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That are all sound practices. Still I am interested in what I asked, how hardening in the developing stage works.
Also let not forget, all these practices of manipulating X-ray film like a raw egg is nonexistent in the industry these films were intended. I doubt the nurse developing dozens to hundreds of sheets daily even know about scratches. So procedures must have been in place that did not rely in the person doing the developing.
Hi Eugen,Quote:
Originally Posted by Eugen Mezei
as far as I know you cannot harden before developing the film. There might be a developer which has a hardening agent added though.
Usually this film will be developed in machines. Once in the machine you will not touch it until it is finished.
As far as I know this film is not made for hand developing.
Hope this helps.
Cheers,
Martin
P.S. You can cut the film without any problems with normal paper cutter. I did this all the time. The scratches appear during developing when the film is wet and the emulsion very soft.
Hardening can be done at any point in the process (or before processing). The type of hardener depends on which part of the process, but what it does is toughen the gelatin (the hardener causes the gelatin molecules to cross-link) which makes a previously unhardened emulsion somewhat more resistant to mechanical damage while it is wet. The processing chemicals can still penetrate the emulsion, though processing times may require adjustment. In pre-hardeners or hardening developers the hardening chemical is typically an aldehyde compound (formaldehyde, glutaraldehyde), while in acid stop baths and fixers the hardening compounds are alums.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eugen Mezei
Hello, and apologies that these following shots weren't taken with an LF camera (I don't have one and I'm using Mamiya C330 with a single exposure back), but this seems to be the place with a solid discussion of x-ray film. I've started using Fujifilm UM-MA film. Having read about the fast development times of x-ray films, I started using D76H (homebrew variant on D76) at a dilution of 1:5 at 21°C and exposing at ISO 64. I've also tried the dilution at room temperature, which is probably around 27°C and the time was probably around 9 minutes with a denser neg but I seemed to get more spots on the negative. The best result that I've had so far was doing a 1 minute pre-soak in filtered water and then development in D76H 1:4 at 21°C but the time to develop was probably 16 to 20 minutes.
Are there any Fujifilm UM-MA users here and if so, what dilution and temperature would you recommend with a D76 type developer? My thoughts are to try a dilution of 1:2 @ 21°C after a pre-soak but I'd be keen to hear what others are doing with this film.
Here are two of my better results digitised with a DSLR and tidied up in Darktable - the first (mango tree leaves) was with a 1:5 dilution and no pre-soak and the second (hat) was with a 1:4 dilution and pre-soak:
All the best,
Iain
Hello Ian,Quote:
Originally Posted by surdo
these look fantastic and thanks for sharing.
Cheers,
Martin
Hi Iain,
The examples that you posted are lovely.
I'm using UM-MA, but only with the RO9 version of Rodinal.
If you need any pointers for that combination, let me know.
Thanks a lot Thodoris (and Martin). Yes, please send. I still have some "Agfa forumula" Rodinal that I bought online from an independent seller. I think that's the same as RO9, or at least similar. If you have any tips with fixing please send too. I tested an off-cut of UM-MA in Kodak Rapid fixer and it cleared in 15 seconds. So I've been fixing for just 1'30"Quote:
Originally Posted by Thodoris Tzalavras
While I'm here. I'll paste a few links to more photos. The last was interesting. I'd lost patience in the darkroom and left the negative extremely thin (so thin that I couldn't tell which side was the emulsion side when I digitised it - and judging by the lighting, it was upside down), but the result has an almost wet-plate look.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/xicara...eposted-public
https://www.flickr.com/photos/xicara...eposted-public
https://www.flickr.com/photos/xicara...eposted-public
Cheers,
Iain
https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...873515cb_o.jpgMakiflex 150 Xenar HRU D23 Octobox 150 by Nokton48, on Flickr
Plaubel Makiflex 150mm Schneider barrel Xenar 4x5 Fuji HRU XRAY D23 1:1 8x10 Aristo #2 RC Omega DII laser aligned. Dektol 1:2 Broncolor Octobox 150 with frosted bulb and Octobox Supplemental Diffusion. Backround by David Maheu "Tim Kelly Classic".
I like this one.
==========Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Unkefer
WOW! Very good. In fact, excellent.
Hi Iain,
The examples in your links show good shadow detail and tamed highlights, so you might as well keep doing what you're doing.
--
Here is my approach, for negatives that proof well at grade2 (minimum exposure for maximum black) on Ilford MG papers.
I use my Sekonic 508 at 1 degree spot, set at 16ASA, underexposing by three stops from the reading in the shadows which I want to have some minor texture. This leads to shadows with about 0.15 density above base and fog.
As a starting point for your own testing I would suggest 5ml of Rodinal/RO9 concentrate in 1lt of water (1+200 dilution) for 8min at 22.5C (you can adapt time and temperature for your initial tests to fit your working conditions using a time/temp compensation table).
I use a 5min pre-wash in water at same temp as the developer, and for pre-wash, developer, fixer, and photo-flo I only use distilled water.
For most of my processing in the past few years I've been using a Jobo 3005 drum loaded with 5 sheets which I manually roll on a diy roller, but for single sheets, and even more so for pieces of cut-off film, I use a Cesco flat bottomed tray.
I used to lay out a line of flat bottomed trays, one for each solution, but I found that the act of lifting the film from tray to tray introduced some degree of mechanical damage, so I switched to what is referred to as the "single tray method".
In this method, you prepare your solutions in wide mouthed measuring jugs, and you pour them in and out of a single tray. This way, you never handle the film, until it's time for washing.
When you lift the tray to pour the previous solution back into its jug, the film "sticks" to the bottom of the tray because of surface tension, but once you start pouring the next solution into the tray it gets "unstuck" and allows you to resume agitation.
By the way, I would suggest to keep away from "minimal agitation". It does not work.
We are severely under-developing these films in order to create continues tone negatives, and constant and vigorous agitation is our only safeguard against issues with uniformity of development.
On this subject, I would suggest at least one, but better yet two, sizes larger tray than the film you're developing. This protects you from "hot edges". Each time you lift one side of the tray for agitation, the developing solution hits the opposite wall and comes back. The smaller the tray, the faster this "coming back" is. The periphery of the film receives a higher degree of fresh developer than the middle, and you end up with over-developed edges.
As far as fixers go, I use an Agfa rapid fixer with hardener, which has a clearing time of about 25sec, and I fix my films for 4min. After fixing I use Kodak HCA for 2min.
To prevent pinholes and similar issues, try to keep all solutions as close you can in terms of temperature, including the final wash.
As a side note, regarding Rodinal/RO9:
Both Agfa and most users claim that you must have at least 3-5ml of concentrate per 8x10" film.
My findings show that this is not true.
I regularly develop 5 sheets of 18x24cm UM-MA in 1lt solution containing only 5ml of concentrate, without any signs of developer exhaustion.
BUT
Working solution of Rodinal/RO9 oxidizes quickly.
Never reuse this developer for a second, consecutive, development.
Always throw it out and make fresh.
Developing five sheets at once, and developing them one after the other in the span of 1 hour, is not the same thing.
--
Please note that all the above are personal findings and the way that "I do it".
Take it with a grain of salt, run your own tests, and find your own way.
Best of luck.