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Thread: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

  1. #1
    Jeffery Dale Welker
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    Sep 2006
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    Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    For several years now, I've developed 99% of my 4x5 negatives (FP4) in Ilford Ilfotec DD-X using the Stearman SP-445 tank system. I am in the process of transitioning to a Jobo CPP-2 Processor with a couple of 3006 Series Expert Sheet Film Drums. While the Stearman SP-445 has been nearly foolproof for me, the Jobo gives me some options the Stearman just can't. As part of this transition, I want to try a new film developer combination in the Jobo. Tmax 100 developed in 510 Pyro. Jay DeFehr tells me this is a wonderful film/developer combination. Jay's wonderful portraits attest - https://flic.kr/p/BKmMm7

    I've found some online information on process times for 100TMX and 510 Pyro, but wanted to seek input from those on the LFPF that have experience with the Jobo system + 100TMX + 510 Pyro.

    Thanks in advance.
    "I have this feeling of walking around for days with the wind knocked out of me." - Jim Harrison

  2. #2

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    No personal experience with that exact combo of film & developer, but the technical information I have from Zone Imaging (purveyors of 510-Pyro across the pond) is: 8:50 at 21C, standard 1:100 dilution, EI 100.

  3. #3

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    I never use the Jobo with 510 Pyro. In my mind, it works better in a tray. If you want to try a pyro based developer in a Jobo, look at Pyrocat HD or one of its derivatives.

  4. #4

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    I successfully processed 8x10 in a Jobo style tank with PMK, but this was with a hand roller, and I would pick it up and slosh it back and forth vigorously several times a minute to keep from getting streaks, in addition to the constant rolling. I haven't used 510 pyro, but if it's prone to streaking the same way PMK is, I think the motorized rolling of the CPP-2 won't be sufficient agitation. Like Jim said, a different version of pyro would probably be a better choice. I've used Pyrocat HD with the hand rolling and didn't include the additional vigorous agitation, rolling only, and I didn't get streaks.
    But this isn't with the Expert Drum, it was with the other style roller tank. I've use an Expert Drum before, but only with C-41, so I can't comment how it performs with pyro.

  5. #5

    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    I continue to be amazed at photographers that for some strange reason desire to change two variables in their process at the same time. If you rightfully state that what worked for you for several years - DD-x and 100 TMX and add that the JOBO offers you more options (I suspect more process volume), why not take the intermediate step and singularly introduce the JOBO into your process with DD-X ? My concern is as previously stated that pyro based developers generally speaking are at their best in a tray. Pyrocat (catechol) is an exception. I have tray developed with pyro for many years and it works great. Additionally 100 TMX is a renown fickle film for developing as the JOBO and Kodak's T Max developer are touted as the optimal pairing for the task at hand. DD-X would work fine. I always recommend never change more than one variable in your process (either field exposure or darkroom) because it is inherently manageable as a one variable challenge, but if this is your mission good luck.

  6. #6

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    I have processed many sheets of 4x5 and 8x10 Foma 100 and Ilford FP4+ in Expert Drums on my CPP-2 with Pyrocat-HD, PMK, and 510-Pyro with no issues. I run it at the slowest speed and, with PMK, I change out for fresh developer halfway through the development time.

  7. #7

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    I used 510 pyro for a short period of time, but ceased doing so for the following reasons:
    * Oxidation of the concentrate turned out far worse than online reports indicated, resulting in unpredictable activity once the concentrate was more than a couple of weeks old
    * Tendency towards uneven development especially when doing sheet film in rotary drums (Jobo 25xx, not Expert Drums); similar to Pyrocat which is also somewhat prone to this issue, but 510 was far worse as I recall; the problem usually is most visible along the long edges of 4x5's
    * Inherent toxicity of the materials used
    * End result in terms of tonality and grain was not quite as nice to my eyes as instant mytol (DIY one-shot XTOL variant, which happens to be relatively non-toxic to boot)
    * Syrupy concentrate was difficult to pull up into a syringe or pipette and took more time than I liked to dissolve in water (other liquid or quasi-liquid concentrates dissolve far better IME)

    Initially I quite liked the results from it, but I ended up favoring instant mytol, which is a bit more work to mix, but otherwise seems to have virtually only advantages...

  8. #8

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    Seems like we all have different experiences with various products... With 510-Pyro, specifically:

    * I've used the stock solution when it's the color of India ink without issue
    * Never had uneven development in Expert Drums on my CPP-2 or various 4x5 inversion tanks
    * Many of the chemicals we all use in our daily lives are toxic
    * Never used Mytol, but I've never been unhappy with resulting prints and grain is not an issue for me
    * I use syringes that are made for children's syrupy medicine which makes it easy to dispense the concentrate

    I will say that when the concentrate is dispensed into water it requires more stirring than any other developer I've ever used. I stir it somewhat slowly (to minimize oxidation) for a few minutes.

  9. #9

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    True, we encounter toxic substances all the time, however the dose makes the poison. Pyrogallol is a dangerous compound, and few home-brewers know what they are doing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan9940 View Post
    Seems like we all have different experiences with various products... With 510-Pyro, specifically:

    * I've used the stock solution when it's the color of India ink without issue
    * Never had uneven development in Expert Drums on my CPP-2 or various 4x5 inversion tanks
    * Many of the chemicals we all use in our daily lives are toxic
    * Never used Mytol, but I've never been unhappy with resulting prints and grain is not an issue for me
    * I use syringes that are made for children's syrupy medicine which makes it easy to dispense the concentrate

    I will say that when the concentrate is dispensed into water it requires more stirring than any other developer I've ever used. I stir it somewhat slowly (to minimize oxidation) for a few minutes.

  10. #10

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    Re: Processing 510 Pyro & 100TMX with Jobo CPP-2

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael R View Post
    True, we encounter toxic substances all the time, however the dose makes the poison. Pyrogallol is a dangerous compound, and few home-brewers know what they are doing.
    When mixing any developer formula containing toxic chemicals like pyrocatechin, pyrogallol, etc, I always wear an apron, nitrile gloves, eye protection, and a good quality respirator. And, I try to mix outside, if possible.

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