Feedback on moderation

[koraks]

Moderating a form is a lot of work. I know, I've been there. Overall, things are quite alright in this forum.

However, it doesn't hurt to give users some feedback if their posts are subject of moderation, or when a report has been dealt with. A simple "Sorry, had to remove your post in line with the rules" or a "Thanks for the heads up, looking in to it" goes a long way.

Again, I understand it's hard work, and a lot of work at that, and you all do it basically for free. But from experience, I can attest that it's generally more rewarding if you actually interact with people. You'd be surprised how little effort goes a long way.

Keep up the good work and thanks for your commitment.

[Oren Grad]

Thanks for your comment!

We will generally provide a reason for a post or thread deletion. On occasion we will choose not to.

The volume of reported posts is high enough that it is not realistic to expect follow-up correspondence in each case. But all "reported post" messages, without exception, are reviewed and considered. If no action is taken on a reported post, it does not mean that the report was ignored.

Specifically with respect to the FS and WTB sections, and speaking only for myself, when I'm pressed for time I may on occasion delete a nonconforming post without taking the time to fill out the "reason for deletion" field. In such instances you can take it as a given that there is a guideline violation.

If there is any question members are welcome to follow up via PM, and we will respond as soon as we reasonably can. We spend a substantial amount of time in private correspondence related to Forum guidelines, reported posts, moderation actions, and moderation non-actions. That's OK - it's part of what we're here for. The interaction is often enjoyable, too, though sometimes folks get a little overheated when things don't go the way they'd like. (I'm keeping a list of the world-historical villains I'm said to be emulating.)

These past couple of months a substantial proportion of PM's have come from people who have not noticed that the FS and WTB guidelines were revised, despite the fact that the change occurred more than two months ago, was announced in advance and again upon implementation, and has been the focus of much discussion in the News and Feedback sections both before and after implementation. It would be a big help, and very much appreciated, if everyone would a) check the "News" section at least once in a while to be sure they are aware of any relevant changes in Forum operations, and b) review the revised FS and WTB guidelines and updated FS and WTB "sticky" posts if they have not already done so, and before PM'ing us with questions about moderation actions in the FS and WTB sections.

Thanks!

[koraks]

Much appreciated for the thoughtful reply and I have to confess that although I had noticed the restructuring of the fs/wtb forums, I apparently didn't memorize the rules. It's alright though, I can imagine the workload that it brings for moderators. And I'm certainly not implying that no action is being taken on reports; I noticed they are generally dealt with very quickly, which is reassuring.
Thanks again!

[mdarnton]

I am curious about how many active moderators there are right now.
???

[Oren Grad]

Approximately two. Ralph and I are handling day-to-day housekeeping. Rick has been juggling a bunch of other responsibilities but checks in from time to time.

[Michael Kadillak]

The litmus test are numbers of active posts as a function of time over the last five years. Analogous to a business model, if you are not grown your readership posts you are a dying entity. Can you provide us with average posts per year over that time period because quite honestly the only thing that I watch is the For Sale Items. Even then folks get clipped for the most innocuous comments because it is not "allowed". I pu this in the Why Bother category. Good Gawd. We have become so affixed in the stoic guidelines it is like entering a courtroom where the rule of law applies. We are friggin photographers that from the get go are non-conformists that sometimes just like to share how they feel about a topic even if a bit of emotion is affixed to the issue.

[Jim Jones]

I consider this the best managed photographic forum by far. Of course it can't please everyone, but no other site makes so much information available with so few distractions. Policing the For Sale Items makes that forum efficient for many, even though it isn't ideal for those who might otherwise use it as a substitute for eBay.

[Michael Kadillak]

The numbers speak for the masses and that is all the matters. What do the numbers say? Is participation in the forum increasing or decreasing over the period of current moderation?

[StoneNYC]

Things like "communicate this by PM" is not helpful when the PM inbox size is so small and limiting, sometimes a discussion can go on for weeks before a sale is made, meanwhile all the pertinent info is deleted because there's not enough space.

Actual for-profit business are encouraged here while the regular people are discouraged. The whole point of this site not having a subscriber model was to avoid favoritism toward commerce oriented posters.

People with useful info's posts are deleted because it violates some unknown rule, except most of the knowledgeable people don't have the time to waste reading every single new rule all the time or remembering them all, only those who spend their lives on the forum could possibly remember. The people who are actual DO-ERS don't have that kind of time, they see their post deleted and they stop bothering. This leaves us with a forum full of opinions and no knowledgeable people.

This forum has gone down hill so fast and good people are bailing. The majority still posting often have virtually nothing of informative value to contribute because they have no real world experience, just pre-read knowledge and regurgitated opinion.

And it's all because one person is on a crusade to "fix" things.

Any serious effort to acknowledge the problem is eventually deleted from existence by that person when they start to look bad, like the previous MULTIPLE "too much moderation" threads which have all been deleted.

It's BAD, really really bad... We are losing our community, they won't come back... We are bleeding good people...

It's just all so unreasonable, people have lives, they can't all be expected to know all the rules and it turns people off to have their work deleted.

Try messaging someone for once "hey, just so you know, this post isn't good because of X, can you go and fix it please?" (This would require allowing a larger edit window before something is no longer editable) or simply LEAVING THE POST ALONE with a kind PM "hey, just so you know, in the future can you try and avoid X?" That's much more friendly and welcoming.

[Richard Wasserman]

Things like "communicate this by PM" is not helpful when the PM inbox size is so small and limiting, sometimes a discussion can go on for weeks before a sale is made, meanwhile all the pertinent info is deleted because there's not enough space.

Actual for-profit business are encouraged here while the regular people are discouraged. The whole point of this site not having a subscriber model was to avoid favoritism toward commerce oriented posters.

People with useful info's posts are deleted because it violates some unknown rule, except most of the knowledgeable people don't have the time to waste reading every single new rule all the time or remembering them all, only those who spend their lives on the forum could possibly remember. The people who are actual DO-ERS don't have that kind of time, they see their post deleted and they stop bothering. This leaves us with a forum full of opinions and no knowledgeable people.

This forum has gone down hill so fast and good people are bailing. The majority still posting often have virtually nothing of informative value to contribute because they have no real world experience, just pre-read knowledge and regurgitated opinion.

And it's all because one person is on a crusade to "fix" things.

Any serious effort to acknowledge the problem is eventually deleted from existence by that person when they start to look bad, like the previous MULTIPLE "too much moderation" threads which have all been deleted.

It's BAD, really really bad... We are losing our community, they won't come back... We are bleeding good people...

It's just all so unreasonable, people have lives, they can't all be expected to know all the rules and it turns people off to have their work deleted.

Try messaging someone for once "hey, just so you know, this post isn't good because of X, can you go and fix it please?" (This would require allowing a larger edit window before something is no longer editable) or simply LEAVING THE POST ALONE with a kind PM "hey, just so you know, in the future can you try and avoid X?" That's much more friendly and welcoming.

I concur with most of what Stone has stated. The forum has lost a great deal of vibrancy and has gotten somewhat boring. In the past things might have been a bit chaotic and imperfect, but such is life.