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Thread: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

  1. #31

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by LabRat View Post
    Or more simply, there's Steve's rule;

    "If in doubt, try it out"... ;-)

    Steve K

    Yes... taking a 35mm roll, spot metering and bracketing. That's all.


    ______________________________

    Anyway, if someone still thinks that Ektar has to be shot like Provia because having similar latitude, here we have a sample:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    http://www.lettherebefilm.com/exposures

    Interneg: no problem with Ektar shot +3. Ektar having to be exposed like Provia is a urban tale. Shot some Ektar and bracket it, and you won't have to guess.

  2. #32

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Pere: rather than using the weird force-corrected colour of a minilab (which have issues with Ektar anyway) to tautologically keep making the same mistakes of understanding, the situation is that if you expose your Ektar film to protect your highlights (like a transparency), you will see deeper into the shadows than most transparencies can, but if you are dealing with a longer SBR, then your deep shadows have to be left to go where they will (like a transparency), unless you have ND grads or can light the shadows at the time of exposure. Otherwise you will run into crossover problems, which while you may like the effects, are not representative of the intended colour of Ektar.

  3. #33

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernice Loui View Post
    Back in those days of do by film, do it proper or suffer the market realities of paying client expectation, one HAD to do if technically proper with creative artistry.
    I've found that the highly creative who don't get bogged down in pseudotechnical 'debate' manage to follow how to expose Ektar just fine, without overexposure, crossover etc.

    Whereas those who spend their time licking resolution charts and worrying about extreme N+ & N- never seem to get good results out of Ektar.

  4. #34

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    My "rule" for shooting any CN film is to expose it like chrome film (with a spotmeter) and NAIL the box speed, and life is easier (and prettier)... ;-)

    Steve K

  5. #35

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by interneg View Post
    the situation is that if you expose your Ektar film to protect your highlights (like a transparency), you will see deeper into the shadows than most transparencies can, but if you are dealing with a longer SBR, then your deep shadows have to be left to go where they will (like a transparency), unless you have ND grads or can light the shadows at the time of exposure. Otherwise you will run into crossover problems, which while you may like the effects, are not representative of the intended colour of Ektar.
    Not at all, if you see again that test (http://www.lettherebefilm.com/exposures) you will find that Ektar behaves mostly like Portra, you have no need to protect Ektar extreme highlights because you have at least +6 stops latitude for the highlights, having to go +4 to see a minimal color degradation. With provia you have a fair degradation if going beyond +1!!! So nothing in common.

    Perhaps Portra can be overexposure abused a bit more than Ektar, but anyway Ektar is much more like Portra rather than like Provia, see the samples, absolutely there is no doubt, this is also my own experience. When I have a (portraiture) Ektar backlight then I expose for the face and I let the background go were it wants, no problem, no worries.

  6. #36

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    See post# 20.
    https://www.largeformatphotography.i...ght=elinchrome

    Do the tech stuff up front to get the actual film speed, lighting meter, color balance, processed film density and .. dialed in. Once this basic stuff is done. Move on to the creative-artistic or best part of print image making.

    Futzing around aimlessly or trying to fix it post process is IMO, a total waste of time, resources and effort. Back then once the color transparency is done, it's essentially done. Try to do fix up was a far lesser possibility back then. Being stressed to get it proper the first time enforces discipline of the process and importance of getting the tech aspects correct.

    It could be that this LF stuff has become more hobby than putting food on the table, roof over your studio-home combined with the image bending software and hardware today, that need to get it all proper first exposure is greatly lessened and the need for that taken for granted.



    Bernice



    Quote Originally Posted by interneg View Post
    I've found that the highly creative who don't get bogged down in pseudotechnical 'debate' manage to follow how to expose Ektar just fine, without overexposure, crossover etc.

    Whereas those who spend their time licking resolution charts and worrying about extreme N+ & N- never seem to get good results out of Ektar.

  7. #37

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by manfrominternet View Post
    Any recommendations
    OP, in night photography you have 2 enemies:


    > Very high SBR, (specially, in city scapes): too high contrast in the scene.

    > LIRF: reciprocity failure decreases the film capability to record an ample contrast range, because shadows have more LIRF than highlights.


    So you have to balance well your exposure to have detail in the highlights while recording shadows. Of course the detail level you want to record from shadows is an aesthetic choice, but the more you record shadows the more you keep your choices open for the final image, you always can darken your shadows in post processing to the point you want.


    To overcome that you should consider 3 points:

    > Use well highlight latitude your film allows, in that way you'll record more shadows.

    > Consider pulling development, even with color, this will deliver a less contrasty negative but it will record more SBR, later you compensate final image contrast in post.

    > Spot metering and Bracketing: test by bracketing exposure in 35mm, with Normal development and pulling (shortening development) by 1 or 2 stops. So I'd start spending 3 rolls of Portra 400.


    ...but anyway I'd test by spot_metering/bracketing several films (at normal development) to see their particular aesthetics. Learn it with Spot Meter. You want to know how local over-under exposure results in the image capture.

    Test also with Provia and BW rolls.

    Goog Scanning and Photoshop edition of night shots may require also some practice.

  8. #38
    Andrej Gregov
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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    To the OP, I would suggest staying away from slower speed films as you embark on the project. That cuts out the whole Ektar debate here as a moot point. And I would recommend against pushing or pulling color film to start out with. It usually incurs extra lab charges and by not yet having a solid baseline with "normal" color development, you'd be adding an extra variable in judging whether your film exposure is working or not. I'd suggest just starting with Portra 400 and shoot it at 200 asa with normal processing. Try it at 400 too and look at some prints shot at each speed to see which you prefer. And don't forget reciprocity failure. Keep it simple and make work.

  9. #39

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pere Casals View Post
    > Consider pulling development, even with color, this will deliver a less contrasty negative but it will record more SBR, later you compensate final image contrast in post.
    You shouldn't consider doing this unless you have specific needs (mainly darkroom/ technical processes) and only need a very slight adjustment of contrast on C-41. The risks of crossover etc are significant. Your airy unconcern shows that you are guessing from the basis of a lack of experience and research other than assuming that by using terms of art as pseudotechnical jargon you can seem apparently knowledgeable.

  10. #40

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    Re: What color negative/transparency would you recommend for night photography?

    Quote Originally Posted by interneg View Post
    Your airy unconcern shows that you are guessing from the basis of a lack of experience and research other than assuming that by using terms of art as pseudotechnical jargon you can seem apparently knowledgeable.
    Hey, Interneg, don't be that pathetic. Look, buy some ektar and practice with it at night. It's you that have no experience with ektar and probably also none in night shooting.

    Look, at night some mild color crossovers from pulling are totally irrelevant, in fact anyway you have many shifts comming from LIRF (you may be shooting f/11 in LF at night), add the different illumination natures you have intermixed (sodium around...), and etc... Don't tell me that you were not aware


    First you recommended shooting like provia to protect highlights of ektar, (that has +6 stops highlight latitude !!!)... and then what do you do with night shadows, man ??? Where is your vault of experience ?


    If you are not able to pull C-41 successfully, then send a test roll to Fotoimpex and they will show you that there is no problem: https://www.fotoimpex.com/lab-servic...rmat-film.html
    Last edited by Pere Casals; 7-May-2020 at 12:03.

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