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Thread: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

  1. #41
    Tin Can's Avatar
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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Paul , I will standardize asap

    As always

    Thanks for the reply
    Tin Can

  2. #42

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Can View Post
    Paul , I will standardize asap

    As always

    Thanks for the reply
    Happy to be of service. I’m available to answer questions as they arise!

  3. #43

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tin Can View Post
    Good to know

    I am waiting for the Quinn book ordered from Amazon 5 days ago, must be print to order and maybe have it June 5th

    I am one of Amazon's best customers, since...no data...
    I doubt Quinn's 2020 edition Amazon is offering is "print on demand" since the item sis stated as being "in stock" for immediate shipping.

  4. #44

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Quote Originally Posted by paulbarden View Post
    Hi Drew, sorry I missed your questions yesterday!

    1. recommended developing time for negatives: I see you are using the Bostick & Sullivan kit, and I recall that it includes its house brand of developer concentrate, yes? I used to use it, but I don't remember the dilution and development times. I do know it recommended a much longer development time for both positives and negatives than a standard recipe dictates. They recommend up to 60 seconds for positives, right? Something like that. The thing is, the B&S developer uses both Glacial Acetic Acid and Sugar as restrainers, so it can be on the plate far longer than what you would do with a standard developer. If I remember correctly, I found 30 seconds for positives was ideal with the B&S recipe, and at least 60 seconds for negatives. These days I make up developers from scratch, because there are circumstances where you need to tweak the formula to get best results (in warmer weather, for example: you need more restrainer). But there's nothing wrong with the B&S developer. I suggest you follow their instructions, but lean toward the shorter times.

    2. Exposure times: You need to find your own method for determining exposure times. A lot depends on what lenses you use, etc., and your exposure technique has to be tailored to your equipment. But I can tell you this: I gave up trying to use a light meter two years ago. The best thing is to learn to make informed guesses. You can either make a "test strip" plate first, if you are really unfamiliar with the lighting conditions, or simply take a guess, make the plate, and then evaluate it and adjust for the next plate. I've never made portraits in full sun (I dislike the light qualities), and in open north shade I find I typically get exposures between 5 and 30 seconds with a lens in the f3.5 to f5.0 range. Trial and error will get you acquainted with exposures!

    3. Developing negatives: You will have a bit of leeway when developing negatives, since there is more restrainer/less FeSO4 in a negative developer, and that lets you leave the developer on the plate longer, if needed. With the developer formula I generally use, it lets me develop a good plate in as little as 30 seconds, or as long as 90 seconds, but I generally aim for 60. Is it a good idea to standardize your development time for negatives, and adjust exposure to fit? Yes, definitely. If you start out using the same "middle ground" development time every plate, and adjust exposure to fit that time, you will learn how to produce consistent work far faster than someone who is always adjusting development to fit the exposure.

    I think you'll find you learn more and advance your technique faster if you stick with the optimal development time, and make everything else fit that time.
    I look forward to seeing your work. That Tessar will be a pleasure to work with!

    Paul


    Thank you for your detailed reply, Paul ... GREATLY appreciated!!
    * I will lock in a development time and progress from there!
    * One of your comments in reply to Tin Can's question earlier today about the B&S supplies was particularly enlightening as I am using a B&S kit with developer diluted 1:5 for negatives as per their directions along with their collodion mixture.
    I have been having trouble seeing ANY image come up at times ... so I just kept increasing exposure and/or increasing development time. Of course, this effort has not been productive and served only to confuse me!
    Good to know that that is a characteristic of the B&S Ol' Workhorse Collodion.
    * Does the Coffer Ol' Workhorse Collodion perform in this way as well or is the recipe somehow different??
    * Which of the many Collodion recipes out there are best suited for NEGATIVES? Coffer #7? Jacobson "negative" formula? UVP - xxx? I shoot with natural light only, 80% in open shade/North sky light.
    THANK YOU !!
    Drew

  5. #45

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    The issue of an image not appearing very much is not related to the formula. It's related to how old the formula is, as well as possibly how old it's component raw collodion. I've seen this many times before (no pun) with my own home made Old Workhorse. It will show a strong, vivid blue image under development when it is fresh. 3-4 months later it's dim. A few months later you have to just guess when to stop. But the image quality is about the same. I don't know why this happens, but by the time it does for me, I know my exposure times and it's not an issue. But trust me, if you make a batch with fresh collodion and when it's just beginning to ripen (2 weeks is prime), it will show a very strong image developing. Here is some of my fresh Old Workhorse:



    In a nutshell - they sent you an old batch (or the two parts have old collodion in Part A), or it got too aged. B&S makes great kits though, I reviewed them a few years ago for an article.

