Wide Lenses for 4x5 & 8x10: 90mm to 165mm

[r.e.]

The 210mm f/4.5 Docter Optic is a classic Tessar formula lens, will be difficult to find unless one has been found...

Hi Bernice,

Thanks for your comments on some of my current lenses (post #32 and #36).

The 210mm f/4.5 Docter Optic isn't a 1970s or older Tessar. It was made in the 1990s and is in a Copal shutter. @Arne Croell wrote an excellent article about Docter Optic lenses called Large Format Lenses from Docter Optic 1991-1996. I got the lens from Kerry Thalmann, who was selling a number of new old stock Docter lenses.

I purchased the Nikkor macro lenses from B&H when Nikon was exiting the large format lens market. As you know, macro lenses versus standard and process lenses has been debated in many threads. The Nikons meet my needs.

The Fujinon C 600mm is just the ticket if you're in Brooklyn or Queens and want to photograph Manhattan across the East River.

[r.e.]

I've now had a look at older lenses in the range of 150mm to 180mm that will cover 8x10. These lenses fall into two categories.

First, there are lenses that cost more than a used modern lens would cost. I assume that the market is collectors and photographers who want a specific look. I don't see myself as a buyer of one of these lenses.

Secondly, there are lenses that cost less, perhaps quite a bit less, than a used modern lens. However, this is not the whole story on cost. These were workhorse lenses, and my working assumption is that I'll have to hire someone to clean, lubricate and adjust the lens and shutter and, if necessary, replace parts. I'm reluctant to purchase one of these lenses sight unseen, but in New York a vendor like Lens and Repro no longer exists. There may be a significant investment of time to identify a lens that I'm prepared to buy. The lens is likely to just cover 8x10 with little room, if any, for movements. I'd have to use the lens for one-off photographs because the "look" of the image will be different from my modern lenses. That doesn't work for my current project.

I've decided that I won't be adding one of these lenses to the 8x10 shortlist and chart in post #34.

[Bob Salomon]

I've now had a look at older lenses in the range of 150mm to 180mm that will cover 8x10. These lenses fall into two categories.

First, there are lenses that cost more than a used modern lens would cost. I assume that the market is collectors and photographers who want a specific look. I don't see myself as a buyer of one of these lenses.

Secondly, there are lenses that cost less, perhaps quite a bit less, than a used modern lens. However, this is not the whole story on cost. These were workhorse lenses, and my working assumption is that I'll have to hire someone to clean, lubricate and adjust the lens and shutter and, if necessary, replace parts. I'm reluctant to purchase one of these lenses sight unseen, but in New York a vendor like Lens and Repro no longer exists. There may be a significant investment of time to identify a lens that I'm prepared to buy. The lens is likely to just cover 8x10 with little room, if any, for movements. I'd have to use the lens for one-off photographs because the "look" of the image will be different from my modern lenses. That doesn't work for my current project.

I've decided that I won't be adding one of these lenses to the 8x10 shortlist and chart in post #34.

Have you tried Foto Care?

[r.e.]

Have you tried Foto Care?

Hi Bob. Thanks for the suggestion. Having just spoken with Foto Care, I'll be visiting them early next week.

Almost everybody here will know B&H and Adorama. Much less well-known is Foto Care. It's a New York camera store and rental house that's been in business for over 50 years and has a first-rate reputation. Think of a well-known New York photographer, and the odds are that they're a Foto Care customer.

I'd already been looking at Foto Care's rental inventory with a view to trying out one or more of the lenses on my shortlist. They offer the Schneider Super-Symmar XL 110mm, but not the 8x10 wide-angles.

Prompted by Bob's post, I phoned and asked whether they're still selling used large format lenses. I doubted it. Large format lenses, except in the rental side of the business, aren't even mentioned on Foto Care's website. I was wrong. They have two of the 8x10 lenses on hand. Odds are, they can get the Schneider 110mm in a reasonable time.

As a Foto Care customer over the years, including for a couple of used Leica lenses, I'm not expecting low prices. They may want more than I want to pay, but price isn't everything.

