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Thread: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

  1. #11
    IanG's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    Quote Originally Posted by vinny View Post
    Welcome to the large format moderators forum where every other thread is about the moderators.
    Very well put. It's now way out of hand and is more about moderators making excessive work or themselves than plain common sense.

    The For Sale & Wanted adverts worked well before the constant changes for those of us buying or selling. They won't be any better now, in fact worse as you can't ask relevant (to all) questions, or make helpful comments. That actually now goes against all this forum is about, the sharing of knowledge etc regarding LF photography, whether equipment or techniques.

    Ian

  2. #12
    Tin Can's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    Disagree

    We are free to start a discussion thread about any LF usable object.

    The ads will settle down if we let them.

    I buy here and I prefer the way it is now.

    Even before the new rules, I found a fast PM was the best way to buy.

    The few times I have sold, a knowledgeable initial price sold things.

    If it doesn't sell within 2 weeks, I take it off the market.

    And back when we could comment, I saw many things sell quickly from my interference, where I commented positively, never negatively. It's my fault.

    This bazarr is not bizarre.
    where is the monolith

  3. #13
    Unwitting Thread Killer Ari's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    The new FS rules are quite constricting, and admittedly I've sold almost nothing on this forum since the rules were implemented, but there are still many good reasons to come here.
    I don't see the harm in commenting or asking questions in a FS ad; it's our version of "hangin' out, havin' a beer", and a lot of the social fabric was gone with that rule change.
    Otherwise, it's still a place I enjoy frequenting more than any other website.

  4. #14
    8x10, 5x7, 4x5, et al Leigh's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    It's rather ridiculous to prohibit comments or questions that clarify the offering.

    After all, this site is supposed to convey information to its members, yes?

    I'm at a loss to understand all the problems with Classifieds, not just on LFP but on other sites as well.
    It's a simple matter to limit the permissible content of additional postings.

    If someone breaks those rules, delete the post and ban the person for 30 days.
    They'll get the message real quick. Only two moderator actions required, not a long string thereof.

    - Leigh
    If you believe you can, or you believe you can't... you're right.

  5. #15

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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    especially when new posts dont change the posting order on the for sale page I dont see how comments and questions in the posts should be prohibited. I was hoping that implementing the static classifieds would open things up a little to some discussion. oh well

    On off topic form the OP's gripes...

    To address, the OP, change your listing, people do search, and I do sometimes subscribe to things I am interested in, so those people may notice the changes and look again at your item.



    Quote Originally Posted by Leigh View Post
    It's rather ridiculous to prohibit comments or questions that clarify the offering.

    After all, this site is supposed to convey information to its members, yes?

    I'm at a loss to understand all the problems with Classifieds, not just on LFP but on other sites as well.
    It's a simple matter to limit the permissible content of additional postings.

    If someone breaks those rules, delete the post and ban the person for 30 days.
    They'll get the message real quick. Only two moderator actions required, not a long string thereof.

    - Leigh
    ~nicholas
    lifeofstawa
    stawastawa at gmail

  6. #16
    Moderator Ralph Barker's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    Discussions should take place in the appropriate main sub-forums, where they can be found easily in the future, not hidden within a buy-sell post that might get trimmed at some point.

  7. #17

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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    Not to be too obvious, but it seems that the initial F/S rule change was to prevent the new posts sections from being cluttered (and archived) with F/S, WTB etc postings, so maybe if the F/S, WTB sections were it's own entity where those postings would only go and stay there, and if anyone was looking for something, they would go there and all this activity would not interfere with the main forums... Sorta a sub-forum of sorts... And the forums would be clean of offerings... (Granted, offerings would have less exposure to someone who was not looking for something, but might be interested if offered, but it would seem to be a OK compromise as bumps, etc or parts the old system would be operational as before for sellers???)

    Just a thought...

    Steve K

  8. #18
    Unwitting Thread Killer Ari's Avatar
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralph Barker View Post
    Discussions should take place in the appropriate main sub-forums, where they can be found easily in the future, not hidden within a buy-sell post that might get trimmed at some point.
    But if I do a search for, say, Fujinon 90mm lens, all relevant threads containing those words will be displayed, including those that were in the classifieds.
    They're not hidden if one just uses the search function.

  9. #19
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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    The FS is just like a classified listing or a Craigslist ad. Our software lacks the features to moderate the bumping wars we used to have (and, yes, it was a problem--bumping serves those most willing to elbow others out of the way, which victimized those unwilling to bump several times a day--but if everyone bumps it spirals out of control), and adding a whole staff of moderators to deal with it is the tail wagging the dog. We all understand the importance of the for-sale forum, but we should remember that it is a supplemental service for regular members. There are already services on the Internet designed for general sales.

    If we run out of database room (which we get for free), we may delete some or all of the for-sale archive. We are therefore trying to keep substantive discussions in the main forums. There is no coffee shop in the FS forums--the coffee machine is in the main forums. The water cooler is in the Lounge.

    In any case, the mods will not consider changing the sales rules at least until we have had a chance to get used to them.

    Rick "we've been through all this before" Denney

  10. #20

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    Re: The New Marketplace Rules are Too Restrictive

    I used to sell a lot here, all antique, high quality, desirable photography items. I priced well, proven by the fact that most of my for sale items sold within between 2 hours and 2 days. For years I was able to do this to help the community, even up to the current slump in photography sales. I would be respectful of others, and only bump every week or so. As soon as they changed the algorithms to prevent "new comments" (bumps) from bringing my items to the top, my items quit selling. I mean, that day, like a light switch. So we have a "more fair" system that doesn't do what it's intent is: to allow equipment to be sent out into other owner's hands. Many new members joined to just occasionally buy stuff, but who cares?

    A few bad apples ruined a good system for everyone. Here were the problems as I see it:

    1. The intent was to not allow Dealers to sell items. But several members NEVER posted anywhere except the For Sale section. And not just one item, once a month. Dozens and dozens of items every month, from a flash cable, to a digital or 35mm camera, to a yard sale found enlarger lens. Sorry, but these are "dealers." And they are the reason an individual, occasional seller had to "bump", because when someone posts 12 items at once, you are pushed to lower pages. Did the new change that doesn't allow a new comment to come to the top, fix this problem? Nope, didn't change a thing for dealers who post 100s of items a year.

    2. Unfair bumpers. Maybe 2 out of 50 sellers tried to game the system by bumping every 2 days, for several weeks. The community usually called them out, and they had to stop. Or a moderator would have to get involved.

    3. Shill bumpers. Some people would knowingly or unknowingly bump their friends items with comments such as "this is a great buy!". We asked for that to stop, and it was greatly reduced. The new system that only allows the seller to post anything on his for Sale thread was kind of like fixing a scratch in your car with a 10 lb. sledgehammer.

    So.....here we are, and here we'll remain, I guess.

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