Archival Rating of The New Gen 5 Ilford RC Multigrade Deluxe Papers?

[Drew Wiley]

I print on plastic quite a bit. Decades of Cibachrome work, with hundreds of them still looking like they mere made yesterday, and now Fujiflex. Those are on extremely stable polyester, just like high-quality sheet film base but thicker. But RC is on paper with a thin semi-permeable outer plastic sandwich. I do all my b&w work on fiber-based paper. I'm not trying to imply anything negative about RC b&w except that it's not suitable for drymounting; but RC will probably never lose it's reputation with collectors or archivists as an unwanted step-child. They too prefer a track record versus so many projected "hundreds of years" of some marketing BS coefficient.

[LFLarry]

Based on the responses and my own research, it appears that is no current and third-party research regarding permanence of RC papers.

In a digital world, I am not surprised.

I did pick up some new knowledge from the group here like the Ctein book which is a gold mine and some other good stuff too. I think all the issues dating back to the beginning of RC paper in the 70s and 80s have long been solved and the real issues with RC are the media and this simply can't get solved. I think I know enough of the answer to help me with my approach for my customers which is what started this research to begin with.

I guess there really isn't anything else to say unless someone knows of a resource that has recently tested RC paper for permanence?

[Bob Salomon]

Based on the responses and my own research, it appears that is no current and third-party research regarding permanence of RC papers.

In a digital world, I am not surprised.

I did pick up some new knowledge from the group here like the Ctein book which is a gold mine and some other good stuff too. I think all the issues dating back to the beginning of RC paper in the 70s and 80s have long been solved and the real issues with RC are the media and this simply can't get solved. I think I know enough of the answer to help me with my approach for my customers which is what started this research to begin with.

I guess there really isn't anything else to say unless someone knows of a resource that has recently tested RC paper for permanence?

RC base paper goes back much further then the 70s. We used it in the AF in the early 60s! And then there was also stabilization papers and processing in the later 60’s but that stuff was far from archival!

[Bob Salomon]

[QUOTE=LFLarry;1533682]Based on the responses and my own research, it appears that is no current and third-party research regarding permanence of RC papers.

In a digital world, I am not surprised.

I did pick up some new knowledge from the group here like the Ctein book which is a gold mine and some other good stuff too. I think all the issues dating back to the beginning of RC paper in the 70s and 80s have long been solved and the real issues with RC are the media and this simply can't get solved. I think I know enough of the answer to help me with my approach for my customers which is what started this research to begin with.

I guess there really isn't anything else to say unless someone knows of a resource that has recently tested RC paper for permanence?[/QUOTE

Careful with Barry Stein (Ctein). He is frequently a Don Quiote giving answers to problems that don’t exist.

[LFLarry]

Okay, while that is interesting, it still doesn't address the core question about any current third party testing of RC paper permanence.

We've all heard the horror stories about RC from whenever (50s/60s/70s/80s, etc), but the only individual testing that I could find was from Ctein. The anecdotal stories of "my RC pints still look like new from the 70s are great, but once again, none of this addresses the original question asked.

I have to assume at this point there is no current testing being performed by a worthy and credible resource, which is fine.

RC base paper goes back much further then the 70s. We used it in the AF in the early 60s! And then there was also stabilization papers and processing in the later 60’s but that stuff was far from archival!

[cowanw]

Don Quixote has gone to great lengths to add the x to his name and to have his previous name forgotten. I think it is unkind to frustrate that.

[Maris Rusis]

I used to worry about the archival permanence of photographs I made using fibre base and RC base papers. But I don't worry anymore.
I just process and wash the papers according to the best archival practice, do confirmatory residue tests from time to time, store the pictures in a clean acid-free environment, and buy the best conservation framing if needed. That's the limited pact I make with collectors who buy my photographs.
I consider I've done my bit. I can't do any more. What happens next in the mid to distant future is out of my hands.

[Bob Salomon]

Okay, while that is interesting, it still doesn't address the core question about any current third party testing of RC paper permanence.

We've all heard the horror stories about RC from whenever (50s/60s/70s/80s, etc), but the only individual testing that I could find was from Ctein. The anecdotal stories of "my RC pints still look like new from the 70s are great, but once again, none of this addresses the original question asked.

I have to assume at this point there is no current testing being performed by a worthy and credible resource, which is fine.

Can’t say for other papers but I have 30x40 color prints mounted on canvas and laminated with Ademco that go back to the early 70s that have been hung where the sun shines and are yet to fade. They were printed on Kodak RC paper and then the emulsion was stripped off the RC base and then mounted on artist canvas that has a gesso coating. The emulsion was stripped by first applying the Ademco laminate to the print in an Ademco hard platen press, then peeling the emulsion and laminate from the RC base and then using Ademco double coated laminate between the bottom of the stripped print and the canvas and mounting them together in the hard platen press.
Unlike a Seal type press the entire mounting process takes place in the press rather then under weight outside the press.

[Oren Grad]

I have to assume at this point there is no current testing being performed by a worthy and credible resource, which is fine.

To my knowledge, this is correct.

In addition to the discussion so far here and at Photrio, you may find this thread of interest:

https://www.largeformatphotography.i...erimental-data

[Tin Can]

Maris makes good points

My now 22 year old fiber prints hot mounted on high end matboard stored with interleaving flat stacked in archival boxes, look exactly as i remember

Moved 4 times with 5 years of no temp/humidity control in Illinois, cold to hot with high humidity

I also have 1000's of loose family prints stored willy nilly since 1895, most are fine

My Polaroids have faded, slides fine

When I found my 22 year old prints in cold shed storage, I let them warm for 48 hours inside the double storage box