Reliability of Wood Film Holders

[Jay Decker]

Purchased a camera that cam with came with a number of beautiful 8x10 wood film holders. The holders look very "fresh", i.e., like they were not used much at all. Are wood film holders as accurate and reliable as the plastic Fedelity and Riteway holders? Any other uses for wood film holders?

http://monkeytumble.com/tmp/Wood_film_holers.jpg

[Vaughn]

1) Did the holders come with the camera originally? Back in the day, holders were made to fit a particular camera -- not a lot of consistancy in the specs between brands. Not only in over-all size of the holders but how deep they were (the film needs to be on the same plane as the GG for accurate focus).

2) Are they film holders or plate holders. And if plate holders, do they have inserts for film?

3) Wood holders are less subject to static buildup and are sometimes lighter than the newer plastic holders.

4) They were built to work, so unless they are damaged, or the material used in the light traps have broken down (unlikely), they should be light tight.

I have a couple Hoffman 11x14 wood holders that are giving me some problems -- the film can slide down which can cause the darkslide to hit the film when re-inserting the darkslide...and pop the film out into the camera. An relative easy fix once I figure out how I want to do it.

[Curt]

Jay, I have several 8x10 holders that are similar. They look new inside and minimal use wear on the outside. The T-Depth is .187 +- the tolorance and there are no light leaks. They work just fine. They even have the metal septums built in as was the process at the time. The film is very secure.

[Peter Gomena]

I've had one old wooden holder that was warped, but I own several in various formats that work just fine. I do keep the back of my camera covered by a dark cloth while removing the dark slide, exposing and reinserting the slide. You can't be too careful with old cameras and gear.

Peter Gomena

[Steven Tribe]

I think I have had every conceivable type of wooden plate holders in my grubby fingers! From 4x5" up to 30x40cm.

Here is a summary of the problems I have found:

1. The equivalent of modern fidelity type (like yours, Jay). The position of the ridge light trap varies (even between makers in Rochester!).

Generally very good. Sometimes, loose, cracked or missing handles.

2. Mahogany Book type.

Again, generally good condition. Frame is always good. Central metal plate and springs can have been modified for "special purposes" or for sheet film. The aluminium usually needs the surface oxides removed and repainting. The dark slides' light leaks through the mahogany and hinges can be easily found. Mahogany this thin does often show skrinkage cracks. I have always filled these on both sides with black mastic. Cloth hinges occasionally have minor problems, but I have never had to change the tape. Dark slide tops can have starting or completed cracks which can be solved by glue (suitable for hardwoods!). Velvet seals last for ever unless eaten by some miserable creature!

3. Mahogany (usually hinged as well) dark slide system without the book openings.

More damage to the handle than the book type due to people trying to remove the dark slide completely. Very difficult to locate and repair light leaks.

4. Tambour types

I have only seen 3 types. Some were very good. Others in pieces. The end section where the tambour slide turns through 180 degrees is not always fixed with retaining screws which makes servicing/repairs almost impossible. Material is not mahogany, but has a finer grain. I have no idea how a light leak could be detected or repaired!

5. Tambour/trap door type.

Much easier to find and solve problems. These are very solid plate holders, made to stand up to several lifetimes in a studio.


"Any other uses for wood film holders?"

I have a type 5 which has been modified to function as a contact print holder.

[cosmicexplosion]

you can easily modify then to take tintypes

i have about 12 woodies, mine are old and worn, and stiff compared to fidels, so after working with then, plastic is a dream.

they are lighter than plastic.

yours look nice.

i am tempted to put a bit of dry lube down the very edge of my dark-slides to make em work better. or sand them back a bit as they are a bit rough from ware and tear.

i allways fill up my plastics, i have 7 or so (one broken)

and then go to woodies as reserve, so its good to have a bunch about.

i have not had any light leaks. and mine are pretty old.

[E. von Hoegh]

If they are standard holders, and they have not been abused, they are every bit as good as plastic holders. I prefer them to plastic.

