You (Yes, You) Should Donate to the Historic American Buildings Survey (HABS)

[Tin Can]

Agree

Transition to digital is short sighted in my opinion.

[schafphoto]

Any indication when the transition to digital might happen, and what the equipment spec requirements might be? Who makes that decision?

One or more years for public Born-Digital guidelines...there would be an internal beta test that has been discussed and would probably take +/- a year as well. The operative plan was to allow film for around a decade or until the current crop of HABS/HAER photographers die off... whichever comes first.

[jnantz]

Hopefully they will still accept Film and Paper submissions .... It's bad enough most of the states have ditched paper and film.

[Sal Santamaura]

Transition to digital is short sighted in my opinion.

I disagree, given that Stephen has indicated it will take around a decade, but not for the reason he suggests. We're all here enjoying the continued availability of large format film, while often seeing bitter complaints about its cost. There is a small number of sources for that film. Just as during film's heyday, those sources depend on their sales of small- and medium-format film to remain economically viable. Despite all the enthusiastic talk of a "film revival," reality is that all fads, including the recent surge in usage by younger people, will eventually subside. It's inevitable as one generation replaces the next and what was "cool" transitions into something disdained. Thus, at some point the LOC will no longer be able to obtain film-based HABS/HAER/HALS work. It's forward thinking and good planning to establish new standards that will be relevant/useful ten years from now.

[jnantz]

It has nothing to do with disdain.. as someone who has submitted to federal and state HABS collections for me it has to do with the collection being wiped out without a tangible backup. Jack Boucher told me about a massive image loss within a different department 1,000,000 images corrupted and useless, the HABS collection contains images of resources that are vanished or altered, the resource is gone. The department that lost all those image could retake them not so easy with something that’s gone. Contrary to popular belief stuff gets torn down even if it on the national register… property owners can pretty much do whatever they want, that’s one of the reason for HABS, it’s last rites.

[Sal Santamaura]

...It's inevitable as one generation replaces the next and what was "cool" transitions into something disdained. Thus, at some point the LOC will no longer be able to obtain film-based HABS/HAER/HALS work...

It has nothing to do with disdain.. as someone who has submitted to federal and state HABS collections for me it has to do with the collection being wiped out without a tangible backup. Jack Boucher told me about a massive image loss within a different department 1,000,000 images corrupted and useless, the HABS collection contains images of resources that are vanished or altered, the resource is gone. The department that lost all those image could retake them not so easy with something that’s gone. Contrary to popular belief stuff gets torn down even if it on the national register… property owners can pretty much do whatever they want, that’s one of the reason for HABS, it’s last rites.

You misinterpret what I wrote. I referred to future generations "disdaining" what today's young people are "in to," namely film. That's what will eventually spell the demise of film manufacture and render current HABS/HAER/HALS standards obsolete. As for backup, if there's any entity one can count on to maintain a continuous program of backing up digital archives on the latest media, redundantly, in multiple locations, it's the LOC. I wouldn't worry about old news concerning data loss from someone no longer around.

[Sal Santamaura]

...most all of the things I have recorded for HABS (since 1990/1991 ) are gone...

Now I'm really confused. If you've been recording things for HABS for 30 years on film, and they're "gone," why does HABS moving from film-based to digitally-captured submittals ten years from now make anything worse?

...You mentioned people complaining about the high cost of film. The photographer submitting a HABS project does not pay for his or her film ( it's not something that is typically done like Stephen is suggesting, "spec" and "on the photographer's dime ), the client pays, just like they pay for an EIS statement and environmental mitigation. If they can afford a multi million dollar project I am sure they can afford film that might cost a few dollars per sheet...

Once again, please go back and read what I posted. It's not the cost of sheet film for a HABS/HAER/HALS project that will have any impact on the process. It's the cost of 35mm and 120 film, used by no one involved with HABS/HAER/HALS, that I expect will eventually cause film manufacture to cease. Thus, as collateral damage, making sheet film unavailable for HABS/HAER/HALS or anything else.

[rfesk]

I, for one, think 35mm and sheet film will be around for a long time in the future.

[Sal Santamaura]

I, for one, think 35mm and sheet film will be around for a long time in the future.

That's nice. Apparently the LOC isn't quite as confident as you are.

...there was an event in the 1870s ( https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley....9/2007JA012943 ), another one is in the wings, and when that happens all those files go bye-bye...

While extreme space weather can and will have an outsized effect on many aspects of modern technology, including terrestrial and space-based communications, as well as utility power distribution and all the systems such as computing and HVAC/refrigeration that depend on it, I've found no authoritative representations that offline data storage would be negatively impacted. Especially if it were isolated from the grid. Here are two papers addressing the matter:

https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/f..._events__0.pdf

https://www.ready.gov/space-weather

[jnantz]

it won’t be pretty. I feel badly for all these states whose crmp archives is all digital with no hard copy redundancy. Not my problem.