Use of X-ray film: technical discussion with example images

Wow, so 645 pages in and this topic is WELL covered. Many thanks to those who have done the hard, and apparently somewhat controversial legwork.

I am an experienced photographer in many ways, and won't say much more than that. I am however, new to shooting X-ray film in a camera. I have a box of the Fuji Green in 8x10 coming this week. I will be playing with it alongside paper negatives which I have been shooting since the 90's.

I am very comfortable mixing developers from scratch and doing my own testing. My densitometer is stuck in storage in Utah right now, so I won't be able to plot the x-ray film and compare developers. My end goals are to make both GSP's as well as pt/pd contact prints. I have a 'Dorff 8x10 and a Korona 12x20 as my main landscape cameras.

So, the question is, has anyone done any curve testing of the green and/or blue film with the various developers (and apparently yellow is the filter of choice with the green film)?

If this is ground which is well trodden, I apologize. I have found many threads where each practitioner has their developer/filtration/developing method of choice, and am having a difficult time deciding which developer to use. I will tray develop them one sheet at a time.

Thanks again and bravo to the brave ones who have stuck with this media for so long.

I think a lot of developers will work just fine depending on what you want and what you prefer. Sorry if that's vague, but that's my take from the thread. Personally, I use Pyrocat in a tank with hangers. I find that works best for me. It's my experience, for me, that the film almost never scratches with this method. I believe from my own experience and from reading this thread, that the Pyrocat tans the emulsion and that helps prevent scratches. I think hardening fixer, which some propose, comes too late in the process - there are plenty of opportunities to scratch during development and stop.

It also helps that I have used this developer for a long time with traditional films, so maybe I'm biased. There are other developers that would also tan the emulsion.

I think you really have to work out your own system.
Good luck.
John

I confess I don't experiment much anymore

I just do, using very simple process

Hi Kimberly, I also use pyrocat and film hangers to develop 8x10. It works extremely well for GSP’s and palladium. Pyrocat, for me, is cost effective and works beautifully as I only use a minuscule amount of solution A and B added to about 4 liters of water. I develop 5 sheets at a time. I have also processed 11x14 and 14x17 in tray, and for me a larger sheet of old lith film in the bottom protected the x-ray film from getting scratched. The old lith film was nice too because I could carry the X-ray film on top of it to the next tray and never had a single scratch using this technique. Never had any luck developing more than one sheet of the larger film in a tray, anytime I added more sheets there were always developing issues.

I am very, very familiar with Pyro developers. I am happy to hear Brian and J.E. are both having good success with Pyrocat. I will get my chems in order and plan to start using pyrocat for my own tray developing in flat-bottomed trays. Any pointers for ISO and filtration? I was going to start with a medium yellow and ISO 100-ish? I have 100 sheets and it is very inexpensive, and I will do some ring-around tests when I get close to the ISO which is usable.

Thanks for both of your posts!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kimberly A

has anyone done any curve testing of the green and/or blue film with the various developers

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The producers themselves have published curves. Problem is finding them. I so far have some for Kodak, but did not search for Fuji and Agfa, maybe in the future. Ofcourse they give curves for their own developer that they mention only by name. From the data sheet of the developer you can guess what type of developer it is, but I have not seen exact recipies. Although there should not be much difference between developers intended for X-ray development. On the other side, maybe for the emulsions with T crystals they did use special developers.

I shoot at iso 125 and use no filtration. My current X-ray film is Kodak S-ra but have used several different kinds and they all seem about the same, I mostly use natural light and use a Packard shutter. Attachment 243231Attachment 243232Attachment 243233
The first image is silver gelatin and the second is cyanotype that is tea toned. These prints are just test prints, to see what is possible. Third image is another cyanotype tea toned. I haven’t done a palladium print in a number of years but find cyanotype and palladium pretty similar as far as negative contrast is concerned.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...38c9e8b2_b.jpgMakina II HRU Handheld by Nokton48, on Flickr

6.5x9cm Plaubel Makina II HANDHELD Fuji HRU cut from 8x10. RADA plate holder with film insert, Plaubel Yellow filter. 1/200 at f6. 5x7 Aristo #2 Omega DII 4x5 glass carrier Multigrade developer. I produced four perfect negatives from this shoot. Successful test with no scratches. This film scratches very easilty

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kimberly A

Wow, so 645 pages in and this topic is WELL covered. Many thanks to those who have done the hard, and apparently somewhat controversial legwork.

