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Cletus
24-Oct-2012, 07:30
Lately I've been asking a lot of questions about light leaks and replacement bellows for my Sinar 8x10. Someone else had posted something about "the most permanent" tape to use for bellows. This got lots of varied response, but the idea that seemed likely to me came from Jim Jones. In that thread, he suggested scrubbing acrylic paint into pinholes and that it seemed to make for a good, permanent repair. Good idea Jim!

For those of you who might be interested, here's the procedure I used. While this was just completed last night and hasn't yet been "field tested", I have a fairly high level of confidence this will be a lasting repair.

The majority of the light leaks in my bellows was at the rear frame where the bellows attaches. There had already been some "duct tape" type stuff applied to part of the frame, over the joint where the last fold of the bellows is attached to the frame, but I did something better. I have some heavy (0.006") black vinyl "pipe tape" we often use at work, that has a great adhesive and doesn't leave a lot of goo behind when it's removed. After cleaning up the back frame / bellows junction with alcohol, I applied 4 strips of this tape around all four sides, with some contact cement used for enhanced adhesion and permanence. The contact cement was of the acetone solvent variety, so it dries quickly and isn't nearly as goopy and difficult to work with as typical 3M 'rubber' contact cement. It's also lower in viscosity and can be applied sparingly with a small model paint brush. I applied the contact cement to the bellows where the tape was to go, and also to the adhesive side of the tape. It only need a minute to two to get tacky and the only catch is, once the two parts (the tape and bellows frame) are mated, there's not much time for repositioning. Care is needed here and it helps to 'dry fit' the tape strip first, before cementing in place. This took care of the worst light leaks at the bellows rear frame.

There were also a number of pinholes down the length of all four corners at the folds in the pleats. None of these were bad and I doubt were much affecting film fogging. In addition to that, they only appeared at full extension. I've been using wide lenses, so probably would have never noticed them without the careful flashlight checks I did with the bellows maxed out. Anyway this is where Jim Jones' great idea comes in. I went to Michael's craft supply and started looking at acrylic paint. There are many many kinds and types of acrylic and it turned out (don't ask me how this happened) that there was a gal there who was actually KNOWLEDGEABLE about acrylic paint! I told her what I was trying to do with it and it appeared she actually understood and didn't give me the "you're from Mars aren't you?" look when I told her this was for a camera repair! She pointed me to a Liquitex brand of professional acrylic paint, made for canvas and fabrics which is waterproof when dry, has latex (rubber, yes!) in it and stays flexible indefinitely and is supposedly very durable and tough as nails. How she knows all this, I have no idea, but she certainly had me convinced and my BS detector didn't so much is twitch. So I'm wandering here, sorry...

I cleaned up the corners of the bellows with alcohol and a swab and liberally brushed on the paint. You have to use judgement here, too thick is bad and could interfere with the proper folding of the bellows. I made sure I covered 100% of all the little creases and folds in every corner of every pleat down the length of all four corners of the bellows. I didn't worry too much about neat, clean edges when painting. It's really hard to even see it when dry. Jim Jones suggests "scrubbing" the paint in with a toothbrush on the INSIDE of the bellows, which would probably be a more thorough way of doing this. I considered doing that and, No.1: The fabric on the inside of the Sinar bellows doesn't look too friendly to this method and, No.2: It would have taken hours and hours and hours of frustrating work to do, plus I was worried about the bellows folding properly afterward. So I painted it on the outside. This acrylic material appears to adhere very well on the outside of the bellows and now that it's had the chance to dry, with the bellows at max max extension (the paint should also be applied in this position) this morning when I look at it, it's hard to even see the paint without a bright light.

I removed the bellows after making sure the paint was completely dry - gal at Michaels says it takes four hours, I gave it 12 - and folded and flexed the bellows several times. The pleats fold up nicely and while there is a tiny bit of "paint tack" noise from the fresh paint surface when opening the bellows, it's not bad and doesn't give the impression, or look like, the paint is sticking together or adhering to adjacent painted pleats, as I feared it might. We'll see how it works when the bellows have been tightly folded in a hot car for a few hours, but I'm pretty sure no matter when happens there, the pinholes will be plugged up for a good long time.

