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Thread: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

  1. #21

    Join Date
    Jan 2002
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    Besançon, France
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    1,599

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Could this be done on an Arca Swiss ...

    Of course, within the Arca Swiss system, be it a pre-1982 Oschwald system or the current F-line system, you can connect as many rails together as you wish, throught the telescopic rail system. Rail elements of about 1 metre long are listed on the current catalogue.
    And you can add any intermediate format frames and bellows ;-)

  2. #22

    Join Date
    Jun 2021
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    16

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg View Post
    With a good level to accurately confirm their alignment, easy to replace. Just beware of cheap rip-offs that are not accurate (not usable) or the holes for the screws will not align with the holes on the Sinar (doable/fixable). http://www.glennview.com/ has them but they are not cheap... I've seen them up on auction for under $10.00. "You get what you pay for" a good adage to apply here. I once bought a broken standard for little money just to reuse the two OEM bubble levels. Two of the OEM bubble levels on my Norma are "cloudy" from age but still work fine.
    Yikes, 50$ for a bubble level

  3. #23

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    I have three 4x5 Normas. I have four 5x7 Normas. I have one 8x10 Norma. It's cheaper to buy complete 4x5 front or rear standards or complete 4x5 Normas when you need parts. I have been equipping my studio man cave. I bought a few parts from the repair dept but that option is long gone.

    30+ years ago I bought my first 4x5 Norma for $1500 from Columbus Camera Group. It has always served me well and I soon realized that stuff could be had reasonably, and if you have the catalog, then it becomes like collecting anything. Just wait for a particular item to come along.

    Julius Shulman, Balthazar Korab, Ezra Stoller, Heidrich Blessing, Reinhardt Wolf, they all used Norma for obvious reasons. Best camera for location Architectural. Not too heavy to hike with, ask me how I know When I get to where I am going, I'm glad the Norma is with me.

    I started with Sinar Alpina, hated that camera! Went to F+ and not solid enough for my tastes overall. Too much plastic! Then I discovered the Norma.

    A good repairperson can make any Norma good as new. They can be busted and I have examples! Philip Morgan has the guide that I use and there is a lot you can do to tune it up without taking it -completely- apart. Plenty of Normas work OK just as they are, depends on how they were used and stored.
    “The secret of getting ahead is getting started.”
    ― Mark Twain

  4. #24
    Scott Davis
    Join Date
    May 2002
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    Washington DC
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    1,775

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernice Loui View Post
    5x7 Sinar Norma lives in a Pelican FAA carry-on approved roller case with four lenses (115mm Grandagon, 165mm Angulon, 10" or 12" Xenar or Kodak C. Ektar, ~one of the four barrel lenses gets picked depending on what is needed~, 16 1/2" or 19" APO artar), bag & standard bellows, Sinar shutter, light meter, 7x loupe, tape measure, dark cloth, cable release, six 5x7 or 13x18cm film holders.
    Bernice
    Which Pelican case do you use, if you know the model #? I would like something like that to be able to transport my Norma easily.

  5. #25

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Sinar Norma Price List July 1966 1 by Nokton48, on Flickr

    Sinar Norma Price List July 1966 2 by Nokton48, on Flickr

    "Construction Unit Design" allows you to build whatever you need to do a particular job
    “The secret of getting ahead is getting started.”
    ― Mark Twain

  6. #26
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    Apr 2009
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    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    I align myself fully with Bernice’s comments.

    The first camera I used with a 90mm lens of enough coverage to allow movements was a Cambo SC (in Calumet trim). I needed a recessed lens board and a bag bellows, and it was inconvenient to use. But it worked, and this was back when a Sinar was a fantasy camera for me. A 65mm lens is less workable, but I didn’t have a 65mm lens capable of movements (a 65/5.6 Super Angulon—not the f/8 version which barely covers 4x5) until I had a camera that could mount it reasonably for use in the real world.

    And that was a Sinar F. No recessed lens boards required. I have fat fingers, and I hate recessed lens boards with some passion.

    The real choice here is monorail or folder? That depends on the use case. The only advantage a folder has is portability (in terms of stored compactness, and to a lesser extent in terms of weight). If I was backpacking with a camera, I’d prefer a folding field camera and would simply limit my lenses and composition possibilities to what worked.

    For interiors, though, the constraints are external and the equipment has to have the features that serve within those constraints. A good modular monorail is that camera.

    The Norma was the first practical monorail. If bought for cheap, a Norma will require some restoration but it’s worth the effort. (Restoring some cameras will have you chasing your tail and wondering when it will end.)

