Just acquired a Pentax Spot meter with Zone V Conversion

[Mike in NY]

Almost mint condition. Very nice. Now to use it. Cannot wait. Still need to learn the zone system completely. How to expose and develop for the exposure.

Steve, back to your original post, helpful members have already mentioned the most well-known books that can help you learn the zone system, and I've read them all. However, there's a lesser-known one that I like entitled "How to Use the Zone System for Fine B&W Photography," by John P. Schaefer. Mine is a softcover and the glue binding had become so brittle that the pages started falling out recently, so I rebound it this afternoon. I have a bookbinding studio next to my darkroom, where I restore antiquarian books on photography for myself as well as collectors and dealers, so that was a quick and easy repair for a book that I still refer to from time to time.

[Bill Burk]

Indeed. I experimented a bit with Fred Picker's shaded labels, and I had trouble understanding their use.

Take a meter reading and turn the dial until the number read off the needle is opposite the shade of gray that would look good on the print.

I don’t trust the vague grays of a printed sticker, so I make my stickers from pieces of prints.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Steve, back to your original post, helpful members have already mentioned the most well-known books that can help you learn the zone system, and I've read them all. However, there's a lesser-known one that I like entitled "How to Use the Zone System for Fine B&W Photography," by John P. Schaefer. Mine is a softcover and the glue binding had become so brittle that the pages started falling out recently, so I rebound it this afternoon. I have a bookbinding studio next to my darkroom, where I restore antiquarian books on photography for myself as well as collectors and dealers, so that was a quick and easy repair for a book that I still refer to from time to time.

Looks interesting, hopefully available in some format. I need to buy the books and start reading, but I find I learn a lot more by doing and screwing up and then determining why I screwed up. Thanks for the reference.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Take a meter reading and turn the dial until the number read off the needle is opposite the shade of gray that would look good on the print.

I don’t trust the vague grays of a printed sticker, so I make my stickers from pieces of prints.

I still find it easier and more instructive to me to meter shadow I want and then dial in two stops less and then check it against a bright reading to get difference. And then if needed use a grad nd filter to reign in highlights. I also like doing it this way for when I use a red or green or yellow, etc filter. If I use red, then I know I need about 3 stops longer exposure from metered.

If I measure scene I want in zone three at day every of 10, then subtract 3 to get 7. Then to place in zone 3, add 2 back for ev=9. That should put in zone III.

I also like the very simple display. Straight forward and clean. Measire ev, dial on scale and look up your aperture setting. So simple, even I can do it.

[Drew Wiley]

Well Mike, I apologize if I came across that way. It was not intended as a personal jab. I dislike cockpit controls in general - can't stand em in 35mm cameras, not even on my wife's Prius dashboard. I do jab at techie culture a lot. For example, one day a fellow with a fancy DLSR and long telephoto approached me up on Wolf Ridge when I had a big 300mm lens on my 6x7, set up on the wooden Ries tripod. He was polite and curious. And it ended with the inevitable question, do I do digital photography too? I brusquely replied, "Never heard of it! What is that?". He took it in good humor, as intended. Admittedly, this kind of habit can be annoying. I'm not implying that other methods are not equally valid, according to different personal preferences - just pointing out how my own preferences interact with specific applications, and why, like the digital version of the Pentax meter being smaller, a fact which is likely to be pertinent to other backpackers concerned with pack space. But thank you for your comment.

[Doremus Scudder]

I still find it easier and more instructive to me to meter shadow I want and then dial in two stops less and then check it against a bright reading to get difference. And then if needed use a grad nd filter to reign in highlights. I also like doing it this way for when I use a red or green or yellow, etc filter. If I use red, then I know I need about 3 stops longer exposure from metered.

If I measure scene I want in zone three at day every of 10, then subtract 3 to get 7. Then to place in zone 3, add 2 back for ev=9. That should put in zone III.

I also like the very simple display. Straight forward and clean. Measure ev, dial on scale and look up your aperture setting. So simple, even I can do it.

Steven,

I think you (and maybe Bill too) misunderstand how the Zone VI sticker/dial works.

