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Thread: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

  1. #31
    (Shrek)
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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew Wiley View Post
    They distinctly told me that dagors in general were too tricky to make due to the need for precisely matched front and rear elements, and that the newer GC plasmats were better corrected anyway.
    That would explain it. The needs of a process lens are different from a taking lens, different enough to make manufacture of a symmetrical lens a little tricky. So they did likely start with the 355 for cost reasons, being the largest it would have been the hardest to adjust.

  2. #32
    Drew Wiley
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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Dan - you have to understand the manner in which their specs were geared to their own idea of intended market application. Because the G-Claron line was repro-application derived, they followed that same kind of extremely conservative image circle basis even when the plasmat GC's were issued. At least that's how my old official spec sheets did it. The actual Schneider sales people tried to re-explain it for regular photographers. There were also wide-angle GC's, which further complicates this. All kinds of people on this forum, especially the ULF gang, know that real-world general photography image circles for the plasmat versions are MUCH larger than the published circles. In other words, they used a different standard for GC plasmats than from their regular plasmat series. With GC spec sheets you also get 1:1 circles, as well as infinity circles.
    One problem with dagors is that they aren't as crisp at angled extremes or tangential specs. Repro applications aren't concerned with that because the application is head-on flat field. Tabletop and general usage is, because strong tilts are often involved. I could cite several other factors; but this should be enough to make one scratch their head and begin to understand the seeming anomaly in the specs. It all makes sense if one realizes which trade they had in mind when they published those specs - and it wasn't us!

  3. #33
    Jeffery Dale Welker
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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    An extremely enjoyable and educational thread. I'm glad I found it and appreciate everyone's contributions.

    I have three G-Claron lenses. A 150/9 and two 210/9's. All three show four strong, no weak, reflections. Interestingly, one of the 210/9 GC's has the SN (12 178 XXX) on the front element. The other 210/9 GC has the SN (14 401 XXX) engraved on the rear element. They both accept my Heliopan 77/49 filter step-up ring. The SN (14 555 XXX) for my 150/9 GC is on the rear element. Based upon the information I have available to me, I've assumed my GC's are all plasmats. Please correct me if you think they are dagor's.
    "I have this feeling of walking around for days with the wind knocked out of me." - Jim Harrison

  4. #34

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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Dagor GC’s should show 2 strong and 2 weak reflections per side. From the serial #s I’d say yours are plasmats

  5. #35

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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Quote Originally Posted by Salmo22 View Post
    An extremely enjoyable and educational thread. I'm glad I found it and appreciate everyone's contributions.

    I have three G-Claron lenses. A 150/9 and two 210/9's. All three show four strong, no weak, reflections. Interestingly, one of the 210/9 GC's has the SN (12 178 XXX) on the front element. The other 210/9 GC has the SN (14 401 XXX) engraved on the rear element. They both accept my Heliopan 77/49 filter step-up ring. The SN (14 555 XXX) for my 150/9 GC is on the rear element. Based upon the information I have available to me, I've assumed my GC's are all plasmats. Please correct me if you think they are dagor's.
    Weak reflections can be hard to see. A plasmat cell consists of two groups, a cemented doublet and a singlet. The singlet faces the diaphragm. The outer group is cemented, makes two strong reflections and one weak. The singlet makes two more strong reflections.

    A Dagor cell is a cemented triplet, has two air-glass interfaces, each of which makes a strong reflection, and two glass-cement-glass interfaces, each of which makes a weak reflection.

    210/9 dagor type G-Clarons have 40.5 mm filter threads, 210/9 plasmat types have 49 mm.

    Your lenses are plasmats.

  6. #36

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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    The Dagor G Claron 210 is a knockout of a lens & my favourite (caused me to part with my gold rim 8 1/4." I've never had a G Claron of either type that wasn't a gem.

  7. #37

    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Hello! This is my first post and I was looking for a 210mm dagor for my 8x10. Today I got this copy from ebay. For me it's a dagor. How do you see these reflections? Tread filter 40,5mm lenght 41mm Click image for larger version. 

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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails G-Claron210.jpg  

  8. #38

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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Quote Originally Posted by Paolo Rimini View Post
    Hello! This is my first post and I was looking for a 210mm dagor for my 8x10. Today I got this copy from ebay. For me it's a dagor. How do you see these reflections? Tread filter 40,5mm lenght 41mm
    Look at a single cell. Either will do because they're identical. Unscrew a cell from the barrel and use a point source of light.

    The cells are direct fits in a #1 shutter.

  9. #39

    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Hi Dan, Thanks. I cannot unscrew the cell but they are identical. It's a barrel lens. I want to try it with Sinar automatic shutter. In a second moment I will put it in a copal shutter, if I will be positively surprised.

  10. #40
    (Shrek)
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    Re: Recognizing dagor type G-Clarons

    Quote Originally Posted by Paolo Rimini View Post
    Hello! This is my first post and I was looking for a 210mm dagor for my 8x10. Today I got this copy from ebay. For me it's a dagor. How do you see these reflections? Tread filter 40,5mm lenght 41mm Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Dagor G_Claron.jpg 
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ID:	220407 Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Dagor G_Claron210.jpg 
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    It certainly has the barrel shape of the early Dagor-style G-Clarons. The later Plasmat ones tended to have the same style of barrel as their newer Componons.

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