    There are tricks to revive it...too much to go into here. Also, keep it cold when not being used. It only lasts a few weeks at room temp, but can last a year if kept cold.

  6. #46

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Quote Originally Posted by drewf64 View Post
    Thank you for your detailed reply, Paul ... GREATLY appreciated!!
    * I will lock in a development time and progress from there!
    * One of your comments in reply to Tin Can's question earlier today about the B&S supplies was particularly enlightening as I am using a B&S kit with developer diluted 1:5 for negatives as per their directions along with their collodion mixture.
    I have been having trouble seeing ANY image come up at times ... so I just kept increasing exposure and/or increasing development time. Of course, this effort has not been productive and served only to confuse me!
    Good to know that that is a characteristic of the B&S Ol' Workhorse Collodion.
    * Does the Coffer Ol' Workhorse Collodion perform in this way as well or is the recipe somehow different??
    * Which of the many Collodion recipes out there are best suited for NEGATIVES? Coffer #7? Jacobson "negative" formula? UVP - xxx? I shoot with natural light only, 80% in open shade/North sky light.
    THANK YOU !!
    Drew
    Hi Drew, good to hear from you!
    Old Workhorse, no matter who makes it, is the same recipe and it behaves the same way whether you make it yourself (I do this) IR buy it from any one of several suppliers. It is just an unfortunate trait of this recipe. I used to find it very frustrating, watching for signs of shadow development, but then I just standardized the development time and things started to become clear.

    Negative collodion recipes: I’ve used Coffer’s #7 and Quinn’s Negative Collodion. Both work very well. I’ve found that Coffer’s #7 ages very quickly and is much more inclined to produce unwanted artifacts around the plate edges once its 4-6 weeks old (and older). That may or may not be a problem, depending on your goals. Quinn’s recipe lasts much longer, is cheaper to make (fewer salts) and appears to have very similar traits to Coffer’s #7. You could easily choose either and get satisfactory results.
    Since I always have some Old Workhorse available, I sometimes use that fir making negatives: it’s perfectly suitable for that, though John Coffer says that it makes a “softer” (less contrasty) negative than a formula specifically for negatives. In my experience, the differences are subtle. I have made many excellent negatives with Old Workhorse that I often redevelop or intensify as a final step.

    Quote Originally Posted by goamules View Post
    The issue of an image not appearing very much is not related to the formula. It's related to how old the formula is, as well as possibly how old it's component raw collodion. I've seen this many times before (no pun) with my own home made Old Workhorse. It will show a strong, vivid blue image under development when it is fresh. 3-4 months later it's dim. A few months later you have to just guess when to stop. But the image quality is about the same. I don't know why this happens, but by the time it does for me, I know my exposure times and it's not an issue. But trust me, if you make a batch with fresh collodion and when it's just beginning to ripen (2 weeks is prime), it will show a very strong image developing.

    In a nutshell - they sent you an old batch (or the two parts have old collodion in Part A), or it got too aged. B&S makes great kits though, I reviewed them a few years ago for an article.
    I don't disagree with Garrett, but my own experience has not been much like his. I've made Old Workhorse from scratch myself, and the developing image is difficult to see (compared to many other recipes) no matter how new or old it is. Yes, it gets worse as the collodion ages, but I have not found it to be great even when quite fresh. Maybe its the developer recipe I use, I don't know. As I said, its not a major flaw and shouldn't deter people from using it. But if you prefer to work by being able to SEE the image forming on the plate as the developer does its job, then Old Workhorse may not be your best choice. My opinion, of course. YMMV

    As regards the B&S collodion: they state on their web site about their Old Workhorse "We pre-mix this collodion and let it age for a couple of days before sending it out." I've bought it from them in my starter kit, and after the first batch got used up, and I can attest to the fact that what they ship is quite well aged, not just "a few days old": its deep red, which signifies that it has aged for (probably) a month or more. So unless their kits have changed significantly in the past three years, you can expect your Old Workhorse collodion is going to be quite ripe and will be difficult to judge by visual development.

  7. #47
    Tin Can's Avatar
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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Addendum...............Amazon is fast, the hydrometer I ordered Saturday is here now

    The Quinn book just shipped now from South Carolina to be delivered Friday

    That’s 7 days to ship an ‘in stock’ item

    Who knows, it is coming...

