Bob Salomon, the Heliopan trademark, and ebay

[Bob Salomon]

"Bob I think I understand your point, but in all honesty I think you are losing the propaganda war here. I don't see how this issue in the used market is hurting you. If the seller is misrepresenting something he will get called on it by the buyer."

What you seem to have missed is that this is not because he was selling a Heliopan item. We did not stop his selling his Heliopan filter.

We stopped him using the Heliopan name in a listing for a non Heliopan item.

[Donald Hutton]

Bob

By having my listing removed, you were not in fact protecting your trademark, you were helping Ebay enforce their listing poilicies. I did not legally violate your trademark: I violated an Ebay listing policy, so do not attempt to imply that I was violating your trademark in any way and that your actions were intended to defend you trademark.

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Bob,

I've read this whole darn thread, and I still don't get it.

Because some people were/are violating or attempting to violate our Trademark and this makes us enforce every violation that we find. We can not selectively try to enforce violations.

OK, I understand this, but...

These are Ebay's rules for selling items on their site. Unfortunately many or most listers do not seem to be familiar with them. If they were these kinds of misunderstandings/problems would disappear.

We are not accusing you of knowingly violating or trying to circumvent policy. You just fell into a violation.

So, what are you enforcing here, your Heliopan trademark or eBay's keyword spamming policy? Seriously, you state above the reason behind all this is to enforce any, and all, violations of your Heliopan trademark. However, Don's eBay listing did not violate your trademark in any way, shape or form. He was not attempting to sell a new, "gray market" Heliopan filter, he was not selling to the US market from another country, nor was he attempting to sell a counterfeit Heliopan filter. So, exactly how does, "See my other auctions for some Heliopan and B+W filters" violate your Heliopan trademark (hint, it deosn't)?

What you have enforced is eBay's policy against keyword spamming. This policy is designed to prevent sellers from putting a bunch of other brand names, terms or keywords in their listings to fool eBay's search function. I have seen many auctions where sellers will hide a list of keywords (sometimes several hundred) by using tiny white text on a white background, just for the sole purpose of getting search function hits. While technically, Don's listing may violate eBay's keyword spamming policy, it is a VERY minor infraction compared to true and deliberate keyword spamming. So, eBay pulled his listing for violating their policy, not any infringement of your Heliopan trademark.

I hope eBay is paying you for you time. In this particular case, you did absolutely nothing to protect your Heliopan trademark, and seem to have alienated one past customer and some possible future customers in the process. But, at least you saved eBay from the embarrassment of an extremely minor and inconsequential violation of their keyword spamming policy. Seriously Bob, I can understand a staunch defense of your legal rights, but don't you think you went a bit overboard here?

Kerry

[S. Wang]

"In this case he was not reporting the income to Medicare or IRS or the state he was in. Nor was he collecting sales tax on sales within his state. However he was competing with legitimate stores with rents to pay, employees to pay, families to feed, insurance to pay, taxes to pay, registration and license fees to pay. "

Bob, are you an IRS's Revenue Agent to policy on E*bay?

[Thilo Schmid]

Kirk,

I think there is nothing wrong if someone sells your pictures as long as he does not sell unauthorized copies of your work. But what would you say, if someone - not Sherrie Levine - sells his own pictures and writes in the description "after Kirk Gittings XYZ" ? It might be less objectionable if he writes "I also sell pictures from Kirk Gettings", but this does not make a big difference to me . I cannot believe that you don't mind, if someone searches for "Kirk Gettings" at ebay and hits a Familiy Album Snapshot.

[Bob Salomon]

"Bob, are you an IRS's Revenue Agent to policy on E*bay?"

No. we were making someone who was effecting our dealer's business and our business play by the rules.

How would you like to have to match prices in your business with someone who pays no city, state, county or federal taxes or license fees or registration fees or rent or insurance and at the same time is drawing 100% disability payments from the taxes that you pay?

[Donald Hutton]

I am effecting your and your dealer's business by my actions???!! Please explain



I pay taxes; I am not a dealer - I am a private individual selling a few items second hand which I no longer require; which I purchased new in the US from a Heliopan US dealer.



The irony of this all is that I was selling these bits and pieces I no longer use to raise some money to upgrade my 10 year old 150mm lens to a........APO Sironar-S. And I am doing your business harm. I can assure you, I will certainly not be buying a US model APO Sironar -S under any circumstances.... My 10 year old Symmar-S Schneider has never looked more sensible.

[tim atherton]

"APO Sironar-S. And I am doing your business harm. I can assure
you, I will certainly not be buying a US model APO Sironar -S under any
circumstances.... "

You could always see if there is a US dealer who will sell you a legitimate parallel import. Or else just buy Schneider

[Kirk Gittings]

Thilo,

That is not a valid comparison here. You are missing the point. It was more like Don saying I am selling a Minor White over here and by the way if you are interested I am also selling a Kirk Gittings over there. I would have no objections to that at all.

As I understand it HE WAS NOT MISREPRESENTING THE SALE!!!!! He was merely refering people to more items he was selling which included (UNFORTUNATELY for him!!!) a Heliopan filter.

By their own words, I've got to say that this thread is a bad reflection on HP Marketing who completely overreacted to a clients honest fopa (sp?). This is just paranoid legal blustering and an apology is in order in my opinion.

[tim atherton]

"fopa (sp?). " Faux pas - literally, false step