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Hi all,
Last week I got the message from my partner that our refrigerator is for vegetables and not filmboxes.
So I知 looking out for a small hotel refrigerator.
When looking at the internet I have found several models, but they all have none or a small freezer compartiment. I live in Belgium
So is this important, i知 buying normal only Kodak Ektar, Kodak Porta and Ilfort. These are now quite easy to get. And normally I have 5 boxes of each ready.
Thanks
Make sure the boxes fit in small freezers.
My 11X14 and 14X17 films only fit in some North American fridges.
I have a smaller 600 Liter refrigerator / freezer full of film and paper. If my wife tries to put a bottle of white wine in to chill, I tell her "it's not for food!"
Film doesn't necessarily need to be frozen to last a long time; cool storage is fine. I have two small fridges--neither has a freezer compartment--where I keep current film I'm using and raw chemicals for mixing various formulas. Both are set to maintain 50F. The remainder of my film hoard is kept in a chest style freezer.
Two thoughts.
If you use your film up within a year or two, you only need to refrigerate, so a small refrigerator with no freezer compartment will do.
If you need long term storage, maybe just a freezer unit such as one listed here: https://www.mediamarkt.de/de/categor...te-604566.html .
The units above are from German Media Markt, but similar models should be available in Belgium I'd think.
Best,
Doremus
The more full the fridge, the more efficient it is. Stock it up for the planet's sake!:cool:
Problem with the little freezer units inside little frigs is that they are not frost free. Of course, you don't want frost free anyway, because to bem frost free, the frig goes through a heating cycle. The issue with the frost, ice, is that if you don't clean it out occasionally, then the ice will crush anything in there, even film boxes. It's pretty dry where I live, so a de-icing every couple years is fine. Keep an eye on your ice levels.
The mediamarkt in Belgium did not sell these, but before I was searching for refrigerators and no freezers, there is no major price difference, so i’m going to by a small freezer. And found one
Search under "Chest freezer"
FYI, there are devices used by homebrewers that allow you to use a freezer at refrigerator temps. Basically turns a freezer on and off with a separate thermostat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PatrickMarq
The vernacular for freezer and refrigerator does not always depict the profound differences. As a rule shop by specifications. From Kodak.
EU models closely resemble NA market, most likely from a similar source
With similar pricing before VAT or use tax
How much do you want to spend, ｣5, ｣10?
You could get a second hand one for very cheap,
Or you could get a not so cheap drinks cooler for somewhere under ｣75
Then there is something like the Husky drinks cooler for a bit more which you could pull the shelves out of, but that ｣100 will probably have to be replaced within a couple of years.
Or you could search around and get a single door commercial drinks fridge for about ｣400.
At the moment I have a Husky beer cooler with the shelves pulled out which contains my film in several small "Really Useful Boxes".
I am going to get this one soon as I can store my film and some boxes of 12x16 should fit inside, It is much more expensive but it will be better made and I think it will be much more reliable than a normal house style beer cooler:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-SINGL...Y/192587448122
I am pretty sure that my chicken and frozen pizzas do not defrost when the freezer is cycling. Do you have a reference for damage to film in frost free freezers?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Woodbury
The Conservators of Fine Arts and Material Culture at the Rocky Mountain Conservation Center and other conservators e.g. the American National Park Service recommend a frost free freezer unit.
This may not be helpful for the EU, but a google search for "freezerless mini fridge" gets lots of hits from Amazon, Walmart, Home Depot, Wayfair, Best Buy, Target and others. Here's a "best freezerless refrigerator" article: https://www.remodelormove.com/best-f...-refrigerator/
Yeah, self defrost refrigerators can really dehydrate lettuce but a sealed film box no problem. In the old days there was a evaporator in the single compartment refrigerator. Gravity convection, just like an icebox. There was room inside for a couple ice cube trays. The evaporator was, depending on the refrigerant minus 25ｰF. Opening the door, moisture would condense and freeze on the evaporator, eventually you would need to take the food out and let the frost melt off the evaporator.Quote:
Originally Posted by cowanw
Today the marketing and sales people have convinced us we need 27 cubic foot refrigerator freezers. Air is blasted around the unit, the evaporator (s) have ice build up until a 500 to 700 watt heater comes on ,during the night, the ice is melted and drains into a evaporation tray, under the refrigerator, where the condenser (the hot side) and fans evaporate the water.
Today modern refrigerators use about 20 % of the energy they did 40 years ago. If you don't have a lot of door openings, the defrost cycle will not occur. A simple bottom freezer refrigerator is a good choice. Most service problems are with the ice makers, and ice and water delivery systems, ice crushers etc. Simple is better.
Is your partner in consultation with my partner? I think they are. My new film freezer will 'have to be shared" with frozen food and stored in 'my' darkroom.Quote:
Originally Posted by PatrickMarq
I need to keep the footprint small, so a chest-type freezer won't fit; this is what I came up with in the USA (perhaps there are similar models in the EU).
https://www.avantiproducts.com/products/id/767
I prefer the non-defrost type of freezers; I don't trust the effects on film of the cyclical drops in temperature in the self-defrosting models. I have no proof that it damages film.
MY bottom freezer is set for 0 degrees F. I think it actual stays around 6 degrees F. I haven't noticed any meat or other frozen stuff ever less then brick. I'm not an expert. But I guess the defrost cycle is long enough to eliminate frosting on the coils but short enough not to affect the freezer contents. The problem I;m having now after a storm knocked out power for 4 days is that the refrigerator shelves and plastic keeps getting frosted up. Even after a few days since the power came back. Can't figure out why that's happening. ANy ideas?
Yes, chest freezers are much more energy efficient and will do nicely for film.
I stopped refrigerating film about 8 years ago. I was getting odd marks on the film. I try to use the film now before it goes bad. I never thought refrigeration did anything good for B&W anyway. Certainly did not keep old film from fogging.
Yes ground radiation is a real issue over time.Quote:
Originally Posted by ic-racer
Frost-free freezers do not raise the temperature of frozen items above freezing (if at all) during the de-frosting cycles.
Interesting, how do you package your film? I tend to freeze in double plastic bags (with film inside a triple box inside of that), feels safer and less likely to have humidity problems than the fridge.Quote:
Originally Posted by ic-racer
If I were in your situation, I'd buy something like this.
Consider a small to medium sized chest freezer; it can be used for both film/paper and for storing frozen food goods. For example, taking advantage of sales, you can save money long term by storing frozen meats.Quote:
Originally Posted by PatrickMarq
This is what I did, when my wife made similar observations. We now use the chest freezer more for food storage than for film/paper.
The issue with that approach is that every time I open it to get my Velvia 50 I see the chocolate ice cream first and end up forgetting about the film.Quote:
Originally Posted by neil poulsen
Just kidding. If one has space that痴 the best option. I use a beer cooler that just keeps a uniform temp of about 45F. I don稚 personally buy enough to deep freeze. I just don稚 want it to get to 80F every day for hours during the summer, or even 90F if I知 out for a trip or something, so that gives me peace of mind.