    But a later Sinar will also function beautifully and is probably the best balance between first-rate mechanics and price. And they are still restorable and worth the effort. Arca and Linhof are in the same category, but without the wide availability of inexpensive used bits that all interchange, and they are more expensive to begin with because of their boutique status.

    I am biased—I own an F/F2 and a P. My F2 is a mashup of several cameras bought at junk prices and assembled into a camera that had my preferred features. I prefer the F back, because it’s thinner in that it doesn’t have the slot for the meter probe. But I prefer the F2 front that separates lateral shift and swing locking levers.

    My F lives in the Sinar Expert flight-style case to which I added luggage wheels and a handle. I pulled it behind me across Nantucket with its wavy brick streets and crowds. It worked in that scenario. But it’s no backpacking camera. It could be made much more compact, however.

    My P lives in its original fiberboard Expert case, and I stay closer to the car with it.

    For architectural interiors, I would require easy use of a 65mm lens, bag bellows that allow easy shifting with a 65mm lens (for Sinar, that’s the Wide Angle Bellows 2), and access to lens controls and visibility of settings in dim conditions (read: that 65mm lens on a flat lens board).

    Using a rollfilm format imposes similar requirements on the use of shorter lenses. I have used my F with a 6x12 back and a 47mm Super Angulon—surely a combination few 4x5 field folders could support.

    Rick “there is no single best camera for every use case” Denney

  7. #27

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    “The secret of getting ahead is getting started.”
    ― Mark Twain

  8. #28

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Second Fastest Sinar Norma 2 by Nokton48, on Flickr

    There is an automatic shutter in the back and a shutter in the front interconnected by coiled metal cables. Very quick to operate I can tell you

    This setup is in the Norma catalog. 5x7 Rear Standard with 4x5 Adapter stepdown adds a lot of rigidity. Usable in high winds as tested by me

    Brand new never used modern FOBA ALFAE tripod, this is one of the best of the best. Lightweight yet brick solid
    “The secret of getting ahead is getting started.”
    ― Mark Twain

  9. #29

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    2,512

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Do not purchase there. ~Seller Profit Center Warning~

    The replacement levels are 7mm diameter x 16mm long. Available from Geier and Bluhm as part# 3-0507 in NYC for $1.39 USD each:
    https://www.geier-bluhm.com/products...-vials/3-0507/

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Amazon, for $1.00 each, 10pc for 10 USD.
    https://www.amazon.com/Acrylic-Bubbl.../dp/B08CZD59RN

    Do a web search as 7mm x 16mm round levels are an industry standard item.

    To replace the level. Remove the two screws holding the level on the small plate. Put the dry and defective level into a small vise to hold the defective level,
    push the holder plate with a light tap from a small hammer and punch on the surface away from the two mounting holes. The levels are glued on to the mounting plate. More often than not, the glue has lost it's grip over the decades and usually parts easy from the level.

    Clean off the residual glue and plastic bits with a file or scraper. It is possible to clean off the white paint on the opposite side of the level mounting plate for re-paint or easier to more white paint as touch up or easier still is to leave it alone (lowest damage risk). Add a tiny amount of cyanoacrylate adhesive aka "super glue" to the level mount plate, press on the new level, done.


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by Times2 View Post
    Yikes, 50$ for a bubble level

  10. #30

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    2,512

    Re: Sinar F2 Vs Sinar Norma (4x5)

    Yes, but at what cost and availability of monorail camera accessories to do this?

    For Sinar, there are plenty of extension rails, bellows, standards ( on the used market due the vast volume of Sinar stuff sold over the decades) of any Sinar variety can be used as intermediate bellows support making an absurdly long view camera easy to accomplish at modest cost.

    That said, still own an Arca Swiss 6x9 view camera system (been and done Arca Swiss monorail system and Linhof both Technika and monorail system).. Will NEVER part with it as it is the nicest 6x9 view camera made and to use. This coupled with a Linhof Rapid Rollex 120 roll film holder makes an extremely nice 120 roll film camera system in every way. Tops the all the fixed box 120 cameras as this Arca Swiss view camera system has capabilities far beyond any box based 120 roll film camera.


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by Emmanuel BIGLER View Post
    Could this be done on an Arca Swiss ...

    Of course, within the Arca Swiss system, be it a pre-1982 Oschwald system or the current F-line system, you can connect as many rails together as you wish, throught the telescopic rail system. Rail elements of about 1 metre long are listed on the current catalogue.
    And you can add any intermediate format frames and bellows ;-)

    Bob Salomon
    "Yes, LInhof could and do that long extension. Sold a system to Dixie cup to do 1:1 on 810 with a 420mm or 480 with extension left over."


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