    I have made 82 orders in 6 months from old buddy Amazon

    Most were very fast



    Quote Originally Posted by paulbarden View Post
    I doubt Quinn's 2020 edition Amazon is offering is "print on demand" since the item sis stated as being "in stock" for immediate shipping.
    Last edited by Tin Can; 2-Jun-2020 at 11:48. Reason: Addendum
    Tin Can

  8. #48
    Bill
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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    I have a question regarding some intermittent soapy looking artifacts on my positive plates, made with the BS kit and trophy aluminium, such as on the two attached images. I'd appreciate any insight into what causes these. Thanks.
    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	204405Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	204406

  9. #49

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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    Quote Originally Posted by paulbarden View Post
    Hi Drew, good to hear from you!
    Old Workhorse, no matter who makes it, is the same recipe and it behaves the same way whether you make it yourself (I do this) IR buy it from any one of several suppliers. It is just an unfortunate trait of this recipe. I used to find it very frustrating, watching for signs of shadow development, but then I just standardized the development time and things started to become clear.

    Negative collodion recipes: I’ve used Coffer’s #7 and Quinn’s Negative Collodion. Both work very well. I’ve found that Coffer’s #7 ages very quickly and is much more inclined to produce unwanted artifacts around the plate edges once its 4-6 weeks old (and older). That may or may not be a problem, depending on your goals. Quinn’s recipe lasts much longer, is cheaper to make (fewer salts) and appears to have very similar traits to Coffer’s #7. You could easily choose either and get satisfactory results.
    Since I always have some Old Workhorse available, I sometimes use that fir making negatives: it’s perfectly suitable for that, though John Coffer says that it makes a “softer” (less contrasty) negative than a formula specifically for negatives. In my experience, the differences are subtle. I have made many excellent negatives with Old Workhorse that I often redevelop or intensify as a final step.



    I don't disagree with Garrett, but my own experience has not been much like his. I've made Old Workhorse from scratch myself, and the developing image is difficult to see (compared to many other recipes) no matter how new or old it is. Yes, it gets worse as the collodion ages, but I have not found it to be great even when quite fresh. Maybe its the developer recipe I use, I don't know. As I said, its not a major flaw and shouldn't deter people from using it. But if you prefer to work by being able to SEE the image forming on the plate as the developer does its job, then Old Workhorse may not be your best choice. My opinion, of course. YMMV

    As regards the B&S collodion: they state on their web site about their Old Workhorse "We pre-mix this collodion and let it age for a couple of days before sending it out." I've bought it from them in my starter kit, and after the first batch got used up, and I can attest to the fact that what they ship is quite well aged, not just "a few days old": its deep red, which signifies that it has aged for (probably) a month or more. So unless their kits have changed significantly in the past three years, you can expect your Old Workhorse collodion is going to be quite ripe and will be difficult to judge by visual development.
    Hello Garrett & Paul:

    Thank you both for your insight and replies .... greatly appreciated and needed!!
    You have both provided very valuable & interesting information.
    I received and mixed the B&S kit about 4 weeks ago. The collodion was "straw yellow" on day one, became a deeper yellow after two weeks, and now, at four weeks, it is golden. No red.
    Developer is diluted 1:5 as per their recipe for negatives.
    The few times that I did get faint images were a few days ago and two weeks ago.
    For the last two sessions I mixed fresh 1:5 developer and slightly used 1:5 developer (4-5 plates thru) 50 / 50. I do not see that this resulted in any increase in density on a finished negative plate and I had limited visibility of the density of the plate during development.
    I have poured and developed 35 plates (4.5 x 6.5 inches) over this period, roughly four plates each session for 8 sessions.
    The Collodion was pale yellow on day 1; deep yellow after two weeks; and golden now after a total of four weeks.
    I am planning to lock in my NEGATIVE development time at two minutes and make a bunch of plates. Sound reasonable to you?
    Need to cut another batch of glass down to size first!
    Again .......... THANK YOU for your interest and assistance!
    Drew

  10. #50
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    Re: Wet Plate Collodion questions answered here.

    I've been keeping my collodion in a refrigerator and not had a problem. When out in the field and temp is over 75 I keep an ice pack in the cooler bag that has my chemicals. So, what's a good commercially available collodion for negatives?


    Kent in SD
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    Notte e di vogliam passar!

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