Use of X-ray film: technical discussion with example images

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...f030f047_b.jpgKodak 1A Grey Bullet Safelight 2 by Nokton48, on Flickr

Jason Lane led me to this, he uses it to coat his dry plates. I made a couple for myself, I have gone as long as twenty five minutes at five feet away, never fogged any Fuji HRU XRAY. It's the red 3 watt Red LED from Lowes, with a 1A Kodak Red Glass Filter. So, red light, through another red filter. I call it the "double-safe" light.

NO WAY THIS WILL FOG MY HRU XRAY

With this I can see well enough to inspect shadow detail while developing, no prob

Nice, Daniel.

I had 8 to develop so I used the yankee tank (hyper development artifacts on top and bottom) and d76 1:3 8 minutes with agitation every 30 seconds. Rated at iso 50. I guessed reciprocity failure of ^1.3 but I think they’re underexposed anyway.

Im getting a lot of fine white line artifacts and I think something is being “drawn” on the negative at some point, possibly from going in and out of the holders. I haven’t seen this before on pan film so im stumped.

But I think switching to hru was very good in regards to limiting halation and increasing sharpness.

Attachment 232192
Attachment 232193
And a crop from the above shot: Attachment 232194

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Peter De Smidt

Nice, Daniel.

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Thanks Peter

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...67d711f3_b.jpgHRU Pulso Test 210 Componon f22 12 pops MicX by Nokton48, on Flickr

Testing my new Broncolor Pulso C171 375 WS Monolight with restored 80x80cm Pulso Softbox about three feet right. Silver Gold reflector on left. Fuji HRU XRay film 4x5 Sinar Norma 210mm chrome Componon Norma Shutter Mic-X replenished straight developed in a flat bottomed Cesco tray. Lisco 4x5 film holder. F22 I popped the strobe twelve times to build up the density. The Grey canvas background I painted myself; Just recently put it back up. The lens on Maki is a Fuji GX680 180mm F3.2, transplanted the cells into a Fuji WS 210 Seiko Shutter. Lens is clinically sharp; I have a portrait friend that says the lens is too sharp. So he hates it LOL

I process in Cesco flat 8x10 trays, XRAY clips keep the film from touching the bottom getting marks. Also the clips keep the sheets from bumping into each other, especially in the turbulent wash tray.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...523e2a72_b.jpgHRU Fixing Step Dental Clips 1 by Nokton48, on Flickr

This is the only way I have found I can get absolutely clean negatives without any scratches or abrasions. I want clean perfect negatives and this is what I have to do to get it with this stuff. If you look at it wrong it will scratch LOL ; I'm not kidding. Also I shoot dupes so success assured.

Well it's been a fun week. I found a leedal tank on craigslist and a kodak model d with gbx-2 filter safelight locally on ebay. The safelight makes a world of difference in the cutdown process and in general. I'm going to get an OC filter for printing. I really like the the hangers and dip tank too. No scratches. But I am getting these black dots (mottling?) I'm doing d76 1:4 for 9.5 minutes at 20c. Any thoughts to why?
Attachment 232337
Attachment 232338
Attachment 232339
And one I thought just looks nice
Attachment 232340

Some quick tests using my 4x5 pinhole.

AGFA Curix Ortho exp 2005 @ EI 64 developed 7mins, Kalogen 1:100 using a MOD 54/Patterson tank.
The films came out fogged but scanable though I'm unsure whether it's age, unsafe safelight or that my blackout hasn't completely blacked out the newly erected street lights facing where I cut the film. The writing on the second has me stumped.
I'm relocating to the laundry (no windows) and have adapted Daniel's/Jason Lane's idea of utilising a 3w red LED bulb filtered through a red lighting gel equivalent to a GBX filter. Hopefully I'll have some answers.

Attachment 232377
Attachment 232378
Attachment 232379
Attachment 232380

Negatives from above.

Attachment 232381

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rubud

Some quick tests using my 4x5 pinhole.

AGFA Curix Ortho exp 2005 @ EI 64 developed 7mins, Kalogen 1:100 using a MOD 54/Patterson tank.
The films came out fogged but scanable though I'm unsure whether it's age, unsafe safelight or that my blackout hasn't completely blacked out the newly erected street lights facing where I cut the film. The writing on the second has me stumped.
I'm relocating to the laundry (no windows) and have adapted Daniel's/Jason Lane's idea of utilising a 3w red LED bulb filtered through a red lighting gel equivalent to a GBX filter. Hopefully I'll have some answers.

