Hunting for that special 4x5, my first LF camera

[justlikeswimming]

I love the look of your camera, beautiful! Thanks for bringing up a possible camera I perhaps discounted too soon...I've discovered there have been many past discussions about using monorails for field cameras, I'll visit those sites, thank you all!

[Bob Salomon]

Thanks r.e. for your comments and suggestions. As for my budget, I'm one of those ebayers buying old cameras that are in decent shape and getting by (many times the cameras are great, sometimes not). My budget is <$1000 for the camera and lens (I know, a tall order!).
I haven't really considered a monorail system because I was under the impression it can't broken down and placed in a backpack. If this can be done it may be an option for me. The monorails are selling for a lot less than the technical and field cameras, and they do appear very sturdy! I'll do more research to see if such a rig would work for me in the field - a bit more time with set-up is no problem for me, but I have to be able to haul it on the trails. Thanks so much for your comments, I'll research further!

While it is more then your budget, not all monorails can’t be broken down. The Technorama is a folding monorail.

[r.e.]

I haven't really considered a monorail system because I was under the impression it can't broken down and placed in a backpack. If this can be done it may be an option for me. The monorails are selling for a lot less than the technical and field cameras, and they do appear very sturdy! I'll do more research to see if such a rig would work for me in the field - a bit more time with set-up is no problem for me, but I have to be able to haul it on the trails. Thanks so much for your comments, I'll research further!

I love the look of your camera, beautiful! Thanks for bringing up a possible camera I perhaps discounted too soon...I've discovered there have been many past discussions about using monorails for field cameras, I'll visit those sites, thank you all!

An Arca-Swiss Discovery can not only be broken down for a backpack, it can be dismantled into its component parts. Arca-Swiss cameras are completely modular. While the parts aren't cheap, I can turn my Discovery into an 8x10 camera with up to 700mm of bellows in less than 10 minutes.

The problem is that Discoveries don't come up for sale often. The one for sale on the forum last week went very quickly. However, if you come across one, it's worth your consideration.

[CreationBear]

I haven't really considered a monorail system because I was under the impression it can't broken down and placed in a backpack

Depends on how big your pack is.

As r.e. mentioned, you can certainly carry a monorail on a short rail: that's how I roll with my Sinar Norma. The "undercarriage" (function carriers, rail clamp, etc.) gives it a bit more height than a folder in the same format, but it's extremely quick to set up. The other option (given a 4x5 and a "mansized" pack alluded to above) is to leave the camera on a longer rail and use a wastepaper basket or other rigid container so that the camera hangs upside down from a "cradle."

Otherwise, another option to put on your radar is the Linhof TK ("Technikardan") which combines the compactness of a folder with some of the advantages of a monorail. (FWIW, you might check out forum member Gabe's recent contribution to the "Landscape" thread that he made with his TK--it's a great example of using rear tilt out in the field. Again, you could probably do it with a Horseman, but not nearly as "organically" as with a monorail.)

[michaelfoto]

The Sinar F series is not that heavy and can be folded for transport in several different ways. It is also a perfect learners camera, as its easy to see the movements and their effects.

Transportklar til venstre og kampklar til højre. by Michael G, on Flickr

[Bernice Loui]

The current fashion and interest with those moving from roll film (35mm or 120) or digital has been vast majority focused on light weight field foldable view cameras. As a group, they tend to carry over their previous experiences with fixed-lens box based camera/lens and such to their view camera adventures not knowing the view camera is a very different item in many ways. Essentially, much of what was habituated does not apply when it comes to brand loyalty and lens choices and much more.

Given your interest in macro images and landscapes which appear to be of prime interest to many first venturing into the view camera stuff, a field foldable camera IS a significant limitation. Field foldables like the Toyo 45 (letter-series) and similar have very significant limitations on what lenses can be used. Cameras like these are happiest with lens focal lengths of 125mm to 210mm for normal image reproduction ratios (infinity to ~ some what less). Wide angle lenses are a problem, longer than normal focal lengths (tele) are a problem as would be macro due to the camera-bellows draw needed. Specifically, if you're wanting to apply a 180mm lens for "macro" images, close focus cannot be achieved as a shorter focal length lens becomes a must. With this enforces moving closer to the macro image subject.

If you're ok with being limited to lens focal lengths about 125mm to 210mm, the a camera like the Toyo 45 series could be good.

Essentially, image goals first, lenses required to achieve these image goals then camera to support these needs.

The long time completely biased option for a view camera would be Sinar. Sinar Norma or F for field and most "portable" image needs, Sinar P and similar for studio or similar indoor not really "portable" image needs. Take the time to read this previous discussion:
https://www.largeformatphotography.i...ar-Norma-(4x5)

And... monorail view cameras tend to be easier to learn how to "view camera" as they tend to be more and easily visible with simplified access to camera movement controls.

