Use of X-ray film: technical discussion with example images

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Originally Posted by koraks

Do you use double sided film? I have a jobo print tank that I never use and I'd love to be able to use it for xray 8x10s, but I don't see how I could get even development without resorting to stripping the emulsion off the backside. Is that the approach that you take or have you found a more elegant way?
As to the VdB sensitizer: I used to mix batches of 50ml or 200ml, but I found that the results were not entirely consistent between fresh and older sensitizer, so I switched to mixing it fresh. It also gives more flexibility in varying the recipe this way. I sometimes add more or less tartaric acid to control the contrast. Especially rising the tartaric acid concentration upwards of 1.5% w/v of the mixed sensitizer (below that point dmax suffers) gives some possibilities of boosting the contrast without the speed penalty and toxicity of using dichromate. I suppose everyone has their own ways of going about alt processes and I'll probably keep adjusting my methods as well.

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Yes i use double sided film occasionally. The cylinders which hold the film in Expert drums are barrel shaped enabling chemicals to get to both sides of the film. I have never stripped the emulsion off the back side as it reduces the contrast too much and is a waste of time as far as I am concerned. Your approach to VDB is interesting to me. I may give it a try to see if it suits my methods.

Stripping literally cuts the DR in half. You also end up with a muddy looking, grainier image. Definitely a waste of time. If you have to strip, then best to use a single-sided film like Ektascan.

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Originally Posted by Jim Noel

Yes i use double sided film occasionally. The cylinders which hold the film in Expert drums are barrel shaped enabling chemicals to get to both sides of the film.

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Ah yes, of course, there are barrel-shaped drums as well. The one I have is perfectly round though, so this approach doesn't work for me, sadly. Single-sided film is also very hard to come by here in Europe.

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Originally Posted by Andrew O'Neill

Nope. don't use tubes with the double-sided stuff. Trust me on this. You could strip that side, but from my experience, stripped film looks terrible printed. The tones looks weak and it's grainier. I have developed using hangers, but one must be very careful inserting and pulling the film out of the hangers. Really gentle agitation... I barely pull the hanger out of solution. My favourite method is still flat-bottomed tray.

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Oh really? :) :)

I love how dogmatic this keep getting. "no rotary" "must strip" & etc...

Rotary is only thing I use. I have not stripped single sheet in about 2.5 years, didn't like what it gets me. I have not scratched sheet in about 3 years, i think.
I do loading into tube inside of smallish tent. Loading of holders typically - in darkened room. Using both old wooden holders and modern plastic ones.

I think it is important to just find something that works. Experimenting is pretty much only one way to get there. I had film scratched during loading and while getting it out of tubes, till i figured and got all the moves right for myself. We all humans - we all have different control over fine motor skills.

There are days i can walk with cup of water on my head. There are days i can barely walk straight and need to hold onto stuff.

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Much like with anything else - may 1000 flowers bloom, may 1000 schools prosper.
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8x10 Kodak CSG double sided, 110:1 R09, 12m rotary

https://c3.staticflickr.com/6/5611/3...e57d9bc3_b.jpgEduard by Sergei Rodionov, on Flickr

Once again an amazing result Sergei, I have ordered a mod54 insert for 4x5, you have convinced me to give rotary a try!

Thanks , Andrew.

Mod54 is a bit funky. I threw mine away (no one wanted it back in Russia). I never got it to point where at least one of regular film sheets would escape or get scratched.
It was 1st revision, and honestly saying - i wouldn't recommend it to anyone.
Imho Jobo did WAY better job. But then one can make similar hack for paterson's tank from just unused 120mm spindle , i think. But i heard 2nd revision was a bit better.

Thanks Sergei, yes I have read bad things about the mod 54 for inversion, but thought rotary would be a lot more gentle on the film. I'll try it, if it causes too much angst I will return to tray, which I find relaxing anyway.

Hello SergeiR,

I am always very impressed with the work you produce using CSG Green. You mention Jobo above...do you use Expert Drums? Do you process on CPA/CPP style equipment or more manual like a roller base?

I have had recent success processing CSG Green in flat bottom trays, but that's single sheet at a time. My Expert Drum would enable me to process multiple sheets in one go. :)

thank you, Alan

Ii use both Jobo and Unidrum tanks, depending on work load and how i feel. As a result its either Jobo's CPP2 (ancient one, without lift) or Unidrum's rotary base (i don't like it bc you have to watch damn thing like a hawk, so drum won't fall off, but its far more compact space wise).
I have manual Jobo base too, and used it with 20x24 tank, but its rare. So my batch is 2-3 sheets in one go.

There is actually full description on how i deal with Xray film on my site/blog ;)

I do not own any expert drums :( I really wanted one for color work, but they are more expensive and i do have only ancient Jobo CPP, so its not like i can use it anyway)

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Originally Posted by andrewch59

Once again an amazing result Sergei, I have ordered a mod54 insert for 4x5, you have convinced me to give rotary a try!

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I tried the MOD54 once with double idd film cut to 4x5. I wasn't happy with the results because the 'fingers' of the MOD54 that hold the sheets left visible impressions on the backside of the film and too far into the image area to my taste.