Once correctly applied (with Zone V aligning with the index mark), you simply line up an EV reading of a shadow value opposite the stripe you want to place it. Say you read EV 9 and want it in Zone III. You just align the "9" with the Zone III stripe, which automatically places it two stops under the usual index mark (Zone V). Then, the other EV numbers will correspond to the other Zones; EV 10 on Zone IV, EV 12 on Zone VI etc.

One only has to set the dial once and then take readings to check where they fall. It's really a great visual tool. Since your meter is marked in, and reads out in 1/3-stop increments, you can place any reading where you want it, say EV 9+ (1/3 over EV 9) can be placed in Zone IV- (1/3-stop under the center of Zone IV) and so forth.

The Zone dial/sticker works similarly to the IRE scale already on many meters (including the Pentax digital - not sure about the older analog ones), but reads out in even stops, which corresponds better with the Zone System.

Sure, you can figure everything out without a sticker (e.g., align EV 11 opposite the index mark to place EV 9 two stops under at Zone III and then subtract to find where everything else falls, but the sticker really makes things easy for me. Yes, the stripes don't really match print tones; you don't even really need them. I had my own stickers for a long time with just Roman numerals on them; the grey scale is in my head.

Best,

Doremus

[Mike in NY]

Thanks Drew. I enjoy learning from your posts, so perhaps that was why I took a bit of umbrage to what I thought was some scoffing at my meter. I've had three different zone-equipped meters and like this one for idiosyncratic reasons that are valid to me, as your meter is to you. Always appreciate your insights.

[Steven Ruttenberg]

Steven,

I think you (and maybe Bill too) misunderstand how the Zone VI sticker/dial works.

Once correctly applied (with Zone V aligning with the index mark), you simply line up an EV reading of a shadow value opposite the stripe you want to place it. Say you read EV 9 and want it in Zone III. You just align the "9" with the Zone III stripe, which automatically places it two stops under the usual index mark (Zone V). Then, the other EV numbers will correspond to the other Zones; EV 10 on Zone IV, EV 12 on Zone VI etc.

One only has to set the dial once and then take readings to check where they fall. It's really a great visual tool. Since your meter is marked in, and reads out in 1/3-stop increments, you can place any reading where you want it, say EV 9+ (1/3 over EV 9) can be placed in Zone IV- (1/3-stop under the center of Zone IV) and so forth.

The Zone dial/sticker works similarly to the IRE scale already on many meters (including the Pentax digital - not sure about the older analog ones), but reads out in even stops, which corresponds better with the Zone System.

Sure, you can figure everything out without a sticker (e.g., align EV 11 opposite the index mark to place EV 9 two stops under at Zone III and then subtract to find where everything else falls, but the sticker really makes things easy for me. Yes, the stripes don't really match print tones; you don't even really need them. I had my own stickers for a long time with just Roman numerals on them; the grey scale is in my head.

Best,

Doremus

I understand how it works, I just find it overly simplified and prefer to do the math in my head then pick my settings. It is a good tool if one doesn't want to do the math and a good visual aid.

[Drew Wiley]

Let's see if I can figure this out... count five fingers on one hand, that gets me to Zone five. Cut off two fingers, that leaves me at Zone III. Or with only three fingers left, count forward to Zone VIII. Yeah, the math is pretty complicated.

[Mike in NY]

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what any one individual prefers, so long as it works for THEM and produces a good photograph with their intended tonal range. If zone symbols printed on an adhesive sticker stuck on a manually turned dial work for some photographers, GREAT! If others prefer to see the exact same symbols on an LED digital display, GREAT! If others prefer to do the math in their head, GREAT! Not a single one of those techniques nor the individuals who practice them are superior to any of the others, provided each can produce good images. I know what works for ME, and tip my hat to everyone else who has found what works for them, and appreciate them sharing it here so that others who are still experimenting or finding their way can learn from those who care enough to share their experience. And therein lies the truth of the matter: Nobody cares what someone else knows, unless they know they care. It's not about having the last word, or dominating everyone else, or repeating one's viewpoint multiple times in an effort to to prove its validity. The point is simply to show we care enough to hear one another, comment, share advice, give some encouragement, cut some jokes, criticize constructively, debate without devolving into argument, and have a good time while learning from each other.