Alternative to Upper/Lower Glass Negative Carriers

[neil poulsen]

I've always used regular negative carriers for enlarging, in particular because glass negative carriers for my enlarger are practically non-existent.

But lately, I've been wondering about a compromise on glass negative carriers? Why not alter a regular negative carrier with a single piece of glass below the negative to keep the negative from sagging? Yet, it's held in place at the edges in the traditional fashion.

Given gravity, I would think that sagging is the primary problem. (Especially for 8x10 carriers.) Plus, with the emulsion side down against the sheet of glass, one might be able to avoid troublesome Newton rings that I've read result from the top piece of glass pressing down on the shiny, non-emulsion side of the film. This also cuts by a third the number of surfaces that can collect dust.

As a question for those who use glass negative carriers, do Newton rings ever result from the emulsion side of the film touching the glass under the film?

Does what I've suggested sound like a reasonable approach? At least, it's better than using a traditional negative carrier. For my enlarger, it would be easy enough to add a support for a piece of glass under the negative. But, effecting this for both under and above the negative would be a different story.

[Jac@stafford.net]

I have a Beseler Negaflat 4x5 carrier adapted to my Omega. If we are reasonable when mounting the negative it is just downright terrific. No glass required.

Sorry - it appears you need 8x10. Cannot help unless you happen to use a Saltzman.

Best of luck with your quest!

[AJ Edmondson]

I have never had any problem using the setup you alluded to... used it for years with an 8x10 Elwood.
Joel

[Bob Salomon]

Sagging is only half the problem. Popping is the other. That means that the film can move during exposure!

[ic-racer]

particular because glass negative carriers for my enlarger are practically non-existent.

Which enlarger?

[Greg]

If my memory serves me well, Carlwen (mfg) used to make glassless carriers which actually stretched the film taunt. I also remember them making custom carriers for pretty much any film size, we had them make one for my photo department in the 1980s. Unbelievably really long shot, to say the least, but be on the lookout for one of their 8x10 carriers. Over the years have come across prototype and one-off photo items that I never would have thought existed. My mistake was not acquiring them at the time.

[Tin Can]

Glennview camera has a lot of answers.

I discovered yesterday Carlwen made oil immersion enlarger carriers on Glenn's site

Which predates scanner wet mount by decades...

[interneg]

Glennview camera has a lot of answers.

I discovered yesterday Carlwin made oil immersion enlarger carriers on Glenn's site

Which predates scanner wet mount by decades...

Usually intended to minimise retouching when used for colour separation with a point light source.

[Drew Wiley]

Carlwen made fluid carriers based on a two-glass sandwich, much like oil immersion microscope slides. Today you could use scanner fluid. It would be fairly easy to rig up something like that yourself. It's an elegant and proven concept. But do want to deal with the mess every time afterwards, cleaning oil both glass and the film itself? That sure doesn't appeal to me. So I personally always use Anti-Newton glass both top and bottom. I'm very skeptical of being able to routinely make precise precise otherwise, especially large ones. But it all depends on what you consider an acceptable standard of sharpness, the stiffness of the film itself, and how hot you light source is.

[jose angel]

Funny, I was also thinking about it. I was planning to modify my film carrier, and BTW, to upgrade the plain top glass to anti Newton glass. But...
In my experience with 5x7" (I don`t have a 8x10" enlarger), a plain glass carrier is just right. With my smaller enlargers (bulb based light sources), AN glass is a must, but I think I have never experienced Newton rings with my 5x7" enlarger (multi LED board source with diffuser).
On 5x7" I have used bottom glass only carriers (glass to emulsion side) and I currently use a bottom and top glass carrier, no problems. Maybe its the light source or whatever; why not test your own enlarger with a couple pieces of glass? (e.g., from those cheap photo frames)