I plan to leave the bellows extended and give the paint another day to completely cure, but so far, the flashlight test does not reveal even the slightest, tiniest pinhole or light leak anywhere. And I happen to have one hell of a powerful flashlight! Looking into the bellows through the front under a dark cloth and with a film holder in the back, I used to see 'stars' everywhere. Now I see NOTHING but Stygian, pitch black!

So please forgive my usual wordiness (not the first time I've said that) but I wanted to share this successful - so far - repair with anyone else contemplating dropping $300+ that they might not have at the moment on new or custom bellows. I'll report again later, after I've had a chance to put this repair work through a little torture testing in the field, but I'm pretty confident I'm quit of my light leaks for now.

Last note as a disclaimer: This repair was done on my Sinar OEM bellows, which appear to have an outer covering of rubberized vinyl or something. I'm not sure how well this would work on old leather, or other more porous outer bellows materials. In your particular case, depending on your bellows materials, it might make more sense to do this repair from the inside, per Jim Jones recommendation.

The acrylic paint I used is: "Liquitex BASICS, Mars Black". The contact cement used for the tape on the rear frame is: Beacon "527" Multi-Use Glue, which is not technically "contact cement" but works well in that capacity. I might have preferred a black, non-adhesive fabric type tape, but I wasn't able to find anything like that. I think the heavy vinyl tape I had will make for a durable substitute. I don't know the make of this tape, I think we have it custom made to tell you the truth.

So, if you need to repair light leaks or pinholes in your bellows, here's one way that seems to work well. Good luck!

Cletus

Steven Tribe
24-Oct-2012, 10:28
Perhaps you could get this moved over to the DIY thread as it contains useful info and experience which would be easier to find there in the future?

Cletus
24-Oct-2012, 10:44
Steven -

Good idea, I didn't think of that. Do you know how to move a thread? Or do I just copy and paste and start a new one?

Steven Tribe
24-Oct-2012, 11:54
I think this is Moderator activity!
You could do the copy/paste as this is so early in this thread - then leave a note here!

C. D. Keth
24-Oct-2012, 12:27
That's pretty handy. I did a similar repair with a black liquid latex product. It worked pretty well but absolute cleanliness was key. Any bit of dirt or anything greasy was an invitation for a place for the repair to start peeling.

Kirk Gittings
24-Oct-2012, 12:36
I'll move it.

Cor
25-Oct-2012, 01:28
Good description Cletus, and I sure hope it lasts !

I was less lucky trying to patch up a shot Toyo bellows, I used a liquid repair stuff used to seal holes in wet suit stuff. A pain to work with, I had to dilute it with some nasty stuff (I think I used Trichlorethylene and sufficient ventilation). The end result was quite nice though, but it didn't take long before a many new pin holes appeared..the material was simply shot and I headed to the first advice: get a new bellows from Camera Bellows..

Best,

Cor

Frank Petronio
25-Oct-2012, 01:33
Good luck as well. How these repairs hold up, especially after being compressed, and whether the bellows has enough integrity to stop disintegrating is the test though ;-p Still it should get you through a few more shoots at the least.

Cletus
25-Oct-2012, 06:03
Yep, we'll see how long this lasts. Here's what I think I have going for me - the worst leaks by far were those between the bellows and back frame and that's the repair that should have the most integrity.

There were probably...8-10? Pinholes and they were very very small, so probably weren't doing much to screw up my negs.
I'll see how that part of the repair worked out after a few weeks of packing and unpacking the camera in the field. At least this should give me enough shooting time to get the scratch together for a replacement bellows.

Cletus
25-Oct-2012, 06:04
Oh, and thank you for moving this to the appropriate department Kirk!

EOTS
30-Apr-2014, 08:51
Hi Cletus,

thanks for having shared this.
I'm facing a similar problem and have been looking at different methods for the holes ...

Did the fix last (with the Liquitex Mars Black)?

In my case the bellows looks like this (synthetic material):
http://www.arca-shop.de/media/images/popup/071000_01_quad.jpg

I have two problems
(a) on the left upper side, most of the corners of the bellows are affected (multiple small holes in a row).
(b) one larger hole on the area "between two corners" (but not directly in a crease/fold)

I guess the method could work for (a)?
Perhaps (b) would better have to be patched?

