd pro offers a copy using his/hers 1DSII.

I'm not aiming to offer a giclee service too...just an accurate slide which they purchase off me. They can then do what they like with it. Is it possible to get decent results up to this point in the process without breaking the bank?

As a side note...Ted, you mentioned the Betterlight system, are they only useful for very still subjects or can they be used outside in the wild? I'm a digital skeptic...don't want to be, it's just I haven't seen a print from digital capture that competes with a film capture...have you? Personally I find it difficult to prefer a lightjet print from one of my drumscan files (all calibrated and spot on) than a simple C-print hand made by myself.

Thoughts?

[Michael T. Murphy]

James,

I don't know what you intend to do about pricing. As you can imagine, those of us that have invested $30K in equipment have a certain base cost that we need to recover when charging customers.

Often part of that cost is recovered in pricing for the output - prints, canvas, etc. As you decide on what equipment you are going to invest in, you may want to do some research on your cost of doing business (CODB.)

Here is a decent article to get you started. Many photographers totally underestimate what is required to *stay* in business over the long term.

http://burnsautoparts.com/BAPsite/Ma...files/CODB.pdf

Also, the scanning backs are of limited use, at best, outside the studio, or for portraits, etc. I would consider that a cost that needs to be 100% amortized - billed - through the fine art work.

Good luck!

[Henry Ambrose]

I'd look for an old monorail camera - something not popular or perhaps unfashionable and therefor inexpensive (but still perfectly usable). Then I'd buy a 210mm lens - plenty of those around and usually modestly priced. Add a sturdy tripod and that takes care of your copy camera needs. Buy lights that are easily serviced near where you live. Add a shorter lens for your other shooting. The Epson flatbed or similar will be good enough for lots of jobs.

You can probably buy all that for $2,500.00 US. Or spend 5-10 times as much for a digital rig. If you're trying to pay for digital gear with your copy work you better have a lot of it.

[Gene McCluney]

I scan paintings regularly. I use existing 4x5 studio equipment I already had, plus I invested in a Betterlight scanning back. I have a 44" wide printer (Epson-Ultrachrome), but I didn't acquire that just for this application. I use my Sinar-P expert system camera with a 4x5 back, 2 bellows with center standard and normally a 14" Commercial Ektar. This allows me to be well back from the painting, so I have plenty of room to move around the lights for reflection control. I use a couple of Bardwell-Macalister 2000w fresnels, left over from when I did hot-light photography of products. These are big "movie" type lights. You need plenty of light.
The 14" Ektar is too big to attach the infrared blocking filter required for the Betterlight back to the front of the lens with the normal filter attaching frame, so I tape the filter to the back of the lens, which puts it inside the camera.

Using a long focal length lens, helps minimize the effect of any error in alignment of camera and painting. I hang painting on wall, and do a prescan with a grey-scale density wedge to get color balance, then remove wedge for final scan.

Scanning back photography in the studio is an ideal venue to use a lens in barrel mount. Longer process lenses would be ideal. I use the Ektar in shutter, because that is what I have. It provides excellent results.

[Jim Jones]

I must be the worst cheapskate on the forum. I'd start out with a carefully aligned press camera and about a 200mm lens corrected for macro work. By using open flash, the lens doesn't even need to be in a shutter. This way you have an inexpensive dedicated system. If your business succeeds, you can upgrade. Until then, you can burn a lot of film for the price of the right gear.

[Gene McCluney]

I must be the worst cheapskate on the forum. I'd start out with a carefully aligned press camera and about a 200mm lens corrected for macro work. By using open flash, the lens doesn't even need to be in a shutter. This way you have an inexpensive dedicated system. If your business succeeds, you can upgrade. Until then, you can burn a lot of film for the price of the right gear.

You can't use flash with a Scanning Back, and a Scanning Back has become the industry standard used by galleries and archives for their digitizing of paintings. This is what the public has come to expect. No question that a 4x5 tranny can be better, but only if well scanned, and the cost of the scanner will equal or exceed the Scanning Back. If you have to charge for a 4x5 transparency....and...a externally purchased professional scan..you may not be competetive in price, particularly for struggling local artists.

You pretty much have to offer a hi-rez digital file as your end product, as the primary reason people have quality photography of their paintings is to have limited edition "Giclee" aka Inkjet, prints made, or to submit for publication, both applications require a digital file.

[sesshin]

Watch the internet auction site for BetterLight backs to come up from time to time. A slightly older scsi model just went for less than half of what it originally sold for. All the other camera equipment could be purchase used online as well, obviously, for a great discount.