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Thread: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

  1. #1

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    LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Hello there.

    As I already wrote in my introductory post, I've met a guy how got me interested in LF photography. I already read some information provided here and now I would like to get started.

    This guy told me I should start with a small size like a 4x5 because it is easier to operate. So I found a manufacturer called Intrepid Camera making fancy wooden ones and selling them at a reasonable price. Are these cameras advisable for a LF-beginner like me or should I get a used one online (http://www.cheap.forsale/large-format-camera)?

    What else do I need to start besides the LF-camera itself, a lens board, a lens, some 4x5 film and an appropriate film holder? Is it better to use an instant film? And can I use some of my DLSR equipment like my tripod or do I need to buy a special one as well?

    Sorry for all these questions but I'm a totally new to that. So any feedback is highly appreciated.

    Marcia.
    Last edited by Marcia; 5-Feb-2017 at 21:19.

  2. #2
    IanG's Avatar
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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Before buying an LF camera I'd suggest you find an LF user bear you who can show and talk you through various options, A lot depends on what budget you have available. It'll depend on what tripod you have for your DSLR and whether it's sturdy enough for an LF camera.

    Here in the UK it's possible to pick up a reasonable second-hand LF camera and lens for less than the Intrepid but you need to know what your looking for.

    Ian

  3. #3

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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    I'll second Ian's suggestion and add a bit from my personal experience.

    First, although there is a jump in quality from medium-format to 4x5, that shouldn't be the reason you choose for moving up to a 4x5 view camera. View cameras, by their nature, offer many more possibilities for processing control (single sheets instead of roll film) and image control (camera movements). Having a real desire to take advantage of one or both of these advantages should be your real motivation to move up to a view camera. Keep in mind that there are trade-offs for these capabilities. The first is time; more time for just about every aspect of shooting. Therefore, you'll pay a price in spontaneity. Close-ups are more difficult the larger-format you choose and depth-of-field gets proportionally shallower as well.

    If you find yourself, as I did years ago, cursing at your present camera because it doesn't have movements and you can't develop single shots individually, then, by all means, take the plunge. However, before you do, take a look at the different types of cameras available in 4x5. There are monorails with more bellows draw and movements that you'll likely ever need, but are primarily more at home in a studio setting. There are press cameras with viewfinder focusing (originally designed to be used hand-held) that are much more portable and easy to focus, but have limited movements and won't do really well for architectural work or other styles that require lots of movements/image control. There are also compromises between these two extremes; notably full-featured folding cameras in both metal and wood that are more portable, but still provide a decent range of movements and bellows draw for many styles of photography.

    If I were you, I'd spend some time reading up on the various types of LF cameras and see what type of camera fits your photographic style(s). In-studio portraiture and interior architectural work on-location where you can transport equipment by car might need a full-featured monorail and studio flash equipment. Field work such as wilderness landscape would want a lightweight, portable kit, etc., etc.

    There are a trove of wonderful articles on the home page of this site that will more than get you started in this regard, check it out if you haven't already http://www.largeformatphotography.info/ .

    And don't give up just because things might seem complicated. It isn't really; there's just a lot of information. A few hours of research will yield immediate results in this regard.

    Best,

    Doremus

  4. #4

    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Hello Marcia - you can certainly start with what you've already mentioned, and you can probably use your existing tripod (as the weight of a 4x5 camera is similar to a DSLR with a fast lense), and your DSLR for metering. The only things I would mention in addition are a piece of cloth to use as a focussing hood (to screen out light from the ground glass, so that it is easier to focus - you can use a t-shirt or shirt to begin with), a cable release, and possibly a loupe (to magnify the image on the ground glass, so that focus can be precise).

    On film, I avoid instant film as I have always found the results inconsistent and requiring a lot of trial and error, and hence much more expensive and frustrating than the marketing blurb suggests. I'd start with either colour slide film, or black and white. But this is a personal choice.

    For a lens, something in the 90mm - 210mm range would be a good place to start, and you can make your own choice depending on whether you tend to use shorter or longer focal lengths already. The most common lenses are in this range, and they can be found second hand easily and cheaply. Some cameras struggle to accommodate lenses shorter than 90mm, because the bellows won't compress sufficiently to support a short focal length, or lenses longer than 250mm, because the bellows won't extend enough.

