Glossy Fiber Based Paper Choice

[Luis-F-S]

Oriental Seagull or Ilford? Haven't used Seagull in many years, your thoughts on the two papers? Thanks, L

[Ulophot]

I can't speak to the Seagull, having never used it. The Ilford now (as of when, I don't know; I was out of the darkroom until recently for nearly 15 years) has a glossier surface than it used to, in case that has import for your work.

[Fred L]

I've been using the Oriental lately and it's not a bad paper. Still nailing down selenium toning with it but I like how it looks in Formulary 130. I will say though that I prefer Bergger Prestige Neutral over the Oriental. The price of Oriental is attractive however. Haven't used Ilford papers in years so can't speak to that for comparison.

[Alan9940]

I tried the Oriental and didn't like it at all. My favorites nowadays are Ilford MG Classic, Ilford MGWT, and Foma 111 Variant.

[Greg Y]

Luis, I also use (Formulary) Ansco 130 & selenium tone. I've had good results with the new Oriental. I also use Ilford MG Classic & Warmtone, as well as Foma Variant iii. I select the paper based on the negative & the look I'm going for. I've liked Bergger as well, but it's at the top of the price market, & since they have the paper made for them, instead of being a manufacturer, you can't be sure when it's going to change.

[Drew Wiley]

For those of us who once did a lot of printing on the old Seagull G graded bromide papers and other classic graded papers of the past, the performance of current neo-Oriental paper seems quite anemic. I guess it all depends upon your budget and expectations. Any premium quality paper is going to be relatively expensive; and nowadays, it most likely to be VC. But among those premium options I'd include Ilford MGWT, Agfa MCC, and Bergger papers. Ilford has certain other papers I like too. A lot depends on what kind of image tone you are after.

[Greg Y]

Drew, when I say Bergger is at the top of the price chain;(B&H prices here) 50 sheets of 20x24 Ilford WT is $360 US, while 50 sheets (2 boxes of 25) of 20x24 Bergger VCCB is $480 USD...& up here north of the 49th parallel with an additional 37% exchange rate.... for me the price difference is not exactly chump change....even with B&H free shipping....

[Drew Wiley]

Here Bergger is sold in 25-sheet boxes just like Adox MCC. But per sheet of neutral tone it is less than MGWT, and for warmtone, just a tiny bit more. It can be hard to acquire sometimes. Add-ons to cost can be hard to predict. Here in the US there will probably soon be a tariff imposed on breathing air arriving via the jet stream.

[Greg Y]

"a tiny bit more" Hmm.... Freestyle has Bergger 20x24x 25 sheets @ $239.99 same as east coast prices & Ilford WT is $359 for 50. Any way I look at its $120 USD/ 50sheets more....so above my pay grade. And i'm with you on the graded papers of yore. I just finished some prints on Forte Fortezo & i can't get that look in modern papers...

[Drew Wiley]

It's all relative. This afternoon I'm making a color print on Fujiflex Supergloss, which only comes in a thousand dollar roll. Thankfully, my roll has kept its color balance well for several years now, as I slice off a bit of it at a time. But black and white premium papers often save one money because you're less likely to waste paper getting from Point A to B than using cheaper options, at least in my experience. My one gripe with Bergger is that it doesn't spot (retouch) as easily as Ilford. What is giving me a real headache in expense is rag museum board. It's sure gone up in recent years, and I need a lot of it.