Best regards,
Martin

Doremus Scudder
1-May-2014, 02:23
... I used to see 'stars' everywhere. Now I see NOTHING but Stygian, pitch black!

So please forgive my usual wordiness (not the first time I've said that) but I wanted to share this successful - so far - repair with anyone else contemplating dropping $300+ that they might not have at the moment on new or custom bellows. ... Cletus

Thanks for the informative post and the detailed description. I don't mind your wordiness at all, especially when you can contrive to use the word, "Stygian" (correctly capitalized too!) convincingly in a discourse on bellows repair.

BTW I made similar repairs recently to a Woodman bellows with black silicone-based flexible caulking and a black cloth tape. It's worked so far, but I've bookmarked this thread just in case.

Best,

Doremus

gardnep
1-May-2014, 02:43
Probably the best product to use for light leaks is an artists paint called Acrylic Gesso. In Oz it is now available from the Mont Marte company (China) in black. It is mat black with excellent covering properties. I have just used it on a highly porous backing cloth for a bellows and it is now light proof. It is also easy to clean up or dilute with water. Being acrylic it should also have good archival properties. It is used to coat canvass or any other surface prior to painting.

hoffner
1-May-2014, 05:47
Probably the best product to use for light leaks is an artists paint called Acrylic Gesso. In Oz it is now available from the Mont Marte company (China) in black. It is mat black with excellent covering properties. I have just used it on a highly porous backing cloth for a bellows and it is now light proof. It is also easy to clean up or dilute with water. Being acrylic it should also have good archival properties. It is used to coat canvass or any other surface prior to painting.

Gardnep,
how many times can you bend sharply a thin coat of "Acrylic Gesso available from the Mont Marte company (China) in black" before it ruptures? Try it before you try to sell your idea and let us know.

Bob Salomon
1-May-2014, 06:23
There is no "successful" repair for a bellows. Once a bellows starts to develop pin holes it will continue to deteriorate in other areas. Also a bellows must be flexible to be able to continue to let you do the movements that you have to do with a view camera. Applying tape, paint, glue, rubber compound, etc. all will compromise that flexibility. And the most expensive part of a bellows replacement is the picture you lose from a failed seal or an unexpected future leak.

The only successful bellows repair is a bellows replacement. With one that is capable of doing the same movements and compression as the OEM bellows.

hoffner
1-May-2014, 06:26
A nice try Bob,
but you will see - these posts about new fantastic bellows repair acrylic coat will just flourish like mushrooms after rain each time someone comes with the idea.

Bob Salomon
1-May-2014, 07:02
A nice try Bob,
but you will see - these posts about new fantastic bellows repair acrylic coat will just flourish like mushrooms after rain each time someone comes with the idea.

I don't expect miracles but I would prefer that people are realistic. I was robbed in France and had 10 days of film stolen which had some shots that I have never been able to reproduce again. Made for a very expensive trip. not counting the $25,000.00 in equipment that was taken (in 1985). The money was eventually paid by insurance to recoup the lost stuff. But those pictures are gone forever. Same can happen to images at any time that are shot with a camera with a leaky bellows.

VPooler
1-May-2014, 07:20
I have found black cloth tape made by Tesa to do the trick IF you don't use much movements or bellows draw, i.e. with a press camera. Otherwise I second what Bob said - you can't reverse decay. You can, however, build new bellows on the remnants of your old ones, as I have seen some people do. I opted for the cloth tape option for now but I will buy new bellows when I have more money to spend.

EDIT: I found the mentioned tape from my local hardware store, at electrical section among with other electrical tapes. It adheres well and is very flexible.