[Andrew O'Neill]

The widest lens I have for 4x5 is 90mm. For 8x10, I use Nikkor SW 120, W210, W240. I tend to use more wide lenses with 8x10, than I do with 4x5.

[Bernice Loui]

Got this, thanks for sharing.

Bernice

Hi Bernice,

Thanks for your comments on some of my current lenses (post #32 and #36).

The 210mm f/4.5 Docter Optic isn't a 1970s or older Tessar. It was made in the 1990s and is in a Copal shutter. @Arne Croell wrote an excellent article about Docter Optic lenses called Large Format Lenses from Docter Optic 1991-1996. I got the lens from Kerry Thalmann, who was selling a number of new old stock Docter lenses.

I purchased the Nikkor macro lenses from B&H when Nikon was exiting the large format lens market. As you know, macro lenses versus standard and process lenses has been debated in many threads. The Nikons meet my needs.

The Fujinon C 600mm is just the ticket if you're in Brooklyn or Queens and want to photograph Manhattan across the East River.

[Bernice Loui]

IMO, very short list for ~150mm lens for 8x10 would be the 150mm f5.6 SSXL. They have now become pricy and in demand likely due to the current fashion of 8x10 sheet film.

Notable, back when Schneider first announced the pre-order for the Super Symmar XL series, $ difference between the 110mm -vs- 150mm was about $300. Add to this Schneider had a trade in your "old" lens for a 20% discount of a new lens. This was also applied when the 72mm SAXL, 110mm SSXL and 150mm SSXL was purchased. No regrets for that purchase to this day as all three has served far better than ever expected.

Do use a 165mm f6.8 Angulon in barrel as an easy to carry around moderate wide for the 5x7 Norma. Optical performance is tolerable and ok enough. IMO, give the option of a single wide angle, pick the 150mm f5.6 SSXL if possible.. It is THAT good.


Bernice

I've now had a look at older lenses in the range of 150mm to 180mm that will cover 8x10. These lenses fall into two categories.

First, there are lenses that cost more than a used modern lens would cost. I assume that the market is collectors and photographers who want a specific look. I don't see myself as a buyer of one of these lenses.

Secondly, there are lenses that cost less, perhaps quite a bit less, than a used modern lens. However, this is not the whole story on cost. These were workhorse lenses, and my working assumption is that I'll have to hire someone to clean, lubricate and adjust the lens and shutter and, if necessary, replace parts. I'm reluctant to purchase one of these lenses sight unseen, but in New York a vendor like Lens and Repro no longer exists. There may be a significant investment of time to identify a lens that I'm prepared to buy. The lens is likely to just cover 8x10 with little room, if any, for movements. I'd have to use the lens for one-off photographs because the "look" of the image will be different from my modern lenses. That doesn't work for my current project.

I've decided that I won't be adding one of these lenses to the 8x10 shortlist and chart in post #34.

[r.e.]

This is my final shortlist. As noted earlier, this is either 4x5 or 8x10, not both, at least for now.

4x5

Schneider Super-Symmar XL f/5.6 110mm

8x10/4x10

For 8x10, I'm listing the lenses in order of preference rather than eliminating lenses from consideration. The preferences take into account the factors discussed in post #38. To quote from that post: "I'd like to make a definitive choice between the four 8x10 wide-angle lenses ..., but I think that the decision depends a lot on what comes up on the used market. Prices for these lenses appear to be all over the map. In September, a copy of the 155mm Rodenstock Grandagon-N, in what appears to be excellent condition, sold on eBay for US$675. To my mind, that's attractive..."

150mm Schneider Super-Symmar XL f/5.6
150mm Nikon Nikkor SW f/8
155mm Rodenstock Grandagon-N f/6.8
165mm Schneider Super-Angulon f/8

Thanks for all the comments. They helped a lot with sorting through the options.

EDIT: I've attached a new version of my Chart, limited to these lenses, in post #52 below.

[Peter De Smidt]

That's a great list.

[Tin Can]

I like my Nikkor 120 for 8X10

Very good in studio

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ...120mm_f_8.html