Attachment 232377
Attachment 232378
Attachment 232379
Attachment 232380

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Old badly stored Film?? Try processing a sheet no exposure; should be clear as scotch tape if the film is good; sometimes damage can add to an image. Depends

Yep that safelight looks mighty mighty deep red, just like mine. You can lay pennies on the film periodically, to test it's tolerance exposure to the safelight. Also it's bright enough to see film shadow detail as it is developing. Developing by inspection, I lift a sheet up to examine it by safelight

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daniel Unkefer

Old badly stored Film?? Try processing a sheet no exposure; should be clear as scotch tape if the film is good; sometimes damage can add to an image. Depends

Yep that safelight looks mighty mighty deep red, just like mine. You can lay pennies on the film periodically, to test it's tolerance exposure to the safelight. Also it's bright enough to see film shadow detail as it is developing. Developing by inspection, I lift a sheet up to examine it by safelight

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Thanks very much for your suggestions (and for sharing your safelight idea). My first inclination is that the film is old (there was one batch where the emulsion peeled off as soon as it got wet). The chap who gave it to me did say that it had been sitting around the storage area for some time. Once I've got the laundry completely light tight I'll cut a sheet in darkness for the tank and then do some safelight tests. If the worst case turns out to be age related I'll be content and will work around it as I do with other expired film.

It looks as if my earlier issues are more the result of unsafe lighting than old film. In my new environment (Laundry) & safelight setup, I cut a sheet in total darkness, loaded one into my Patterson tank and did a safelight test strip on another in 2min increments for 10 mins, loading the tank in total darkness. Developed in Kalogen 1:100 7mins. I can't see any discernible difference between the blanks which are both a giant improvement on my previous efforts (I was using my computer monitor as a lightbox so the left may look a little darker from the angle I photographed).

Attachment 232417

Attachment 232419 (Scanned using an Epson V850)

Pulled out the 5x7 and some Carestream x-ray film to practice and check exposure with my hot lights. Next week there is a "Roaring 20's" themed event I am attending and I'm going to do some fun portraits of attendees dressed in period style using the Eastman View #2 and Verito 8 3/4." In fact I just checked and according to an online database the Verito was made in 1924, and the Eastman produced through the mid 20's, so very period correct, other than the film! :)

The test image, of my wife, wide-open and at 1/10:

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...v22-meg-2s.jpg

Nice. I am discovering 5x7 myself.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...b6460973_b.jpgSONY DSC by Nokton48, on Flickr

This is the Fiskar Cutter Jim Galli directed me to. Bought cheaply on Ebay, got four new 45mm blades at the local fabric store. Great cutter! I see why he likes it! Here is my cutting setup, set up for cutting 18x24cm sheets from the huge roll of 24cm Agfa Aviphot. Same emulsion as Rollei 400s, basically. Identical if not the same. Has some slight Infared effect that is very pleasing. I've been shooting this film as Rollei 400s in fresh 70mm, and I like it. Between the Mammo Film, Agfa Aviphot, and Fuji HRU I am all set for cheapo 8x10 size shoots. Something I can do in winter times. I have eight 18x24cm original olde wooden Sinar Film Holders that are perfect for shooting this stuff. If I contact print on 8x10 paper, it makes a nice wide black border that I like.

Of course I have to spin the plastic cylinder of film so it is oriented for easy cutting. I will set up some wooden stops to hold the biggie roll so it doesn't slide around in the dark. That's about it for now

The Fiskar's blade goes into 45 pivot mode so no way to scratch the film. Good design

I had an issue I posted about a few days ago- black dots on the photos. I eliminated everything and it ended up being the film, probably due to poor storage. I did allow it to get to 80F and could have been too humid.

I’m now trying agfa cp-gu m from cxs. I tried some overcast shots today and it appears to be iso 25 (with d76 1:6 9.5min with hangers)

Here’s a shot from yesterday. Attachment 232608

I also would like to share that I’m using a rotatrim m24 to cut down 8x10s to 4x5. I have two paper safes. One I fill with the sheets I’ll cut. I start by setting the cutter to 125mm and cut down the half sheets, store them in the other paper safe. Once that’s complete, I turn the lights on, adjust the cutter to 110mm, then go back and cut the rest of the film to size and put in a 4x5 box. I recently got a kodak model d safelight which came with the GBX2 filter. I found it had a 75w(!) bulb but it still doesn’t fog.

Edit: I need to run fog tests.

I've been using a Carl A3 rotary trimmer using magnets as a guide for cutting down paper & film. One magnet is at 4in in the top and another at 5in on the bottom. It's an idea I stumbled on recently but it seems to work.

Attachment 232676

Very good idea!

I have a roll of magnet tape, I use for ULF

I keep 2 cutters for film cut usage only, in a dust free metal drawer

Thank you

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rubud

I've been using a Carl A3 rotary trimmer using magnets as a guide for cutting down paper & film. One magnet is at 4in in the top and another at 5in on the bottom. It's an idea I stumbled on recently but it seems to work.

Attachment 232676

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Corran

Pulled out the 5x7 and some Carestream x-ray film to practice and check exposure with my hot lights. Next week there is a "Roaring 20's" themed event I am attending and I'm going to do some fun portraits of attendees dressed in period style using the Eastman View #2 and Verito 8 3/4."

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And...some results! Well, I cheated though. I recently purchased a 200mm and 250mm Imagon set and I put the 200mm in a Copal 3 shutter I have here collecting dust. Works on the 5x7 and soft focus is nice, but noticeably wider than the Verito, which I needed for group shots. I should've switch to the Verito for this image, but my friend wanted to take a photo of my wife and I dressed up for the occasion, so I just used what was on the camera at the time as I had only about a minute to set this up and show her how to trigger the shutter.

