Chamonix and Ebony's are gorgeous & Old Kodak 2D's are UGLY but they have their place

[Drew Wiley]

People were simply making do with the equipment they could afford at the time and sometimes a limited technical skill set which pro labs went through hell to iron out. I've seen quite a bit of early work by some of the above, and the ratio of bellyflops to "remembered images" was staggeringly high. Given the combination of a "starving artist" and the high cost of 8x10 color film and printing even back then, more precise technique would have been a distinct advantage. Some improved, some didn't. Certain big names of the 70's are mothballed now. That canon of photography you talk about can be rather brittle.

[Vaughn]

Vaughn I've been thinking about modifying an 11x14 dark slide for just this purpose...and I have a couple of questions: One, do you have any problems with "bleed over" of light from the image adjacent to the film area not being exposed (especially in flare-prone setups)...and have you needed to narrow the useable image area because of this? And two...can I assume that you are using at or close to maximum front rise for the bottom image, and maximum fall for the top image (and possible additional rear fall and rise) to compensate for "off axis" issues? And if so...how is this working out for you? Thanks!

It was a jump from 8x10 to 11x14. One trick I learned was that one should only expose the top half of the film (then rotate camera back 180 degrees to shoot the other half). If one tries to expose the bottom half, the modified darkslide is off-balance and wants to slip down a little inside the holder causing non-parallel sides on the image. Exposing the top half keeps the long part of the "L" of the modified darkslide along the bottom of the holder -- nice and snug. This can happen with 4x10, but less.

I rotate the camera back 180 degrees for the second horizontal 5.5x14 and this allows me to keep the lens fully raised and in the same position for both horizontal images. Nice not to have to mess with it. I can expose without reframing/focusing, unless wanted. I often take a second shot -- either different exposure or the same for a back-up neg. Exposing both halves at the same set-up eliminates a lot of chances to mess up keeping track.

For vertical 5.5x14s the lens has to be shifted to the other side and one re-frames the image.

No significant bleed-over, less if anything than a full holder (the light is hitting the center of the film at less of an angle). Leave enough rebate (overlap) down the middle. You will be making a rebate on each negative -- so twice as wide as a single rebate.

The 8x10 Zone VI and the 11x14 Chamonix both have ample front rise to center the lens on the exposed section of film. And both have enough front shift for vertical images. Which is important since my Fuji W 360/6.3 barely covers 11x14. I can take advantage of the lens this way and keep my image corners away from the edge of the image circle...and/or use a wider aperture.

I used Fidelity metal 8x10 and 11x14 darkslides. Found that they will not fit some other brands of holders...so check that out. Below is an 11x14 neg (inverted in PhotoShop) and my modified darkslide (and one for 11x11). If one uses non-metal darkslides, more care needs to be taken in transport -- but non-metal ones are much lighter and be less prone to slip down as mentioned at the beginning.

[John Layton]

Great info...thanks!

Didn't think about flipping the holder for the second image...makes good sense!

[Oren Grad]

I've just deleted a mostly ill-tempered exchange about country of origin. Some of the posts could reasonably have been considered entirely benign, others were plainly spoiling for a fight, others still would have been harder judgment calls. But there's no way to split them apart without ending up with both a swiss-cheesey thread and a bunch of people feeling aggrieved for having been singled out.

If you find yourself in the mood to grind an axe or, conversely, are feeling compelled to set an axe-grinder straight, please step away from the keyboard (or set aside your cellphone) until the feeling goes away. Life is way too short.

[Vaughn]

Great info...thanks! Didn't think about flipping the holder for the second image...makes good sense!

Just measured my modified darkslide -- I removed 14cm (5.5"), which left 15cm (5 7/8"). Leaving another 1/16" would not hurt. Note that I rounded the corners to match the other corner.

The actual image area of the negative above measures 5.0" wide (12.7cm), not including notch. And 13 5/8" long (34.5cm)...but I have noticed that the size of the interior rails of the 11x14 Fidelity holders (medical) are not consistent. One of them has much more substantial rails...wider, I mean.

Measuring my darkslide, I found I am about 1/32" off (not quite a mm on the neg) -- might take a file to it someday...I do have some time on my hands.

But on-topic, I have a Pre-aniversary Speed. I have made a few images with it and a magnifying lens...the rear curtain shutter is a nice feature (see below). I have a friend with a 5x7 Speed, but I can't get him to part with it.

Vaughn

Using Type 55, silver gelatin contacts prints:

[Jody_S]

...using a Sorta-Focus lens...

Bernice

i like Sorta-Focus lenses. They're the best kind. Nobody knows what part of the image was supposed to have any detail, including myself by the time I've got it scanned and edited.