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Thread: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

  1. #11

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Thanks for all the replies. It seems pretty much like I expected, that it does not seem like it would work. Good to know without wasting the film.

  2. #12

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Quote Originally Posted by robertraymer View Post
    Thanks for all the replies. It seems pretty much like I expected, that it does not seem like it would work. Good to know without wasting the film.
    If you search around the used market, at one time there were registration film holders. Might be hard to find though. Condit made one. This is sort of a different topic though.

    What I would say about your specific thought experiment is that even if you had a way of making it work, it would not add any value. Among other issues, for film masks to be of any use you must be able to control the amount of exposure the mask film gets, independent of the exposure the primary film gets. Therefore making both a good negative/positive and a useful mask with one exposure and two sandwiched pieces of film is essentially impossible.

    With digital image editing software you can do all of this better with just the negative or positive anyway.

  3. #13

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Each film holder holds one sheet of film per film holder side. Two sheets of film in one side of the film holder... Not gonna work.
    Sorta exposure on the bottom sheet with lots of light scatter caused by the top sheet and more.

    Bad idea.
    Bernice

  4. #14

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vaughn View Post
    I believe you could wash the anti-halation layer off the film in the dark, dry in the dark, then use it in the camera (would only have to be top one of the two sheets).
    That's what I'd recommend too. Black and white film in front with the anti-halation layer stripped and inserted backwards so the two emulsions are in direct contact at the correct depth with a higher iso for the colour film .

  5. #15
    Vaughn's Avatar
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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Quote Originally Posted by maltfalc View Post
    That's what I'd recommend too. Black and white film in front with the anti-halation layer stripped and inserted backwards so the two emulsions are in direct contact at the correct depth with a higher iso for the colour film .
    Neat improvement over what I was thinking...love both the emulsion-to-emulsion, and using a slow over fast film to balance the exposures! Will not be sharp, but a wonderful concept for someone else to play with.
    "Landscapes exist in the material world yet soar in the realms of the spirit..." Tsung Ping, 5th Century China

  6. #16

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    I would think between the refraction index of the film base and the extra distance to the second sheet of film, you'd get a very poorly focused image.

    Easier to lock down the tripod and take two images in succession.

  7. #17
    http://www.spiritsofsilver.com tgtaylor's Avatar
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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    I use Toyo View holders for 4x5 and Toyo View and Fidelity Elite's for 8x10 and neither holder's end flap will close with 2 sheets of typical film inserted. Maybe with ultra thin film like Rollei 400 IR but not with regular film like Kodak or Ilford.

    Thomas

  8. #18

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    I don't know about your holders, but mine (all of them, Riteway, Lisco, Fidelity, old wooden Graphic holders, etc.) won't accommodate two sheets of film on one side; they just don't fit under the hold-down rails.

    I don't think my films are thicker than anyone else's...

    OP, even if you could do that, the first sheet will block most of the light (even if you removed the anti-halation layer, the emulsion itself is fairly opaque). The bottom sheet would be tremendously underexposed.

    Maybe if you used ISO 25 film for the top sheet and ISO 800 for the bottom one....?

    Best,

    Doremus

  9. #19

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    Quote Originally Posted by robertraymer View Post
    The idea was to have them be exactly the same is that I could overlay them and have them be perfectly registered. Even if I shot them from opposite sides of the holder in quick succession there would be enough subject movement that the registration would be off.
    then shoot the color , scan, output as black and white on clear print film (OHP). Alt process people do this all the time and have registration tools to align everything.
    Adventure is worthwhile in itself. ... Never interrupt someone doing what you said couldn't be done. -- Amelia Earhart
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  10. #20

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    Re: 2 sheets of film in the same holder?

    another quick point that may make this less possible--I was loading sheets the other day (Bergger 400)and I was having an impossible time getting the film to slide in place. I was getting really frustrated, so I put the sheet back in the box and closed it up, then turned on the light--there was already a sheet loaded. That suggest to me that if you are using film with a thicker base (most of the more standard films) there isa good chance you won't be able to load two sheets. Now the Rollei IR I loaded was so thin, I'd hesitate to use it on 8x10 since I think it would just fall out. If ou put two sheets of Rollei or one super thin sheet and one normal sheet, they migh fit, but one sheet of Ektar and one sheet of Delta are pretty likely to not fit, or at least would be difficult to load.

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