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Thread: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

  1. #41
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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Bryan, documentation for the Rodenstock eShutter, which is a current product in its "250" version, states explicitly that existing lenses intended for analog use can be mounted in it. So the vendor, at least, has entertained that possibility.

    Unfortunately, the shutter unit itself and the control box needed to use it untethered in the field each costs well into four figures in dollars, pounds or euro. Even if one could get by with an outfit consisting entirely of lenses in #0 shutter, and even allowing that a single control box can be used with multiple lenses, the cost of a multi-lens kit in eShutter would be prohibitive for most of us.

    So the big question is whether anyone can figure out how to do it for substantially less money, despite what under the best of circumstances is going to be a very small market. I'm not assuming the answer is "no"; folks who have been involved in lens design and manufacturing will be far better qualified to address that question than I can be. But there's the challenge.

  2. #42
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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Thank you Oren for the actual information. Price definitely seems prohibitive in the extreme.
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  3. #43

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Quote Originally Posted by MAubrey View Post
    $700 isn't wholly an unreasonable for a brand new shutter. With a Raspberry Pi or Adruino board to programed to trigger it, you could get solid shutter speeds, too.

    Noting that this 45mm shutter is just slightly wider across than the housing of a Copal #3 (also 45mm aperture), I could imagine some creative person figuring out a way to make it fit.

    https://www.uniblitz.com/wp-content/...-datasheet.pdf
    The price for a Uniblitz shutter is not unreasonable (especially considering these are professional tools for industrial applications) but the problem is also that you typically need a $1000 shutter controller box as well.

    This is partly where I was going with suggesting that advances in electronics and micro-motors mean someone could design a compact, low-voltage, and extremely reliable electromechanical shutter for photography, if only there were a viable market for it. Existing Uniblitz and similar shutters typically use a large electronics box that runs off AC power. However, a modern AF SLR has electromechanical shutter and AF lens motor that run off a compact 7.4V lithium battery. I think that a unit could be designed that was more compact, economical, and portable than a Uniblitz controller, but I doubt there is a strong market case for it when Copal shutters are still quite reliable.

  4. #44

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    For info on the Rodenstock eShutter, see links below to the pdf for both shutter and Sinar compatible control box.

    Battery operation is possible and the control can either be a dedicated box, computer or smart phone through and interface.

    The aperture is a significant improvement over the Copal 0, 1 mechanical versions but all this comes as Oren stated, a significant price tag. Developed for digital back studio view camera commercial use mostly.


    http://www.rodenstock-photo.com/Arch...r.en_10383.pdf

    https://sinar.swiss/assets/Uploads/P...ol-EN-web2.pdf


    Quote Originally Posted by Oren Grad View Post
    Bryan, documentation for the Rodenstock eShutter, which is a current product in its "250" version, states explicitly that existing lenses intended for analog use can be mounted in it. So the vendor, at least, has entertained that possibility.

    Unfortunately, the shutter unit itself and the control box needed to use it untethered in the field each costs well into four figures in dollars, pounds or euro. Even if one could get by with an outfit consisting entirely of lenses in #0 shutter, and even allowing that a single control box can be used with multiple lenses, the cost of a multi-lens kit in eShutter would be prohibitive for most of us.

    So the big question is whether anyone can figure out how to do it for substantially less money, despite what under the best of circumstances is going to be a very small market. I'm not assuming the answer is "no"; folks who have been involved in lens design and manufacturing will be far better qualified to address that question than I can be. But there's the challenge.

    Cheers,

  5. #45
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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Personally, it'll be a cold day in Hell before I shoot LF film with the aid of a smart phone!

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  6. #46

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Oren Grad View Post
    So the big question is whether anyone can figure out how to do it for substantially less money, despite what under the best of circumstances is going to be a very small market. I'm not assuming the answer is "no"; folks who have been involved in lens design and manufacturing will be far better qualified to address that question than I can be. But there's the challenge.
    All depends on where you develop and manufacture quite frankly. The development of all the tooling required to stamp the parts takes time and is mostly a lost art unless you want to hire a number of watch makers.

    It can always be done but in order for a company, large or small, to make money on it, any new shutter development and production is going to require a capital investment.

    Copal announced a long time ago that they were shuttering the business. No one stepped up and the digital MF lens manufacturers had to roll their own.

    There's no Copal 3 (or 00, 0, 1) replacement for LF photography. The Melles Griot and Uniblitz shutters are geared towards optical benches and lab work. Yes, they can be used and yes, you can make a less expensive control box in small quantities but how many are willing to pay for a $1k shutter combo that is 4" in diameter and has a max speed of 1/60th second.

    I'm happy I have a few digital Sinar shutters for my LF needs and few mechanical Copal ones for back up.

    YMMV,

    Cheers,

  7. #47

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Corran View Post
    Personally, it'll be a cold day in Hell before I shoot LF film with the aid of a smart phone!

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    Hell has frozen over a few times in my lifetime ...

  8. #48

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Corran View Post
    Personally, it'll be a cold day in Hell before I shoot LF film with the aid of a smart phone!

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    second that

  9. #49
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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    A money pit that leads nowhere good.

    I may hammer my digital disease to oblivion.

    or not







    Quote Originally Posted by Corran View Post
    Personally, it'll be a cold day in Hell before I shoot LF film with the aid of a smart phone!

    Click image for larger version. 

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    sin eater

  10. #50

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    Re: Ideas for new shutters 40 years from now when ours are all dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Corran View Post
    Are you saying you own and use them for LF photography?
    Used the system, yes, often. Currently,no. At my age it becomes difficult to haul that stuff around anymore! But I still have the control on my phone, should I suddenly lose my arthritis and have my torn rotator cuff operated on again. But all of the orthropods at NE GA, Emory and the VA have told me that I would have to have a reverse shoulder replacement and I really donít want to do that as it is a last step procedure!

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