Cropped square though - 5x7 Eastman #2, 200mm Imagon, on Carestream x-ray film:

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...asy-0986ss.jpg

And, a group shot, same 200mm Imagon. Interesting how the light from the background window (which late in the day had become much brighter) wrapped around the foreground faces. I didn't mention this, but I had one hot-light for illumination on these.

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...easy-0988s.jpg

Interesting and Brave

The pearls seem too normal

I also think you should try ULF X-Ray

200 sheets of 14x17 are waiting for me to use them...

Not enough time in the day!

Speaking of x-ray...I've tried on and off for a while to make positives using x-ray materials. Never quite worked right, but recently I had a brainstorm on what I was failing at doing before, so gave it another go:

Attachment 232823

Decent success! That is just a cell pic sitting on my light table. And this 5x7 film is of an unknown age and slightly fogged from what I can tell, so the blacks would be deeper if using fresh. I've always wanted to do simple positives for art shows - something so simple and cheap that I could demonstrate it easily, so this may evolve into that. Either way, it's a fun experiment that may prove useful later.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Corran

I had a brainstorm on what I was failing at doing before

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The suspense is killing me!! Are you going to tell what key was? :o

I like that image. I see no blue tint..was this a clear base or did you digitally edit out the blue? I tried some positives (mostly for use as interpositives, really) on xray and it worked decently well, but evidently with a distinctly blue hue to them.

Jim...
This is GREAT Information.

Thank you.

;-))

Jim...
This is GREAT Information. On All of your Vids

Thank you.

;-))

I'm still trying to figure out who Jim is...:D

Blue Jim

Cheers

us

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rubud

Thanks very much for your suggestions (and for sharing your safelight idea). My first inclination is that the film is old (there was one batch where the emulsion peeled off as soon as it got wet). The chap who gave it to me did say that it had been sitting around the storage area for some time. Once I've got the laundry completely light tight I'll cut a sheet in darkness for the tank and then do some safelight tests. If the worst case turns out to be age related I'll be content and will work around it as I do with other expired film.

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How old is old when it comes top X-ray or ortho film?
I've been using one or the other since I began LF photography about 1938. Much of the film I have used has been more than old, it's been ancient, 20+ years in some cases. When treated correctly, I've never had age fog on these films. I have had fog from incorrect safelights, and tiny light leaks or glowing paint or tape in the darkroom. Don't be careless with it. Treat it right and and it'll treat you right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Corran

And...some results! Well, I cheated though. I recently purchased a 200mm and 250mm Imagon set and I put the 200mm in a Copal 3 shutter I have here collecting dust. Works on the 5x7 and soft focus is nice, but noticeably wider than the Verito, which I needed for group shots. I should've switch to the Verito for this image, but my friend wanted to take a photo of my wife and I dressed up for the occasion, so I just used what was on the camera at the time as I had only about a minute to set this up and show her how to trigger the shutter.

Cropped square though - 5x7 Eastman #2, 200mm Imagon, on Carestream x-ray film:

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...asy-0986ss.jpg

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Which softening adapter did you use for this?

Jim, it's an Imagon 200mm, no strainer disk, wide-open.

koraks, I missed your earlier message. I used a thiourea toner for reversal. This overcomes the blue base and leaves it slightly warm.

Very interesting

Process needed

Photographers' Formulary Thiourea cautions and usage well studied

They write of paper conditioning, your 'Blue Be Gone' is needed as my Blue Hair is annoying many

I also realize we are now in a new era of experimenters

Many without applied science education

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Corran

Jim, it's an Imagon 200mm, no strainer disk, wide-open.

koraks, I missed your earlier message. I used a thiourea toner for reversal. This overcomes the blue base and leaves it slightly warm.

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Hi!! my english is not very good, sorry
I've been using Rx film for a long time to work, I'll show you the latest, thanks

Bausch & Lomb Zeiss Tessar f4.5 - 300mm
Negativo 4x5 - Agfa Rx
Lights: Electronic flash

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/2NWNep.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by luiscoll

Hi!! my english is not very good, sorry
I've been using Rx film for a long time to work, I'll show you the latest, thanks

Bausch & Lomb Zeiss Tessar f4.5 - 300mm
Negativo 4x5 - Agfa Rx
Lights: Electronic flash

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/2NWNep.jpg

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Nice! I like the tonal values on the face.

Recent video using 14x17 XRAY & Gum Over Kallitype print...

https://youtu.be/mbzHbOwRHZs

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ron McElroy

Nice! I like the tonal values on the face.

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Thanks!

A Reformulation of the "Ansco-30" X-Ray Developer =

Attachment 233569

Wonderful video and the 14X17 print IS COLOR I like

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Andrew O'Neill

Recent video using 14x17 XRAY & Gum Over Kallitype print...

https://youtu.be/mbzHbOwRHZs

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Missed this

Good work

Quote:

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Originally Posted by James R. Kyle

A Reformulation of the "Ansco-30" X-Ray Developer =

Attachment 233569

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Congratulations on your perseverance.

NIice work!

Thank you.
;-)