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Thread: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

  1. #11

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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    OP, since you're going to shoot environmental portraits you'll be working somewhat closeup. Lenses' circles covered with good enough image quality at the edge are measured at infinity. Lenses that won't quite cover 8x10 at infinity will probably work for you.

    Since you're going to be shooting environmental portraits, is what's going to be in the corners of the frame that important?

    If you need it all, the lens for you is a Schneider 210/5.6 Super Symmar Aspheric HL, which Schneider claims covers 357 mm wide open. Dig deep ...

  2. #12

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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Fromm View Post
    OP, since you're going to shoot environmental portraits you'll be working somewhat closeup. Lenses' circles covered with good enough image quality at the edge are measured at infinity. Lenses that won't quite cover 8x10 at infinity will probably work for you.

    Since you're going to be shooting environmental portraits, is what's going to be in the corners of the frame that important?
    Not the least because if shooting wide open, the environment in the corners is still likely to be out of focus anyway.

  3. #13

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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    There are two 200mm wide angles lenses that were produced with the aperture requested by OP that will produce reasonable images at full aperature:

    *200mm f6.8 Rodenstock Grandagon (GOOD lens, use it decades ago).
    http://www.prograf.ru/rodenstock/lar...en.html#table1

    *210mm f5.6 Schneider Super Symmar XL.
    https://www.schneideroptics.com/ecom...D=169&IID=1837

    Both covers 8x10 at full aperture with good performance. Both are going to be difficult o find and expen_$$$$_ive when found for sale.

    Step down to f8 brings in a few other options like the 210mm f8 Super Angulon which might meet the request of OP.
    Another possible solution is to accept a taking aperture of f16 and smaller.

    This does not resolve the related problems of camera alignment-precision, ability for the given 8x10 camera to use a lens of this focal lenght, film in holder flatness, and size-weight of this lens-camera combination.

    All these problem go away with ease by stepping down one film format size, 5x7 or 13x18cm.

    It would be worth knowing what specific kind of images OP intends to produce as 8x10 might not be the ideal image making tool for the images to be produced.


    Bernice

  4. #14
    Mark Sawyer's Avatar
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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Quote Originally Posted by Alan9940 View Post
    If memory serves, the 190mm f/6.3 Kodak Wide Field Ektar just covers 8x10 at f/22 with an image circle of about 308mm. According to this publication I found: https://www.pacificrimcamera.com/rl/00346/00346.pdf this lens is good for 8x10 without using swings. Since I usually use mine at f/32 or f/45 and contact print, I've never noticed any appreciable darkening around the edges/corners or any lack of sharpness. Getting into the super-wides for 8x10 generally requires a good back (weight of lens) and a hefty bank account.
    I bought that very catalog from Pacific Rim some time ago! It doesn't say anything about "just covers 8x10 at f/22 with an image circle of about 308mm", but does say it covers 8x10 without movements. I just checked Michael Gudzinowicz's specs for LF lenses (https://graflex.org/lenses/lens-spec.html), and he gives a 318mm image circle, which would more than cover 8x10, which needs about 300mm. Manufacturers are usually pretty conservative with their coverage figures. I've used mine for landscape on 8x10 and had no issues, though I had it closed down.
    "I love my Verito lens, but I always have to sharpen everything in Photoshop..."

  5. #15
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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Jason's site has a little of what you are looking for : http://motamedi.info/speed.htm
    If you search the google with speed 8inch or 9inch or 210 mm lenses for 8x10 you might find some more..

    good luck !
    John

    ps I don't know if they cover, but you might also think about looking at old tessars one might cover,
    and the out of focus area is not very harsh.
    enjoy your coffee

  6. #16

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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Confirmed, used the 190mm Wide Field Ektar on 8x10, it does cover with good results at f22, at infinity. Wide open for 8x10, not so good.


    Bernice


    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Sawyer View Post
    I bought that very catalog from Pacific Rim some time ago! It doesn't say anything about "just covers 8x10 at f/22 with an image circle of about 308mm", but does say it covers 8x10 without movements. I just checked Michael Gudzinowicz's specs for LF lenses (https://graflex.org/lenses/lens-spec.html), and he gives a 318mm image circle, which would more than cover 8x10, which needs about 300mm. Manufacturers are usually pretty conservative with their coverage figures. I've used mine for landscape on 8x10 and had no issues, though I had it closed down.

  7. #17
    Mark Sawyer's Avatar
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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Quote Originally Posted by wuckyboy View Post
    Hi Mark! - Thanks for that info. Do you know if these actually cover 8x10 @ their fastest possible aperture?:

    210mm f/6.8 Goerz Dagor
    215mm f/4.8 Ilex Acuton
    215mm f/4.8 Caltar S
    190mm f/6.3 Kodak Wide Field Ektar
    210mm f/5.6 Fujinon W
    210mm f/5.6 Schneider Apo Symmar
    210mm f/6.3 Computar Symmetrigon
    210mm f/6.8 Schneider Angulon

    I've been searching for a Wide Field Ektar for EVER and haven't been able to find one that was in great condition. (other than the $$$$ ones in HK)
    Those will all cover wide open. I think your best bet is the Acuton/Caltar S, which is the fastest, very sharp, definitely covers 8x10 (it's still my favorite in this range), and is surprisingly cheap! It's the sleeper few know about.
    "I love my Verito lens, but I always have to sharpen everything in Photoshop..."

  8. #18

    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    Thanks for the reference John, but nothing I looked at would cover 8x10. I was looking for much smaller coverage.

    I heard said that among lenses there are three characteristics--fast, wide, cheap--you get to pick two. Adding in sharpness might complicate things, but the idea is that you are not going to get fast and wide without lots of money. At 210mm open wide and sharp you are going to need modern wide angle lens, the Rodenstock Grandagon and Schneider Super Symmar XL mentioned by Bernice and others are the best of the bunch, but will cost thousands of dollars. If you can go to f8, the Fujinon-SW or Super Angulon might save you $1000. The 210/5.6 Sironar-W (mentioned previously by Mark as the Apo-Sironar) also might be worth looking into. It is modern and intended for 8x10. I have found that the 150/5.6 Sironar-W looks good on 5x7 wide open. Again, it won't come cheap, but might be a bit cheaper than the others.

  9. #19

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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    For environmental portraits, it might be better to accept a smaller f/stop and (gasp) add some lighting.
    See the work of Arnold Newman (although he mostly used 4x5).
    There are lots of inexpensive strobe outfits out there, both moonlights and pack/head setups. Hot lights are generally even cheaper. Plus they can be useful for other projects.
    And when you're shooting 8x10, the added bulk and weight is less of a factor.

  10. #20
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    Re: Options for 190mm- 210mm wide lenses that cover 8x10 WIDE OPEN

    I made a series of enviromental portraits of my boys -- they got good at holding still for up to 2 minutes, tho usually 30 seconds is where I tried to keep it. YMMD.

    A short exposure and a long one...4x10 and 8x10 (2 minute exposure)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Shipwreck_Beach.jpg   Three Boys, Three Snags_8x10C.jpg  
    "Landscapes exist in the material world yet soar in the realms of the spirit..." Tsung Ping, 5th Century China

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