Sheldon N
1-May-2014, 08:58
One option I've used multiple times with success is the "puffy paint" or 3D fabric paint that can be used to draw on T-shirts to make decorative designs. Just one bottle of the stuff has lasted me years, I use this particular brand...

http://www.amazon.com/Scribbles-3D-Fabric-Paint-Shiny-Black/dp/B000JONZ9U

It adheres well, is black and opaque, and remains flexible. It also comes in a handy bottle with a fine point that is perfect for precision application into pin holes in bellows corners. And it's cheap!

hoffner
1-May-2014, 09:52
I don't expect miracles but I would prefer that people are realistic. I was robbed in France and had 10 days of film stolen which had some shots that I have never been able to reproduce again. Made for a very expensive trip. not counting the $25,000.00 in equipment that was taken (in 1985). The money was eventually paid by insurance to recoup the lost stuff. But those pictures are gone forever. Same can happen to images at any time that are shot with a camera with a leaky bellows.

That is the difference between a pro and a weekend amateur. The pro knows the value of his pictures and work and knows he cannot afford pseudo solutions. The amateur who takes his camera for a ride twice a month sees that the patched hole holds even the second month and shouts - it really holds, the repair is ... well, durable!

hoffner
1-May-2014, 09:53
A nice try Bob,
but you will see - these posts about new fantastic bellows repair acrylic coat will just flourish like mushrooms after rain each time someone comes with the idea.


One option I've used multiple times with success is the "puffy paint" or 3D fabric paint that can be used to draw on T-shirts to make decorative designs. Just one bottle of the stuff has lasted me years, I use this particular brand...

http://www.amazon.com/Scribbles-3D-Fabric-Paint-Shiny-Black/dp/B000JONZ9U

It adheres well, is black and opaque, and remains flexible. It also comes in a handy bottle with a fine point that is perfect for precision application into pin holes in bellows corners. And it's cheap!

Well, little did I know...

Sheldon N
1-May-2014, 21:26
That is the difference between a pro and a weekend amateur. The pro knows the value of his pictures and work and knows he cannot afford pseudo solutions. The amateur who takes his camera for a ride twice a month sees that the patched hole holds even the second month and shouts - it really holds, the repair is ... well, durable!

Well, little did I know...


LOL... too funny.

There's two approaches to this type of problem... panic and insist that only the most secure and tried and true methods will work. Buy brand new cameras, replace any gear that shows any signs of wear, drop big money on brand new everything. Of course, if you're "pro" this is the "right" way to do it.

Or, you could be like 90% of the people on the forum here, shoot with older used gear, for the joy of making images, on a reasonable budget. And then you could appreciate the highly useful suggestions for economical repair that many people here on this forum have offered... noting that yes, they are only temporary repairs and do not stop the inevitable march that time and entropy has upon camera gear, and on us all as well. ;)

And as as side note, all the gear of real pros that I've come in contact with is far more well used, beat up, fixed up, and gaff taped than any of the cameras of your typical amateur.

hoffner
2-May-2014, 01:26
... noting that yes, they are only temporary repairs

At least that you have right.

VPooler
2-May-2014, 02:04
At least that you have right.

Nothing is infinite, even those new fancy bellows will eventually rot. I have decided to spend less money on fancy gear and more on the materials, you know, actually go out and have fun shooting. Can't have both on my salary.

hoffner
2-May-2014, 02:20
. I have decided to spend less money on fancy gear and more on the materials,
Can't have both on my salary.

Whatever that means. But shooting with leaky bellows isn't exactly cheap either, is it?

VPooler
2-May-2014, 08:11
Whatever that means. But shooting with leaky bellows isn't exactly cheap either, is it?

Who said I have leaky bellows? I did repair them with tape and acrylic and I do check them before shooting. Once the pinholes start appearing these shall be replaced with brand new ones but since it is just a few damaged corners from years and years of abuse by previous owner, I am not very worried. The cost of replacement bellows will buy me 100 sheets of film and chemicals to develop them.

hoffner
2-May-2014, 08:56
Nothing is infinite, even those new fancy bellows will eventually rot. I have decided to spend less money on fancy gear and more on the materials, you know, actually go out and have fun shooting. Can't have both on my salary.

Who said something is "infinite" and fancy bellows will never rot? Either you want to use arguments reduced ad absurdum or not. Take your pick.

Sheldon N
2-May-2014, 10:37
....and thank goodness for the ignore button. Life is too short to waste on people who have nothing to offer but argumentative and unhelpful posts.

hoffner
2-May-2014, 11:32
Ok, you beat me to it.

To all those, who think that a coat of acrylic paint can repair your failing bellows riddled with holes - make the following test.