    I haven't heard of the Intrepid before, but it looks like a decent field camera that is reasonable value for money. It's important to know how it packs down to a size that can be put into a back pack, because some cameras look great when set up, but are difficult to get into a backpack. Equally important is how easy the controls are to use in practice, both to set the camera up, and to effect movements. With a field camera, I'd suggest that the most important movements are front and rear tilt, and front rise, and being able to use these movements quickly and easily, while looking at the ground glass under a focussing hood, is probably the most important thing in practice. Cameras like Toyo or Walker have good reputations because they are easy to set up and use, without a lot of fuss, and would probably be worth comparing to the Intrepid. But finding a place where you can do the comparison can be difficult, and sometimes you just need to dive in.

    Good luck - LF is immensely rewarding and has taught me much, not just about photography, but about the landscape, the figure, and aesthetics.
    Last edited by David Hedley; 1-Feb-2017 at 06:13.

  5. #5

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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Buy a cheap 4x5 monorail, a 150mm or 135mm lens, a couple of film holders and film. You can probably get all this for less than the cost of the Intrepid. Once you get used to LF, learn a bit and start enjoying it, you can begin to spend money.

    Ian - "LF user bear" nice Freudian slip! I like it.

    Kumar

  6. #6

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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    All the advise is solid, just a few high points to add:

    LF is a slower operation, and yet immensely rewarding. Some things are slightly odd about it and worth thinking through upfront.

    First - film. I'm assuming you are OK with 4x5 sheet film and film holders. There are options for 120 film and backs, but best if you can start with the larger film. Its a bit fussy, but not too bad. Larger yet is harder.

    Size and weight - in studio or traveling around? How important is quick set up? Weight is also important consideration.

    Metal vs wood - they operate the same, but feel different.

    Overall configuration - an older metal monorail 4x5 is not so pricey. A folding metal camera in good shape (like a Technica) is more pricey and heavier. Wood cameras are charming and work well, if you get a good one. There are lots of cameras in-between these.

    Lenses - probably not so critical- just get a decent one. Likely tastes and interest will evolve.

    Movements - recommended. I'd recommend rise/fall, shift and tilt at least on one standard. That will give you a good amount of flexibility as you find what is important. It takes time.

    I had a heck of a time getting into LF, several efforts to find something comfortable to use. But the joy of movements is special enough.

  7. #7
    IanG's Avatar
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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Quote Originally Posted by GG12 View Post
    Overall configuration - an older metal monorail 4x5 is not so pricey. A folding metal camera in good shape (like a Technica) is more pricey and heavier. Wood cameras are charming and work well, if you get a good one. There are lots of cameras in-between these.
    Here in the UK it's possible to find a MPP MicroTechnical at a good price essentially these are British made cameras derived from Linhof technikas. I picked one up a MkIII in early September for £75 with most of a second just missing a a back - I've since found a back. I only paid a little more for a nice MkVII with a 150mm Xenar.

    Ian

  8. #8

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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Hi Marcia

    Remember that if you buy used and buy carefully, you can sell whatever you buy for what you paid for it, so the equipment can be effectively free, or close to it. Don't skimp unnecessarily, stick with mainstream brands in good condition and do your homework, and you should be fine.

  9. #9
    Jim Jones's Avatar
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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    I second Ian's recommendation of a later model MPP Micro-Technical camera. It may be slightly less versatile than a full-feature view camera and heavier than some press cameras, but is a well engineered and built camera. As Tobias suggests, experience with your first LF camera will enable you to choose your ultimate LF camera based on your own preferences, not on what others like. Feel free to ask questions here about any camera you become interested in.

  10. #10
    Tin Can's Avatar
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    Re: LF 4x5 - What to buy?

    Whatever you buy for your first camera make sure it has light tight bellows. Replacing a bellows is sometimes not the first thing a buyer wants to do and it increases the cost of the camera.

    Correction, I read your introduction post and see you are in UK.

    The Intrepid is also fine if you buy this latest model. I just got one.

    I will provide more on it in the Intrepid thread I started shortly.
    Last edited by Tin Can; 1-Feb-2017 at 08:58. Reason: UK resident

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