As for acquiring a view camera outfit for $1K or less, should not be that much of a problem even in these days of bursting view camera popularity, long as one stays away from fashionable internet driven camera-lens-etc choices. LFF does have a for sale classified section that can work good for wheeling-dealing.

Be ready to waste plenty of sheet film in the journey to learn how to view camera.


Bernice

As for my budget, I'm one of those ebayers buying old cameras that are in decent shape and getting by (many times the cameras are great, sometimes not). My budget is <$1000 for the camera and lens (I know, a tall order!).

I haven't really considered a monorail system because I was under the impression it can't broken down and placed in a backpack. If this can be done it may be an option for me. The monorails are selling for a lot less than the technical and field cameras, and they do appear very sturdy! I'll do more research to see if such a rig would work for me in the field - a bit more time with set-up is no problem for me, but I have to be able to haul it on the trails. Thanks so much for your comments, I'll research further!

[maltfalc]

4x5 macro is for hardcore masochists only. :P

[justlikeswimming]

Sinar monorails can be a lot faster to set up and shoot than a technical camera, but tend to take up more pack space if configured ready-to-go. I've worked with Sinars all along in the mountains, but not exclusively. The Sinar system is Wunderbar for closeup work.

Thanks Drew, I'll check out the Sinar as a possible camera to pack. It sounds like a great camera for macro!

[justlikeswimming]

Depends on how big your pack is.

As r.e. mentioned, you can certainly carry a monorail on a short rail: that's how I roll with my Sinar Norma. The "undercarriage" (function carriers, rail clamp, etc.) gives it a bit more height than a folder in the same format, but it's extremely quick to set up. The other option (given a 4x5 and a "mansized" pack alluded to above) is to leave the camera on a longer rail and use a wastepaper basket or other rigid container so that the camera hangs upside down from a "cradle."

Otherwise, another option to put on your radar is the Linhof TK ("Technikardan") which combines the compactness of a folder with some of the advantages of a monorail. (FWIW, you might check out forum member Gabe's recent contribution to the "Landscape" thread that he made with his TK--it's a great example of using rear tilt out in the field. Again, you could probably do it with a Horseman, but not nearly as "organically" as with a monorail.)

Thanks CreationBear, looks like my pack is going to get bigger! The options your present for carrying a monorail might work for me. Gabe's picture is wonderful!

[justlikeswimming]

The current fashion and interest with those moving from roll film (35mm or 120) or digital has been vast majority focused on light weight field foldable view cameras. As a group, they tend to carry over their previous experiences with fixed-lens box based camera/lens and such to their view camera adventures not knowing the view camera is a very different item in many ways. Essentially, much of what was habituated does not apply when it comes to brand loyalty and lens choices and much more.

Given your interest in macro images and landscapes which appear to be of prime interest to many first venturing into the view camera stuff, a field foldable camera IS a significant limitation. Field foldables like the Toyo 45 (letter-series) and similar have very significant limitations on what lenses can be used. Cameras like these are happiest with lens focal lengths of 125mm to 210mm for normal image reproduction ratios (infinity to ~ some what less). Wide angle lenses are a problem, longer than normal focal lengths (tele) are a problem as would be macro due to the camera-bellows draw needed. Specifically, if you're wanting to apply a 180mm lens for "macro" images, close focus cannot be achieved as a shorter focal length lens becomes a must. With this enforces moving closer to the macro image subject.

If you're ok with being limited to lens focal lengths about 125mm to 210mm, the a camera like the Toyo 45 series could be good.

Essentially, image goals first, lenses required to achieve these image goals then camera to support these needs.

The long time completely biased option for a view camera would be Sinar. Sinar Norma or F for field and most "portable" image needs, Sinar P and similar for studio or similar indoor not really "portable" image needs. Take the time to read this previous discussion:
https://www.largeformatphotography.i...ar-Norma-(4x5)

And... monorail view cameras tend to be easier to learn how to "view camera" as they tend to be more and easily visible with simplified access to camera movement controls.

As for acquiring a view camera outfit for $1K or less, should not be that much of a problem even in these days of bursting view camera popularity, long as one stays away from fashionable internet driven camera-lens-etc choices. LFF does have a for sale classified section that can work good for wheeling-dealing.

Be ready to waste plenty of sheet film in the journey to learn how to view camera.


Bernice

Thanks for you info, Bernice, and others! I'm seriously considering a monorail - much greater movements and control is definitely appealing! Certainly the boxy format of the technical cameras is less intimidating to me, probably a big factor in initially leaning in that direction. You folks are opening my eyes to new (and likely more rewarding) possibilities, thank you!