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Thread: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

  1. #1
    Dmitri Kouznetsov
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    Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    Hi all,

    i have a problem developing 4x5 Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100. I developed using Jobo CPP2 in 3010 drum with developers like Pyrocat HD or Adolux. While at ordinary exposures like 1 sec my negative have no problems, both films show a "moon crater" pattern on even areas like sky after a long exposures (like 1 min) through a dense filter. Perhaps i overexposure them a bit. The pattern, though relatively low-contrast, is still noticeable on optical prints. Attached are a couple of over-contrasted crops from two images (one is horizontal, another is vertical)

    Click image for larger version. 

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    does anybody ever seen this?
    thanks a lot for your suggestions..

    Dimitri.

  2. #2
    Jac@stafford.net's Avatar
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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    Are you pre-soaking the film in water?

  3. #3

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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    I have no idea the cause or the relation to long exposures, but those look like bubbles or foam to me.

  4. #4

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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    Any place you could have gotten condensation on the film before or after you exposed it?

  5. #5

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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Harding View Post
    I have no idea the cause or the relation to long exposures, but those look like bubbles or foam to me.
    Yeah that looks like bubbles from a strong photo flo prewash.

  6. #6

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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    I can't see where exposure time could cause this. It does look like condensation or, perhaps, too much in-process agitation without sufficient chemistry. Which could possibly cause the 'foam' effect. I'd run another test to see if you can replicate it.

  7. #7

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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    That's 100% certain to be foam in the developer. I've fought that stuff twice over the years. Helped a fellow on another photo forum diagnose and resolve it just a couple of months ago. Here's an example of my recent problem. You can even see how the foam is on one side of the roll (top in this picture) but goes away towards the bottom where the film is low enough to be setting in fully liquid developer.


  8. #8
    Dmitri Kouznetsov
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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    Quote Originally Posted by Jac@stafford.net View Post
    Are you pre-soaking the film in water?
    I don't

    Quote Originally Posted by Willie View Post
    Any place you could have gotten condensation on the film before or after you exposed it?
    well, i keep film in food fridge before and after exposing, not sure if this cause severe condensation. I guess not as ambient temperature and humidity in Switzerland is not high.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Sampson View Post
    .... I'd run another test to see if you can replicate it.
    It is reproducible, unfortunately... I have quite a number of good negatives spoiled with this.

    Quote Originally Posted by williaty View Post
    That's 100% certain to be foam in the developer. I've fought that stuff twice over the years. Helped a fellow on another photo forum diagnose and resolve it just a couple of months ago. Here's an example of my recent problem. You can even see how the foam is on one side of the roll (top in this picture) but goes away towards the bottom where the film is low enough to be setting in fully liquid developer.

    True, looks very similar... True also that I often observe residual foam on drum lid after processing. Any suggestion then how to reduce foam in developer? Use another one? Add a foam-calming agent?

    BTW, I also observed foam on tank lid when I develop films with D-76, but never had this problem on negatives. Perhaps, smaller quantity of developer (250ml) helps? With 250 ml I can use bidirectional rotation, while with 1/2 litre of Pyrocat HD or Adolux it is not possible, as too much inertia might destroy drum fixation.

    thanks a lot alredy for your replies, guys!!

  9. #9
    IanG's Avatar
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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    You need to clean the tank etc well with reasonably hot water, you must have a severe build up of wetting agent on the reels etc. It should be impossible to get foaming with Pyrocat HD if everything is properly cleaned after use.

    Ian

  10. #10
    8x10, 5x7, 4x5, et al Leigh's Avatar
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    Re: Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100: "moon crater" pattern on skies after a long exposure

    In well over 50 years of processing film I've never once seen foam in the developer.
    I don't even know what might cause it.

    Do you wash your tank thoroughly after each processing cycle, after the film is hung up to dry?

    It's possible you have residual photo-flo in the tank when you start processing the next roll.
    That would certainly cause bubbles, since photo-flo is soap.

    =====

    I would not recommend refrigerating film after it's been exposed.
    New film is sealed with an inert gas having very low water content.
    Once the package is opened, ambient humidity will be present.

    - Leigh
    If you believe you can, or you believe you can't... you're right.

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