I am an experienced photographer in many ways, and won't say much more than that. I am however, new to shooting X-ray film in a camera. I have a box of the Fuji Green in 8x10 coming this week. I will be playing with it alongside paper negatives which I have been shooting since the 90's.

I am very comfortable mixing developers from scratch and doing my own testing. My densitometer is stuck in storage in Utah right now, so I won't be able to plot the x-ray film and compare developers. My end goals are to make both GSP's as well as pt/pd contact prints. I have a 'Dorff 8x10 and a Korona 12x20 as my main landscape cameras.

So, the question is, has anyone done any curve testing of the green and/or blue film with the various developers (and apparently yellow is the filter of choice with the green film)?

If this is ground which is well trodden, I apologize. I have found many threads where each practitioner has their developer/filtration/developing method of choice, and am having a difficult time deciding which developer to use. I will tray develop them one sheet at a time.

Thanks again and bravo to the brave ones who have stuck with this media for so long.

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Kimberly,

Welcome to the downtrodden world of xray photography, where we get only one message to tack onto 10K times. Are you getting HR-U? Likely a T-grained emulsion from my research.

I've done a few curves by hand, but don't share as a rule, since I use non-standard scales. Pyrocat is used mostly by people who want different densities for alternate process vs silver prints. Higher contrast in UV vs visible light. I doubt they toughen the extremely soft emulsions on both sides of the film enough to make any processing difference. Personally, I refuse to use any pyro developer due to health concerns. These films are designed for higher contrast than camera films and are coated on both sides which complicates processing. Lower energy developers and careful handling are required.

For single sheet tray developing you need flat bottomed trays, or a sheet of glass or plexiglass to flatten a normal tray bottom. Ziplock poly bags also work well. D-23 diluted from 1:3 to 1:7 is a good soft-working developer that likely gives greater resolution at higher dilutions to these lower-than-normal resolution films, their main shortcoming to me. Yellow or green filters give slightly better sharpness. Yellow will take 2x versus about 4x exposure times for green.

Determining exposure times for this ortho film is difficult for many. I bought an old Gossen Luna-Pro for this, and am getting better results than I did with a phone app. CdS cells are similarly orthochromatic. Some use yellow or green filters over their meters. You will need to calibrate everything for your own custom use including developer, metering, lens shutter and aperture, etc. Great for DIY types.

I use very dilute (30g/liter) plain fixer, and find the film clears very quickly in about 3 minutes, so suspect the film is very thin and soft. When dry, it handles like any film, but stays much flatter due to double coating. Have fun with your new toys.

Alan Townsend

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kimberly A

I am very, very familiar with Pyro developers. I am happy to hear Brian and J.E. are both having good success with Pyrocat. I will get my chems in order and plan to start using pyrocat for my own tray developing in flat-bottomed trays. Any pointers for ISO and filtration? I was going to start with a medium yellow and ISO 100-ish? I have 100 sheets and it is very inexpensive, and I will do some ring-around tests when I get close to the ISO which is usable.

Thanks for both of your posts!

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Hi Kimberly, I've been working with Green-latitude XRAY (double-sided) for 15 years. Lovely stuff. Took a while to get used to, though. I've made curves mainly with Pyrocat-HD (EI 80), as well reciprocity correction curves. A few years ago I settled on D-23 1+1. EI 100. These negatives just had the right amount of snap in the shadows, compared to Pyrocat-HD. I've also done work with filters, mainly yellows, greens, blues, and even a red #25... But that required an exposure increase of 9x, and resulted in very contrasty negatives... Somewhere in this long thread, I have most of my findings posted, including development methods. I've settled on flat-bottomed trays.