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Thread: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

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  1. #1

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    35

    Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Hi all, I am a long time member, but have not been shooting LF for a long time, now considering to return. I am thinking of a Sinar X which I viewed recently. The movements are all nice and smooth except the rise/fall and focus knobs on the back standard are both quite stiff and tight. Anything I should be aware of that is the reason for this condition? I guess it’s preferable to being well worn and loose, but is it possible to fix? Any other views on the X is appreciated too.

    Thanks.
    Peter Chong
    Singapore

  2. #2

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,904

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    If the geared controls are stiff on a Sinar X/P/P2 it is usually due to the lubricants drying out then becoming clay like. This caused excessive friction and wear on all the moving parts. This problem could also be due to dirt and grit finding their way into the moving parts.

    Most often worn part of a Sinar X/P/P2 would be the rear focus gearing as that is the most often used control.

    Stiff controls could also be a user perception issues as there is a specified amount of torque/force required to operate the controls. The specfied forces involved are in the Sinar X/P/P2 service manual:
    https://www.galerie-photo.com/manuel...r-verifier.pdf

    Sinar X was a "non-sheet film format convertible" version of the P, idea being lower cost. The frames can be removed and interchanged by loosening the set screws that are on the X instead of the finger screws on the P and P2.. essentially the same camera in too many ways.


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by pchong View Post
    Hi all, I am a long time member, but have not been shooting LF for a long time, now considering to return. I am thinking of a Sinar X which I viewed recently. The movements are all nice and smooth except the rise/fall and focus knobs on the back standard are both quite stiff and tight. Anything I should be aware of that is the reason for this condition? I guess itís preferable to being well worn and loose, but is it possible to fix? Any other views on the X is appreciated too.

    Thanks.

  3. #3

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    35

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Wow, thanks Bernice for that link. Haven’t looked at it yet. But I would imagine it will detail what lube to use, where and how much to use.

    I don’t think it’s a perception issue as the two rear gears need significantly more torque than the front equivalents.
    Peter Chong
    Singapore

  4. #4
    Drew Wiley
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    SF Bay area, CA
    Posts
    17,319

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Basically a simplified P without the extra expense of the all the engraving marks. A few limitations. All the Sinar series are capable of being user-maintained with respect to the foregoing problem, unless the gearing is totally worn out, and then you look for a replacement of the culprit component itself. If experimenting with simple lube, make sure it isn't a sticky kind of grease that will actually trap grit and sand. That's one downfall of geared controls; they need to be periodically cleaned.

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Washington D.C.
    Posts
    250

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Is there a reason you are considering the X over a F2? They are a lot less money, lighter and easier to tote around and have all the movements you will ever need. I have the F2 and the P2 and almost always use the F2.

    -Joshua

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    35

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    I am doing mostly tabletop work. And prefer geared movements.
    Peter Chong
    Singapore

  7. #7

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    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,904

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    P/P2/X flat works for indoor table top images where lower weight is a Dis-advantage and More Weight is an Advantage... as in Stability. Geared camera movement are a definite plus for table top work. From the perspective of having available many, many Sinar modules from F to P2 to Norma, the specific need drives what modules are needed to make up a view camera to best meet the specific image making need(s)..

    Fave indoor view camera to this day after many decades remains the P or P2 in too many ways. DB or DBM mount lenses with Sinar shutter and remote cables can further speedy and improve image making needs. Sinar GG metering probe can aid in exposure and image contrast control by simply using a meter back on any Sinar rear standard frame.

    Other things to consider, best to apply some form of compendium lens shade for table top image and there are often filters involved and more.. All easily accommodate within the Sinar system be the basic camera an F, F+, F2, X, P, P2 or Norma...

    As for market $, current F2 market prices are near P prices with the X some where in the middle and a premium for the P3 or P2 as basic cameras.. All still typically lower than most lightweight field folder view cameras... today.


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua Dunn View Post
    Is there a reason you are considering the X over a F2? They are a lot less money, lighter and easier to tote around and have all the movements you will ever need. I have the F2 and the P2 and almost always use the F2.

    -Joshua

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    35

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Thanks to all, I bought the Sinar X. Comes with two regular bellows, a WA bag bellows, extension rail and a F standard. Waiting for delivery now…together with a 180mm Nikkor f5.6. Will report back with my new (to me) camera when all are assembled. Will use it with my Photoclam Multiflex Head (I believe is an Arca Cube copy) and Gitzo Systematic 3 series tripod.
    Peter Chong
    Singapore

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    3,904

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Sinar, far more than a camera..

    Been there, done similar...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU8ozo1ubfc


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by pchong View Post
    Thanks to all, I bought the Sinar X. Comes with two regular bellows, a WA bag bellows, extension rail and a F standard. Waiting for delivery now…together with a 180mm Nikkor f5.6. Will report back with my new (to me) camera when all are assembled. Will use it with my Photoclam Multiflex Head (I believe is an Arca Cube copy) and Gitzo Systematic 3 series tripod.

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Collinsville, CT USA
    Posts
    2,176

    Re: Question on how to assess condition of Sinar X

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernice Loui View Post
    Sinar, far more than a camera..
    Been there, done similar...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NU8ozo1ubfc Bernice
    I have used a relatively same setup off and on since the mid 1970s. Back when, initially with Norma standards. IMO: Works best with a 120 camera - Hasselblad and Bronica GS-1 specifically. I found it to be a little less workable with 35mm/DX cameras. The Novoflex brand light stands are not inexpensive to say the least. Instead I adapted six articulating arms and light sources from a Bogen Light Modulator mounting them on moveable bases. Maybe 10-15 years ago I converted their tungsten bulbs to Nikon fiber optic light sources (for Nikon Microscopes) and never looked back. I never was into using electronic flashes even with modeling lights as light sources. Over the past years I have been doing a lot of Photomacrography in the field rather than in the "studio". Mostly with a Nikon D850 tethered to my MacBook Pro. The monitor on the Macbook Pro is so vastly superior to the way smaller D850's LCD screen.

    I have read references of being able to convert the X's rear standard to carry an 8x10 frame, but I have yet to find a detailed description of the conversion. But then acquiring a genuine 8x10 P shouldn't break the bank and having the correct 8x10 standards would be a real plus over adapting 4x5 standards.

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