Linhof #3663 tripod head 1/4" screw needed

[Bill_1856]

After many years of lusting for a Linhof #3663 tripod head I finally found a used one that I could afford.
Unfortunately it came with a 3/8" attaching screw, but all my cameras have the smaller 1/4" size. Does anyone know where I can get one?
Thanks.

[Frank Petronio]

B&h

[Sal Santamaura]

B&hSpecifically:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/31670-REG/Linhof_051644_Screw_for_3_Way_Leveling.html

[Frank Petronio]

It's a very nice screw in spite of getting screwed.

[Alan Gales]

Hey, $48.50 is dirt cheap. The U.S. Military would pay thousands of dollars for a screw like that!

[Bob Salomon]

We normally have them in stock. Just call to order one. 800 735-4373

BTW, there are now three new
linhof leveling heads.

The 003663 with a built-in Linhof Quickfix quick release
The same head with a built-in Arca/Novoflex quick release
The new 3-way geared leveling head is now also available with an Arca/Novoflex quick release.

[Bill_1856]

Bob, thanks for answering.
Alan, I think that it IS the military price. :-)

[Bill_1856]

HP doesn't have it in stock -- they said it would have to be ordered from Europe.

[Leigh]

The standard tripod screw is 1/4"-20. Common as hens' eggs. Any DIY store stocks many different types and sizes.

Buy one of suitable style and dimensions, and a thick 1/4" washer to go between it and the tripod head.

It won't have the retaining ring, so you'll need to put it in a ziplock bag when no camera is attached,
but you can buy lots of ziplock bags for $50.

- Leigh

[Bob Salomon]

The standard tripod screw is 1/4"-20. Common as hens' eggs. Any DIY store stocks many different types and sizes.

Buy one of suitable style and dimensions, and a thick 1/4" washer to go between it and the tripod head.

It won't have the retaining ring, so you'll need to put it in a ziplock bag when no camera is attached,
but you can buy lots of ziplock bags for $50.

- Leigh

If it were only that easy. It isn't!

[Leigh]

If it were only that easy. It isn't!
Why not? A screw is a screw, and Linhof did not invent the size.

- Leigh

[Frank Petronio]

I believe a $13 Gitzo thumb screw with wheel will work until you can locate the real deal. The genuine Linhof part is actually very nice (thick, heavy duty, good in the hand) and worth the price. Alternatively you could talk to a machinist or rummage a parts bin. You can definitely find the Gitzo screws at any good camera supply.

[Steve Smith]

Traditionally, tripod threads were 1/4" 20 tpi British Standard Whitworth which is very similar to 1/4" UNC, bot not identical (five degree difference in cut angle).

Today you are likely to find both in use. It would make sense to find out which thread your camera has, particularly if it's a heavy camera.


Steve.

[Bob Salomon]

It is several inches long, has a machined shaft, brass and looks nothing like anything found at Home Depot or Lowes.

[Steve Smith]

Linhof did not invent the size.

No. Joseph Whitworth did.


Steve.

[Leigh]

Traditionally, tripod threads were 1/4" 20 tpi British Standard Whitworth which is very similar to 1/4" UNC, bot not identical (five degree difference in cut angle).
I will have to check and see.
I have thread gauges in both 60° UNC and 55° Whitworth, and several tripods, so I'll measure the screws.

Since Whitworth threads fell out of favor before WWII, I'm inclined to doubt your statement, but I can't say it's wrong.

I'll report back.

- Leigh

[Bob Salomon]

I believe a $13 Gitzo thumb screw with wheel will work until you can locate the real deal. The genuine Linhof part is actually very nice (thick, heavy duty, good in the hand) and worth the price. Alternatively you could talk to a machinist or rummage a parts bin. You can definitely find the Gitzo screws at any good camera supply.

It isn't that simple. This is a 3-way head and there is very little clearence when the head is in its standard confiuration between the bottom of the top plate and the top of the lever clamp for the pan on the top of the bottom plate. The Gitzo screw is totally different in length and shape. The only part that is common is the thread size.

Also, the 003663 has a 3/8" retaining thread to keep the 1/4" or the 3/8" bolt from falling out accidently from the head. While some Gitzo bolts also have the 3/8" retaining or keeper thread it is spaced differently then Linhof's.

It does not take very long to get the proper screw from the factory but at this time we don't have any left in stock.