[Mark Sampson]

Someone did a comparison test of various 4x5 holders about 15 years ago and published the results in 'View Camera'. Surprisingly enough the most accurate were wooden Kodak/Graphic holders and Grafmatics. I prefer Fidelitys, myself, but have made many sharp pictures using wooden holders. If yours are in physically good shape you should be fine.

[SergeiR]

I have not used ones i had for 4x5, but i did use Ansco/Agfa ones on 8x10. They were kinda icky at the start (have not been in use for a while i guess), but after some shedding and training - seems to be doing fine. As mentioned - they appear to be lighter than plastic ones , although not as smooooooth :)

[E. von Hoegh]

The Folmer/Kodak wood 8x10 holders are superb. An advantage is that you can disassemble the lighttraps to remove dust and renew the velvet if neccesary.

[Vaughn]

...i am tempted to put a bit of dry lube down the very edge of my dark-slides to make em work better. or sand them back a bit as they are a bit rough from ware and tear.

You might just try a little furniture polish (Pledge, etc) on the darkslides. A small squirt and then polish them up with a cloth.

I have greatly improved the sliding of the darkslides of 100+ year old plate holders by just polishing them up with a cotton rag and elbow grease.

Vaughn

[John Kasaian]

Try 'em and see:)

[Curt]

The Folmer/Kodak wood 8x10 holders are superb. An advantage is that you can disassemble the lighttraps to remove dust and renew the velvet if neccesary.

That's what I have, couldn't think of the name, yes they are very good and light too.

[David A. Goldfarb]

Wood is usually lighter than plastic, so that's an attraction. Like anything old they can have problems, but most of the ones I've had have been okay, or the problems have been sufficiently obvious that I could just cull out or repair the bad ones without having to test them.

Weston was eternally complaining about warped filmholders, but I'm not sure why this was particularly a curse for him. The humidity wherever he happened to be in Mexico or California at the time maybe?

[BetterSense]

The wood holders seem to be less attractive to static electricity and so they seem to collect less dust. They are lighter, too.

[Chauncey Walden]

Jay, they make plastic film holders? What will they think of next!

[E. von Hoegh]

Jay, they make plastic film holders? What will they think of next!

They even make plastic cameras....

[Alan Gales]

They even make plastic cameras....

That use plastic lenses with plastic mounts!

[E. von Hoegh]

That use plastic lenses with plastic mounts!
And are full of plastic parts!

[Alan Gales]

The mother of one of one of my daughter's friends had her tripod out. I picked it up. It was way lighter than any of those expensive carbon fiber jobs.

It was made of plastic!

[John Kasaian]

The mother of one of one of my daughter's friends had her tripod out. I picked it up. It was way lighter than any of those expensive carbon fiber jobs.

It was made of plastic!
Isn't carbon fiber just expensive plastic?

[E. von Hoegh]

Isn't carbon fiber just expensive plastic?

Not really. Plastic is just very inferior carbon fiber. I wonder has anyone made a fiberglass tripod?

And if they marketed wood as "cellulose fiber" they'd be able to increase the price and still sell more.

[Vaughn]

Not really. Plastic is just very inferior carbon fiber. I wonder has anyone made a fiberglass tripod?

Yes. Quite common for suryeying. http://www.engineersupply.com/How-To-Buy-A-Surveying-Tripod.aspx

I have three Fidelity wood holders (8x10 -- bought NOS) that are my go-to holders for my most important exposures. They can be a bit of a PITA to load as the corners of the film can get caught in the wood.

Vaughn

[Alan Gales]

Isn't carbon fiber just expensive plastic?

I guess so.

My friend, Harold, has a nice Gitzo carbon fiber tripod. It's very light but strong. This plastic thing that this lady had I think I could have snapped it between two of my fingers! :eek:

[Alan Gales]

Fiberglass tripods are strong but heavy just like fiberglass ladders.

[Jim Andrada]

Uhh - Carbon fibers are carbon fibers. May be embedded in some kind of plastic tape or matrix sort of like metal reinforcing rods embedded in concrete, but the fibers are carbon and not plastic.

Might be more accurate to refer to carbon fiber reinforced plastic (or polymer)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon-fiber-reinforced_polymer

[John Kasaian]

Fiber glass is just an inferior version of wood:p