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Thread: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

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    Photographer LocalHero1953's Avatar
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    Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    I have shot 20 4x5 sheets of Provia 100F, scanned them with a digital camera, and imported them to Lightroom with the Adobe Standard profile.
    The digital results are a bit disappointing in terms of colour and contrast, compared to the gorgeous looking transparencies. Perhaps I should be using a Provia-specific colour profile?
    I see one can buy IT8 profiles on Provia - for a price, of course.
    Has anyone else done this?
    What software did you use to create an ICC profile?
    Were the results worth it?

    FWIW
    The best of the images on film were portraits, two under studio lights, and two indoors with excellent window lighting.
    The scanning was with a Leica SL2-S on a tripod above a Kaiser LED light panel, using the in-camera pixel shift/multishot facility.
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    Paul Ashley Photography

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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Kaiser LED panel might be a problem, I even can’t see CRI in their specification.
    I suspect you have light source with insufficient spectrum.
    RAW is not “color profiled”, so you can use any icc you want or have.
    i have no experience with mentioned profile, but almost on every occasion happy with AdobeRGB.

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    Photographer LocalHero1953's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    I am using the Kaiser Slimlight Piano. I haven't had particular problems with colour negatives.
    It is specified as:
    Light source: 23 LEDs, 5000 Kelvin, CRI=95
    Luminous density: approx. 750 cd/m˛
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Here's what I would do for best results. It's kind of expensive, though.

    I'd skip the Kodak IT8 target which has a minimal number of color patches and purchase a Hutchcolor (HTC) target. They come in two films: Velvia and Kodak E6. I would confer with HTC to determine which has color characteristics most like Provia. My guess would be the Kodak E6, 6x9 target which they sell at about $5C each. But, these targets include 540 color patches. Along with the target, you get a data file that can be used to create the profile.

    Under the exact same lighting that you use for camera scanning your transparencies, photograph the target using your Leica camera, and convert your target image to a tiff file. There should be zero modification of this image file. No corrections for color temperature, etc. None.

    Work with a service provider to render this target Tiff image as a profile. They would need the datafile that comes with the target. Being in the Pacific Northwest, I would probably use Chromix in Seattle. Not sure about what's available in the UK, but you might be able to find a color management consultant who already has the HTC target that you would need. Hard to say if this is viable. Even if viable, they might have a faded target that's fallen out of step with their datafile.

    In scanning a one of your transparencies, process the image file in exactly the same way that you processed the target tiff file, and then assign in Photoshop the profile that you've developed. This should render an image file that's closest to the camera scanned transparency. Though, some image manipulation will likely still be needed.

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    Photographer LocalHero1953's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Thanks, Neil - I will investigate this approach and see what's available here.
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    Alan Klein's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    I've never done camera scanning but use Epson scanners currently a V850 with Epsonscan software edited in Lightroom afterward. For whatever it's worth, here are some samples of Provia shot on 4x5. I don't use any ICC standards but adjust to my eye. Good luck

    https://www.flickr.com/search/?sort=...N05&view_all=1

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    Photographer LocalHero1953's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Thank you, Alan - that's considerably better than my scans after processing
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    If you are using a digital camera isn't it copying or duplicating rather than scanning?
    "My forumla for successful printing remains ordinary chemicals, an ordinary enlarger, music, a bottle of scotch - and stubbornness." W. Eugene Smith

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    Peter De Smidt's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Use 'camera neutral 2' instead of the Adobe standard profile.

    You can use Wolf Faust's IT8 targets to make icc files....but Lightroom doesn't use ICC files. (Capture 1 does.)

    Since you use Lightroom, it's not worth it.

    You can photography a Macbeth target, and then scan the film. Use the HSL adjustments to get a good match. Save that as a profile.

    All that said, what these types of things do is get you in the ball park. Conditions vary, and so the profile's usefulness will vary. Learn to get the results you want through editing. For example, you can have the slide on a good light box. Use adjustments to visually match the slide (if that's what you want.)
    “You often feel tired, not because you've done too much, but because you've done too little of what sparks a light in you.”
    ― Alexander Den Heijer, Nothing You Don't Already Know

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    Alan Klein's Avatar
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    Re: Scanning Provia/transparencies with a digital camera: ICC profiling?

    Why are you trying to match the colors in the slide? This isn't a contest. You're trying to make colors in the finished photo that are appealing to viewers. Satisfy your own eyes and forget the match.

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