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jonreid
26-Jan-2013, 22:51
Can someone give me a ballpark on what a replacement bellows might cost from Custom Bellows or Western Bellows.

Alternatively, does someone have a source on buying 1 roll of 3M #850 black tape?

Cheers,

Jon

Daniel Unkefer
26-Jan-2013, 23:04
I bought an original 5x7 Norma Bellows on Ebay a couple of years ago. It was new in the original box, I think I paid about $80 for it.

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
27-Jan-2013, 00:09
I had Custom Bellows make a new 5x7 Norma standard bellows and mount them for me a few months ago. The cost was 135, plus 20 for return shipping to the US. The bellows they made are very similar to the original bellows which they replaced. Turnaround time was quite fast, maybe two weeks?

jonreid
27-Jan-2013, 01:34
Daniel, I've scoured for a replacement in EBay and a few other places. Nothing but used ones in probably similar condition.

Jason, thanks. That amount is not cheap but not bad for a quality product. Did you send them your existing bellows?

Jon

Daniel Unkefer
27-Jan-2013, 09:30
There is this one on German Ebay:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/300852151456?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
27-Jan-2013, 11:21
Did you send them your existing bellows?

I sent my old bellows mounted on the frames, and they removed the old bellows, cleaned up and repainted the frames, and mounted the new ones. Note that in a pinch current 13x18 bellows (for the P and F cameras) will fit on your Norma. The rear frame is a little different (plastic versus aluminum) so there is some play and perhaps possible leaks, but I have been using the current bag bellows model on my Norma for a few weeks with no issues (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?97949-Sinar-bellows-compatibility-between-5x7-13x18-Norma-and-F-amp-P-series&p=974500#post974500).

jonreid
27-Jan-2013, 15:53
Hi Jason,
I found this http://bit.ly/X5aLxx
Which appears to be the non-bag version of what you bought. Price is slightly higher after conversion to AUD than a replacement from Custom Bellows. I'd love some assurance it will fit my Norma correctly.

Jon

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
27-Jan-2013, 15:57
It probably would fit, but I would spend the money on a having a new bellows mounted by Custom Bellows. Do you have the frames?

jonreid
27-Jan-2013, 15:58
Hi,
Only on my existing bellows, which would mean sending them over..

Jon

Leonard Robertson
27-Jan-2013, 16:56
I don't know if you are satisfied with the maximum extension of your present 5X7 bellows. The 4X5 Sinar bellows sometimes seems a bit short to me. I've read some people like the 4X5 Horseman bellows on a Sinar as it has a bit more length. The point is, if you have new bellows made, you could probably have them made somewhat longer, although this may cause a problem at minimum extension if you don't have a bag bellows to change over to.

I'm a pretty cheap guy myself, but if I were in your position I'd go for new bellows on your frames. If used Sinar 5X7 bellows weren't uncommon and hence usually expensive, it might be worth taking a chance on a used set. You might get lucky and find a nice used set that will last for years. Or a set that will have pinholes in a year.

On the other hand, 135 + 20 Pounds at today's exchange rate is about $245 US, not including postage to UK. That is a noticeable amount, at least to me. I thought I read Western Bellows isn't taking orders anymore, but maybe there is another US maker which would at least save you some postage cost. Custom Bellows has a wonderful reputation though.

Len

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
27-Jan-2013, 18:22
...The 4X5 Sinar bellows sometimes seems a bit short to me...

The Norma bellows are short and relatively inflexible, at least compared to the bellows on my 5x7 Canham. I went back and forth in my head when I had these made if I wanted a different kind of bellows on the Norma, but decided to keep the camera as designed, which means for for long extensions use two bellows sets and an intermediate standard, and for short lenses use the bag bellows.

jonreid
27-Jan-2013, 23:19
Jason and Leonard,
I haven't run into a problem with the standard Norma bellows extension. My longest lens is a 355mm RD Artar. That's not to say I don't want a longer lens and I will probably swap the RD Artar for something longer at some stage.
Having said that the bellows that are available in the link I posted earlier are probably for a F or a P and may be a little longer than the earlier Norma version. I've tried to google for specs but can't find any, only endlessly duplicated listings. So as long as they fit without leaking light they might be the way to go....
Jon

jonreid
27-Jan-2013, 23:20
I should add that I don't have a bag bellows at this stage, they're also on the list though I rarely shoot wider than 121mm...
J

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
28-Jan-2013, 09:49
I depends on your lenses of course, but I find that I often need a bag bellows for a 155mm wide angle, so you are probably going do need one with a 121mm.

Leonard Robertson
28-Jan-2013, 11:10
Jon and Jason - Thanks for posting all the bellows information. I keep running hot and cold on whether or not to upsize my 4X5 Norma to 5X7. It is one of those things I don't really NEED to do, but WANT to do. I have a Norma intermediate standard, so if I do move up to 5X7, I have the capability to do longer extensions. My longest lens in shutter is a 16 1/2" Artar, but I have 19" barrel mount lenses and a Sinar shutter. I have a feeling the regular 5X7 bellows may need extra extension bellows for a 19" lens focused at all close.

Len

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
28-Jan-2013, 11:40
If you already have the 4x5, all you have to do is slide a 5x7 rear standard on the back and use the 4x5 rear as an intermediate. Or even better you add an intermediate between 5x7 rear and 4x5 rear, and use your front standard to hold a shade! As someone here said, Sinars are like Legos.

Drew Wiley
28-Jan-2013, 11:41
Per 4x5, my original Norma tapered bellows is wonderfully versatile, and there is no stress on it even
using a 450 lens. Don't know how short it will be, but a 90 would probably work too. I have more recent Sinar bag bellows on hand anyway, which fits fine. I also have a 28 inch Horseman bellows which fits perfectly with no leaks, but this was an expensive bellows to begin with, yet wonderful because it doesn't sag like the Sinar box bellows (non-tapered). Wish I had to 5x7 components too,
but then I'd probably end up having to cut down the sheets from 8x10, and I've got too many toys
already.

jonreid
8-Feb-2013, 21:46
Ok. Interesting update. I actually had a close look at my bellows today as this problem remains unresolved.
What I discovered is that the bellows frames on my camera are plastic. This makes me think they are not the original as I thought Normas had aluminium bellows frames. If that is the case then they are likely identical to the one in the listing posted above.
There are no markings apart from 'Swiss Made' on the front and rear frames.

Jon

Jason Greenberg Motamedi
8-Feb-2013, 22:13
The small sample of 5x7 Norma bellows frames I have seen have all been plastic on front and aluminum rear. If yours have plastic front and rear they are probably not original.

Drew Wiley
11-Feb-2013, 12:48
That would be Sinar post-Norma, probably.