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Thread: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

  1. #11
    Andrew "The RedSun"
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    I have both CPP and CPE, but have not used for the CPP for a long time. I've never had any problem with 2509 reel. No need for the 2508 film loader. But I always put on the film holder on the reel.

    There is only one speed on my CPE2+. So can't compare much. Again, no problem with 2502 reel either.

  2. #12
    http://www.spiritsofsilver.com tgtaylor's Avatar
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    To add to my post above, I have 2 2509N reels and 2521 tanks which I purchased new and used them exclusively for a year or two to develop 4x5 B&W sheet film by the hand inversion method. It wasn't until after I had been using them for over a year that I started getting density irregularity at the edge - especially in the sky region. At first I thought it was due to not having enough chemistry in the tank but I always filled it to the rim of the spigot. I stopped developing B&W by the hand inversion method and switched to rotary processing with these reels and tanks and the problem disappeared. Since I never experienced this problem in the beginning and only later appeared a year or two later, I believe that it may have resulted to a build-up of photo-flo on the reel. Before I use to always put of couple of drops of photo-flo in the tank and let it sit for a minute before dumping. Now I remove the sheets from the reel 2 at a time and place in a plastic file box that holds a liter of photo-flo which is enough volume to cover. Photo-flo may have built up enough on the reel to impede the flow of chemistry in that area as far as hand inversion is concerned but I never have that problem when rotary processing probably because the chemistry is more forcefully circulated.

    As far as the volume of chemistry is concerned, my favorite (but not exclusive!) elixir is Xtol which I use 1:1 and never had a problem following Kodak's recommendation of 100mL of stock per 8x10 equivalency or 500mL of solution per 10 sheets of 4x5.

    Thomas

    PS: Forgot to add, no problems so far when processing 120 by hand inversion even though I place the photo flo in the tank. Only had the problem with the 2509N reels.
    Last edited by tgtaylor; 30-May-2014 at 18:36. Reason: PS

  3. #13
    Andrew "The RedSun"
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    Jobo says clearly that no photo-flo with reels. For 1502, I remove the film from reel and soak in another empty tank. For sheet film, I use a tiny tray.

    As to the expert drum, I never have one. It is expensive and sounds fragile since it has thin walls. But some folks like them.

  4. #14
    Unwitting Thread Killer Ari's Avatar
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    Excellent results are possible using the reels, and using the Expert drum.
    More care has to be taken using the reels, previous posts here attest to that.
    The Expert drums are almost foolproof, and are well worth the investment; they always give perfect results by simply following Jobo's recommendations.
    If you get an Expert drum, you won't ever miss loading reels.

  5. #15

    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    I have only used 2509n and the CPE2+. No problems whatsoever with B&W or color slides.

  6. #16

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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    I've used both and didn't notice any differences between either or. The 2500 reels are nice because you can load 12 sheets at a time. I usually use a rotary but sometimes the manual reel, same results. I also use photo flo and have had zero problems. This works for me, might not others.

  7. #17
    Mark
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    Quote Originally Posted by Lenny Eiger View Post
    You want full development for whatever time you have chosen. Adding the variable of exhaustion in there is unnecessary...

    Just my opinion,

    Lenny
    Another opinion:
    I primarily use the 2509n reels in my CPP2 processor. When developing one reel, the tank suggests 270ml of solution. I usually use HC-110 developer which I dilute 31:1 so to make measuring easier I mix up 320ml of solution for my 6 sheets, double that if I am using 2 reels with 12 sheets I do twice that. I've processed hundreds of sheets of film this way and never had an issue. If using a really dilute developer, you might want to make sure that there is enough, but with the aggressive agitation that Jobo gives you, I think that depletion is less of an issue.

  8. #18

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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    Quote Originally Posted by jerrybro View Post
    Interesting. I've used these for years and have never had that happen.
    I know, it's odd because many told me not to buy the MOD54 telling me it would leave streaks and uneven spots and scratches and sheets would fall out, and none of that ever happened to me.

    I have an old JOBO CPE (original not 2) so maybe it's rougher with it's rotation cycle than be newer processors?

    Could have been a fluke, it's only happened once so far...

  9. #19
    Cor's Avatar
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    Re: jobo 4x5 reels vs expert drums

    I have used the 2509n reel in the past, and with PyrocatHD and slow rotation on my CPE+ I did observe quite consistent edge build up density. Switching to a Expert 3010 solved this problem. I use the Expert drum on a Simma roller base at room temperature. OTOH I did not have this extra edge density with the the reel when using other developers such as Xtol. Nowadays I use the Expert for all my film, it is slightly faster working compared to filling and draining the Jobo (due to space and time constrains0

    best,

    Cor

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