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Thread: Defective film or what...?

  1. #1
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    Defective film or what...?

    I bought (on ebay) an un-opened, sealed box of Fuji Super HR-T 8X10 X-ray film in Feb of 2013. It has sat un-opened on a shelf in an air-conditioned room since then. Ran out of my box of CSX X-ray film a few weeks back and loaded up the Fuji. Processed 7 sheets today that were shot a couple days ago. Processed in hangers as I have been processing all my 8X10 X-ray film lately. Six negs have an odd streak, all in the same location in the sky (see red arrow below) -



    And all the negs have hundreds of tiny circular low density spots, especially visible in the sky.



    All these negs are un printable now. I can not think of anything I may have done differently than usual. I pulled out an unexposed sheet to see if I could see any of these problems on an un processed sheet - nothing.

    I have another un opened box of a different brand of film. I guess I will do two exposures - one with the Fuji and one with the other film, process together and see what the results are.

    Suggestions?
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/52893762/bigger4b.jpg

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    Surely high-density dots? (dark on negative = light on scan/print)

    What do the negatives look like under a loupe rather than on a scan?

    It's often much more useful online to see a picture of the original negative on a lightbox rather than an inverted scan.

    I think most types of xray film have emulsion both sides - perhaps an inspection of both sides would help determine.

    fwiw, if i saw this on one of my own negatives, I'd assume darkroom contamination first and foremost

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    So what color do the spots look like on the neg??? (White, black, clear etc) And is that "bow" crescent in the sky maybe a difference in thickness in the emulsion??? (Hold up the neg to a point source light, like a light bulb and view through it... Then reflect light off both sides and see if there is a difference in thickness...) Then pull another sheet from the middle of the "deck" and do a full test and see if it too is funky... Probably a bad batch of film, but see if it is only happening to the end sheets...

    I say end sheets because I just tested some old Tri-X and it was OK, but I used the last sheets in the box, and the end 2 sheets had several clear bubble like pinholes, so I'm wondering if maybe the end sheets had more of a chance to dry out, or sit on something hot or cold, etc... (but the edge density was even, and the other sheets in the run were fine...) And this was with a proper pre-soak... So maybe not like your problem, but just mentioning...

    Call me crazy or sloppy, but I have seen more oddball QC problems popping up on sheet film fairly recently than over many years/many thousands of sheets of film that I shot/processed/handled over the years...

    Steve K

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    Yes, "hi density" spots rather than low - the spots are dark on the neg, not black, just a darker grey, lighter on the inverted scan. As far as the curved mark, I am wondering if the two sheets are touching as they develop. They are each in their own film hanger but the hangers are touching as they sit in the tank, and as I agitate. Could be that the film can touch each other since they are so big and flexible. I just realized that the only sheet that did not have that curved mark was processed by its self....but... a month or so ago I processed about 10-12 sheets, same method, two at a time and no curved mark.
    As for the small round dots. I initially started suspecting defective film. I didn't think it could be any kind of contamination. I also started suspecting it could have been condensation. When I shot those farm pics the film holders went from air conditioned house to air conditioned car. When we got to the farm I set my film holder bag in the shade of my camera as I focused / composed. It was not real hot, say 80 - 85 but it was humid.

    So, I did a test late yesterday - loaded one film holder with the suspected Fuji X-ray film and a sheet of another film. Set camera up on back patio and exposed both sheets and processed. Both sheets have the dots. Again, holder went from air conditioned house to warm and humid.

    My fixer is old, not completely exhausted, but very used. My dev was freshly mixed from concentrated Arista Premium Liquid.

    I guess I'll try another test, shoot one neg in doors, so no chance of condensation, shoot the other out doors in the humid hot air, and process in fresh chems.
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/52893762/bigger4b.jpg

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    fixer

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    Quote Originally Posted by pdh View Post
    fixer
    I am hoping it is that simple.
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/52893762/bigger4b.jpg

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    The line looks like you bent the film and it's just a mark from the base having a crease in it.

    The bubbles I've seen in REALLY old film, but we are talking like 1960's

    Question, do these sheets have a paper separation interleaved between the film sheets?

    It's weird, doesn't look like mold, doesn't look like that frost condensation (that cracks the emulsion) hmm a mystery...

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    Re: Defective film or what...?

    I am suspecting...and I hate to admit this, as I have been processing film since I was 11 years old (1969)...I believe the dots are possibly a result of sloppy lab procedures. As I have been under employed for a few years now, and have been un employed since the end of Jan, I try to save where ever I can. I have let my fixer go to the point of having to filter it through a linen hanky before every use as there are so much black flakes floating in it from all the silver coating the inside of the bottle. Fixer still clears the X-ray film in a minute so I figured I would just keep on going.
    Well, I usually soak the linen hanky filter in water, rinsing and soaking as I process, then I hang it to dry. I know that a few weeks back when I processed, I didn't soak my filter hanky after pouring the fix through it, I just rinsed it a couple times then hung to dry.
    I noticed on the film in question, even to the point of looking at it under a microscope, that many of those dots have a microscopic dot in the center, like something crystalline had adhered to the emulsion, causing it to react in some fashion.

    Anyway, I have mixed fresh fix and will report my results soon. As for the long arched mark, I have no idea. Will see what happens when I process next couple sheets...
    https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/52893762/bigger4b.jpg

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