Take a piece of white paper. Fold it in the way a part (best the part with a corner) of your bellows is folded. Make a small hole to it. Now, pull it straight, as bellows is when in its full length. Coat it with your preferred acrylic paint. Let it dry. Fold it again to the bellows shape. Now stretch this bellows part and fold it again, as you do with camera bellows when using it, counting how many stretching times it takes before you start to perceive the white paper or the hole under the paint coat again. (Look at the folds and in its corner.) That's the number of stretching your "repair" will last.

Now on the positive note. The only way how to repair a bellows with holes, so that it could still be used for some reasonable time without fear of failure is to patch the holes with a tape, cut of a suitable material and folded and glued to the original failed part of the bellows. The only disadvantage you will have from this repair is the slightly (depending on the size of the patch) diminished flexibility of the bellows. But the patched part will very probably outlast the rest of the bellows, as it will be made of a new material unlike the rest of the ageing bellows.

Hope this put the matter to the rest (no, I don't believe it).

AtlantaTerry
20-Jul-2014, 02:49
Scribbles 3D fabric paint - black
Hobby Lobby $1.29 for a 1 ounce bottle:
http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/scribbles-black-shiny-3d-paint-774422/

Tomas Orr
23-Oct-2014, 21:24
Thank you all for a very informative and invaluable help.

I build upon the original first advice by Cletus, and this is what I did, after several month of research on new materials, to a bellows with several pinholes around the four corners (mainly on the front standard and back; where most of my 8x10 movements are made) The bellows were clean and sound except for the pinholes -the weakest link on all bellows.

The goal of the repair was to reinforce the "weak" areas where pinholes develop and in the process make the bellows worry free for a long time.

Materials used:

1) Liquitex Black Mars acrylic paint ( The cheap one artist loft works the same as the professional line ) US $14 dollars
2) Kevlar cloth T9-1094a from Warwick Mills in NH USA. This is a very light thin fabric but very difficult to puncture and cut; use ceramic scissors to cut. 12 x 60 inches free sample
3) Permatex Ultra Black gasket maker for the larger holes. US $6
4) Comp-O-Stik adhesive Hockey Tape Black. US $5.49
5) Perfomix plasti dip spry can mate black. $11
6) Contact cement. already had it
7) Alcohol sold on CVS pharmacy. already had it

- First I patched the larger holes with Permatex and a needle, about 3 holes. spreading the remaining on the bellow creases.
- Second step was to paint with Liquitex acrylic paint a thin coat along the bellows four corners front to back, about 1 inch wide. I use paint masking tape to keep it straight and clean.
- Third, I painted with Liquitex the Kevlar fabric which the paint permeates to both sides (the purpose here was to make it a "little" light proof but not completely or it would add to much thickness.
- Fourth, After everything was dry, I taped the Hockey black tape to the Kevlar fabric. even though the hockey tape has a backing adhesive I use some contact cement to make it permanent.
- Fifth. Applied contact cement to the Kevlar side and with the bellows stretched out, carefully tape the bellows.

Before applying the hockey tape - Kevlar combination to the bellows, I did some testing with a left over piece. I hammered it against a wood block, flex it many times, stab it with a knife,
use a heat gun. test it for abrasion against a stone and a filing.... yes i finally puncture the thing with a nail and harmer but it wasn't as easy as with a regular piece of bellows...

The thickness of the strip of hockey-kevlar sandwich was very thin (about .27 mm if memory serves me well) and if anything gave the bellows more rigidity without sacrificing movements.
As someone mentioned earlier here, I think the bellows will fall apart before this repair does.

A few notes. one of the reasons the kevlar fabric is protected by acrylix paint is that Kevlar is sensitive to UV light; i.e. the sun will deteriorate kevlar strength over time. Also the hockey tape will protect it.

For me the cost of this repair was justified in part because a new Bellows costs over $170 dollars doesn't make economic sense to me if I can repair it and is structurally sound.
Also these new bellows are made with water proof nylon material and nylon will deteriorate over time.

How come the bellows makers are not using new or not so new materials like Kevlar or Nomex etc... ?

Well I just wanted two add my two cents here

Best