WTF do you mean? You mean not screwing your models? EW may have been a successful artist, but I'd hardly call abandoning your family in the pursuit of tail to be a moral or professional exemplar to follow. And I don't think his photographic success or greatness had anything to do with his morals or lack thereof - He would still have taken great images if he became a celibate monk, or if he had remained with his first wife.Originally Posted by Bill_1856
I doubt it. (And don't accuse me of condoning his lifestyle, Scott.)
Last edited by neil poulsen; 20-Jan-2015 at 13:03.
Wilhelm (Sarasota)
There has been a long history of excusing artists of what general society considers misbehavior due to their artistic "greatness". It's not of course a settled matter. But we're both indulging in speculative history, because he did produce great work both before and after he left his wife for his models. I tend to favor the idea that those possessed of artistic vision will express it no matter the circumstances, and while hardship or comfort will influence the output, neither hardship nor comfort will prevent it from happening.
I don't know about EW's personal relationships with his models - at what point did the relationship transform from professional to intimate? I'm not excusing the behavior either, but I have less of an ethical quandary over the transformation of the relationship if it were a case of "hey, we've been working together for three, six, whatever months now, do you feel the same way that I feel?" as opposed to, "So we're going to take some pictures today...what's your name again? and then the SEX!".
The start of his relationship with Charis is definitely covered in the daybooks. And it wasn't the latter scenario :-) I'd recommend reading them if you haven't.
I haven't read them. I'll break down and get a copy.
My original point, to get back to the topic of the thread, was that working with a model in a professional situation, especially when you don't know/don't have a long-established working relationship with them, is that hands off is the way to go. If you are both attracted to one another, I don't see it as being a big deal and some huge ethical problem to get frisky, so long as you are both unencumbered by other pre-existing relationships.
I'm not suggesting that inputs from the pelvic brain have no place in doing nude work - you'd make some pretty boring photos if there were no eros in the image. But if you would rather your reputation be Patrick Demarchelier than Terry Richardson, give the pelvic brain a voice at the table, not the chairmanship of the organization, so to speak.
John- I did a bit of nude modeling (many years, and a few pounds/gray hairs ago). Once was for a woman working on her Master's thesis. One time was for a friend, where my ex-wife and I modeled for him. The decision to work with them was based on a few factors. 1- I respected their work, and professionalism. 2- I had wanted to shoot nudes, but wanted to know what it felt like to be on the other side of the lens. My desire to shoot nudes was put on the back burner for many years, and I finally started a few years ago. I think my modeling experience has served me well, though. A bit better understanding of the feeling of vulnerability, as well as being better able to direct models without infringing on their "safe-space". I don't think modeling nude is a prerequisite for successfully shooting nudes, though. Basic common sense regarding respect, boundaries, communicating your ideas, and professionalism is much more important.
The strangest I felt was at the opening of the thesis show. Her project involved multiple exposures, with me appearing about six times in each large print (from 4x5), which were taken in a wooded area of France. It was obvious the person in the photos was me, and I felt like saying, "my eyes are up here" a few times...Still, I really liked what she had done, and left the show proud of being a part of it.
In most of my nude work, I don't reveal the model's face, and when they've come to my openings, I never introduce them as my subjects. A few have identified themselves, while others preferred to remain anonymous. I consider that their decision, and always let them know they'd be hanging, so they could choose not to come, if they'd be uncomfortable. So far, they've all chosen to come to the openings...
I've always found it a strange thing to hear of photographers who make an erotic photograph but who feel nothing but professionalism regarding the model. But maybe that speaks to the key different between a professional photographer and an artist.
--Darin
I can't speak to making an erotic photo, because I have never made one. But I do make artistic nude photos, and I can say that, at least for myself, the furthest thing from my mind while in the act of making the photo is anything sexual. I would not have believed either before I started in this genre, but I think this is typical.
But then there are the dreaded "guy with a camera" types, and for them the entire event is purely sexual.
Hey Greg,
Forgive me for putting you on the spot a bit--but I went to your web page and looked at the nudes there. They look to be all young, beautiful females. Sexually attractive females, some could be Playboy models.
Are you saying that there are no sexual thoughts in your mind when shooting or are you saying that there is nothing sexual about your photographic intent?
--Darin
Both
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote
Bookmarks