Thread sizes of old compur 0s and 1s?

[Peter Yeti]

According to ads from the late 1930s, rim set compurs also came in sizes 0s and 1s besides the more common sizes 0 and 1. Does anyone here know the thread dimensions of those "s" shutters, especially the 0s? I searched and searched but couldn't find anything. Any info would be highly appreciated.

Peter

[Dan Fromm]

Peter, have you looked here: http://www.suaudeau.eu/memo/pratique...centraux.html?

Benoit's list is pretty complete, says nothing about 0s and 1s Compurs. If you have any in hand and later shutters without the "s", why don't you try swapping cells?

I just checked P-H Pont's Compur chronology. He suggests that the suffix "s" indicates that the shutter has a self-timer.

[Peter Yeti]

Thank you for the interesting link, Dan. But as you say, nothing about the 0s or 1s. If I had such a shutter at hand, I wouldn't ask, I simply would measure.

There was an early Compound shutter, a tad bit larger than the standard Compur 0. The cell threads were 31.3mm rather than 29.5mm (and rather than the 30.7mm Benoit is stating for the Compound, that's the inner diameter of the shutter thread). Since both Compound and Compur were made by Friedrich Deckel Munich, I wonder if the 0s is the size of the Compound? I also have a Bausch&Lomb Automat shutter of the same dimensions.

Any more info?

Peter

[Xipho]

I think I have two Size 0s Rim shutters...

The look like normal 0 from there front outer dimensions, but the rear lens is smaller (maybe 27?) and the rear mount is also smaller, about 29mm i guess.
One shutter is from a Voigtländer 6x9 Roll Film Camera (with Heliar), the other from a Zeiss Ikon Maximar 207/3 with a Tessar.
This might be the 0s size, but it is only my guess...

[IanG]

There's some none standard Dial set Compurs but the Rimset #0 & #1 are quite standard unless they have inserts to reduce the diameter which is far more common with Pronto/Prontor shutters than Compur.

One problem is amongst the shutters I own are some Compur #0s and #1s, or put another way Compur #0 & #1 shutters as the "s" adds the plural in English. I have a lot of BJP Almanac and other adverts for Compur shutters in the 30's and as Dan says I've not seen variations of the rimset #0 & #1 listed.

Ian

[Xipho]

today i found a scan of a Schneider Advertisment, in German, where some lenses, esp the 4.5/105 and 130 are listed with the 0s shutter.

It is existing, and has nothing to to with an english plural.!
And it has no reduction inserts, as the outhet mount diameter is only 29!

here:

http://photo.net/large-format-photography-forum/005cZQ

(the book scans)

[IanG]

You can't take that as their being a different size, all the lenses in standard sized #0 & #1 are listed as being in 0s or 1s shutters by Schneider (pre-WWII rimset) and they are standard sizes. As Dan pointed out the "s" is most likely to indicate it has a self timer.

Ian

[Xipho]

A real size 0 lens has front and back same size, thes lenses definitely have a smaller rear element, that defines 0s (small)
There were no compur with self timers in the 1930s for Lf and plate cameras...

I have two 0s shutters here, they are for real. But from the front side they look like a Common size 0.

Schneider is a "serious" company, so if they list lenses for 0s Shutter, it exists.
The list from schneider is only for the triplet radionar, so they were all made for s-shutters maybe that the smaller mount can be fitted to more (smaller and cheaper) cameras....

just buy a Maximar 207/3 and you get a 0s compur Rim Set shutter....

[IanG]

I looked at a complete Schneider catalogue and EVERY #0 and #1 shuttered lens is listed as either a 0s or a 1s and many are lenses that are always in regular sized shutters. The S isn't a different size with these shutters.

There's no mystery S sizes, a 1931 Voigtlander advert clears that up, it states the "Compur S" is identical to the new model Compur (rimset) shutters with "a self-releasing device incorporated, in other words a delayed action.

Only the #0 & 1#1 sizes were available as Compur S.



Ian

[Xipho]

thank you for your info about the self-timer, have to check if my shitters have this feature, did not know it...

This shutter is a Compur S (large S) In the lens lists there small letters used 0s, 1s

So I think S is the signature for the timer, which is not incorporated in the normal compur Rim Set, and s is the signature for the smaller rear mount.
If it stands here that the "S" is only in sizes 0 and 1, (excluding 00 and 2,3) there is nothing said that the shutter is not made in the symmetric and in the unsymmetric type.

The lenses in the catalougues are delivered without shutters, why should Schneider then label the size with a "S" shutter type when there are compur ans compur S existing?
The labels 0,1,0s and 1s are only size labels, as there were also other shutters of this sizes and not only compur S....

Obviously there are a lot of lenses existing that have the smaller back mount (including the famous 4.4/105 Tessar) so compur had to make shutter where this lenses fit, because they had to sell their shutters.

Anyway, my unsymmetric 0 shutters exist and I dont think that I am rich now because I own the only two existing prototypes... They even make so e problems because they dont fit very well in a size 0 lens plate, as the hole is too big for the shutter.

Post-1945, only the normal symmetric sizes 00,0,1,3 were made...

this is one of my 0s? shutters, backside photo can be provided next week



K5HAVoigtl\'e4nder Heliar - Macro Test Old Lenses -Sonnar by xipho68, auf Flickr}