Just finished my darkroom, and I'm getting back into serious printing. I'm working with Ilford Multicontrast Classic FB. And I'm looking for input from people toning this paper in selenium (specifically Kodak Rapid Selenium Toner). My current practice is to use PF Liquidol developer, and after the second fixer, tone in a 1:25 solution of KRST. Anyone working similarly- what's your recipe?
I’ve been using KRST at 1:10 for two minutes for MG Classic. This was after testing per Fred Newman’s procedures shown in his YouTube video. Toning longer at this concentration resulted in reduced DMAX print density.
Keith Pitman
Depends what you are looking for in terms of colour shift, everyone sees differently etc etc as you know. The developer can change the way the paper subsequently tones, so take my notes with a grain of salt as I use Dektol. My preference is to tone MG Classic FB to just “neutralize” it, which for me is KRST 1+30 for 5 minutes.
Originally Posted by Mark Sampson
Depends on how much color change is desired in the finished print. Do keep in mind bring dry down change before selenium toning.
One way to deal with this is to make the finished print dry. Evaluate the finished dry print for acceptability, then re-soak for toning as needed.
The print will need to be washed post ST.
Bernice
Good points all. I haven't made any prints for a couple of years, so I have to re-train my eye. The MG Classic seems quite neutral; and I can't see any color shift between a final print and a fixed, but untoned, test print. I suppose I'm looking for a bit of warmth... the paper's dMax seems quite acceptable and there's no green in it, so that's good. I'll just have to make more prints- I am enjoying seeing work that has existed only as negatives until now.
1:20, generally very briefly (15 sec to 1 min). It tends to tone rather quickly. I'm not after a conspicuous overall brown.
I just posted this in another thread about dilutions, but it's relevant here too, so I'll just cut and paste. (I just love quoting myself)
"I'm going to tell you you're wasting your time toning your prints in a given dilution for a given amount of time.
You simply will not get the same result over time doing this. Every print through the toner weakens it somewhat. As more prints go through, the activity decreases. After 10 or so prints through a normal amount of toning solution, print 10 is not nearly as fully-toned as print one in the same amount of time.
The actual amount of toning is what matters, and that is only practically controllable by visually evaluating your prints. Keep in mind, that if you're not getting any visible tone change or any perceptible change in densities, you're not toning, or you're toning so little as to make no difference.
My advice: Tone till you get the desired image change. If toning times are too fast, dilute your working solution till times are more comfortable and vice-versa. Keep an untoned print wet and easily viewable under the same lighting so you can monitor the progress of the toning. Tone till you get what you want and note the time. You can use this time for the next couple of prints to get the same effect for prints of the same image on the same paper, but don't think you can use it for many more than that or for prints of other images.
Every print has a different distribution of densities and tones differently visually. Some prints need a bit more toning, some a bit less to "feel right."
If you're toning for "permanence," forget it. It's been fairly-well established that any degree of protection that selenium toning gives is proportional to the amount of toning. Toning for X minutes in a 1:X dilution and getting no visible change gives you zero protection. And, not many of us want to fully-tone a print in selenium; we usually just want a hint of that purplish-red to counteract the unpleasant tone of the paper or to lend the print a little warmth. Not many want to see bright red or fully light-brown prints. So, we're only getting partial protection anyway. The best way to ensure the longevity of your prints is proper fixation and washing.
I've got two jugs of toner, one labeled "weak" and one labeled "strong." I'm not sure what the actual dilutions are, just that some papers tone rather quickly and I can work more comfortably with weaker toner and some papers need a rather strong toner to get any reaction in a reasonable amount of time. When my toning times get too long, I add some concentrate to the working solution replenish it and boost its activity.
If you haven't seen all (or some) of my posts on replenishing and reusing selenium toner, do a search on my name and the site and you'll find them easily."
About MG classic FB in selenium: I like it really well, I use my "weak" solution and times of 4-5 minutes (or less, depending on the image). This paper tends to tone toward brown and not as purplish as some (I really liked the old Oriental Seagull G... sigh...). Anyway, I don't like too much brown, so I tone only lightly; just enough to give the prints some warmth and counteract the greenish tint of the paper.
Hope this helps,
Doremus
If all you want is warmth then Selenium isn't going to do that. It will make it more purple-ish. However if you bleach MGFBC then redevelop in weak developer (if your normal dev is 1:1 then use it 1:5 for redeveloper) you will get a warmer tone away from the neutral-gray-green of untoned. If you use Pyrocat as your second developer 2:2:100 you can even stain the paper a bit and get warm - olive tones. Since you are redeveloping with weak dilutions allow longer than normal. It may go muddy for a few minutes but will clear when development is done.
Cut a sheet of already developed in half so you can see the difference. Here is an experiment I did with Ansco 130 as first developer then bleach/redeveloped using Pyrcat M https://www.searing.photography/pyro...ass-developer/
The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.
http://www.searing.photography
I also print on Ilford VCFB Classic, and my technique is the one Bernice posted above, let the prints dry without toning, evaluate, choose the ones to tone, and then I tone a batch say 4 or 5 at once. The prints for toning sit in my washer for a while to re-soak, then I shuffle them in the toner tray, and when the tone looks right to me (just starting to turn towards purple) that print goes into a tray of Permawash for a couple of minutes and then into the washer for a full 30-minute wash. As Doremus's post notes, different prints tone at different times because the dark areas are the ones that tone, and the distribution of brights and darks differs by print. The one thing no one has mentioned is that toner works faster if heated, so I heat my toner slightly in its storage bottle before using. After each session I pour the used selenium toner back into the storage bottle through a coffee filter inside a large funnel. (Long ago Fred Picker pointed out that if you keep the wash-aid separate from the toner, the toner solution lasts a very long time.) Again, as Doremus pointed out, the toner weakens with use, so periodically I add a little fresh toner to the solution. Since I am toning by eye, not time, I no longer know the actual dilution.
Mark, since you indicated you are looking for a little warmth, you might prefer a warm tone developer for some subtle shifts.
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