[Steve Smith]

From Wikipedia (I know it's not the holy grail of information):


Nearly all current stills cameras accept a 1/4 in Whitworth tripod thread in their baseplate and many motion picture cameras accept a 3/8 in Whitworth, while a 5/8 in thread is the accepted standard for tripod mounted land surveying equipment.

The Leica Thread-Mount used on rangefinder cameras and on many enlarging lenses is 39 mm by 26 turns-per-inch Whitworth, an artifact of its having been developed by a German company specializing in microscopes and thus equipped with tooling capable of handling threads in inches and in Whitworth.


If Whitworth was being used by German camera manufacturers then it pre-dates the existence of UNC. The last time I looked into this, I found one tripod manufacturer specifying Whitworth and one specifying UNC but I see no reason to doubt that originally it was Whitworth.

And this from a Wiki page on tripod threads:


Screw thread

Per ISO 1222:2010, the current tripod screw thread standard for attaching the camera calls for a 1/4-20 UNC or 3/8-16 UNC thread. Most consumer cameras are fitted with 1/4-20 UNC threads. Larger, professional cameras and lenses may be fitted with 3/8-16 UNC threads, plus a removable 1/4-20 UNC adapter, allowing them to be mounted on a tripod using either standard.

Historically, the thread standard for attaching older cameras to tripods was 1/4-20 BSW for smaller cameras or 3/8-16 BSW for larger cameras and pan/tilt heads. In this application the BSW and UNC thread profiles are similar enough that one can mount a modern camera on a legacy tripod and vice versa.

I don't agree with the last line! It's more likely that modern tripod manufacturers are using a 1/4" 20 tpi thread with a cut profile designed to fit either thread without binding.


Since Whitworth threads fell out of favor before WWII, I'm inclined to doubt your statement, but I can't say it's wrong.

Whitworth was being used by the UK car industry (when we had one) up to the 1970s. The UNC system wasn't properly unified until 1948.



Steve.

[Frank Petronio]

Oh I am not debating whether or not the OEM Linhof part is worth it - it is. Just that in a pinch he might make it work.

[Leigh]

Whitworth was being used by the UK car industry (when we had one) up to the 1970s.
That does not contradict my statement that the Whitworth threadform fell out of favor before WWII. :D

When Ford bought Jaguar...
Jaguar QC amounted to driving the car around with someone sitting on the bonnet listening for noises.

The UK auto industry is not noted for leading-edge technology.


The UNC system wasn't properly unified until 1948.
UNC is a consolidation of standards that harken back to the early 19th Century.
The only changes were tighter tolerances, as appropriate for modern tooling and gauging techniques.

- Leigh

[Steve Smith]

driving the car around with someone sitting on the bonnet

I've done that a few times. Ended up in hospital for a few stitches one night after the driver took a sharp turn and I didn't (on a 1960s Humber Hawk which definitely had Whitworth threads!).


The UK auto industry is not noted for leading-edge technology.

By the mid 1970s neither the UK or US car industries were cutting edge and haven't been since.


Steve.

[Leigh]

Given that Leica has a long history of using 55° Whitworth (e.g. the 36mm Leica lens thread and their microscope lenses),
I'll accept that the standard tripod head screw originally used that threadform.

Except at the tightest tolerances, 20tpi UNC and 20tpi Whitworth are intermatable with no issues.

- Leigh

[Steve Smith]

Except at the tightest tolerances, 20tpi UNC and 20tpi Whitworth are intermatable with no issues.

I don't remember which way round it is but the screw of one thread will fit the nut of the other but not the other way round without the likelihood of binding. But as you suggest, probably only if the screw is on top tolerance and the nut on bottom tolerance.


Steve.

[Bill_1856]

This is 2012! I can't believe that we're still discussing Whitworth threads.

[Leigh]

This is 2012! I can't believe that we're still discussing Whitworth threads.
Why not?

We still use air, and it was invented long before Whitworth threads. I remember signing the patent application for it.

Just because something is old doesn't mean it's useless, as I and many others here can attest. :D

- Leigh

[Steve Smith]

We still use air, and it was invented long before Whitworth threads. I remember signing the patent application for it.

And wheels. I remember when I came up with the idea. I had to invent a new device to draw them as my freehand sketch wasn't accurate enough.


Steve.

[Steve Smith]

This is interesting (if you like that sort of thing!).

From Wisner's website:


High strength bronze tripod plate with European and American threads.

The base of the camera has a 1/4" and a 3/8" thread. I'm not sure which way round the American/European designation is.

Picture here: http://harrysproshop.com/Wisner/trad/Wisner_Trad_Closed_Front.jpg


Steve.