LF lenses for Architectural Models?

[Shortstack]

I'm about to begin building scale models of interior architectural spaces which will be around 70" squared and would ideally like photograph them with a LF camera. What I would like clarification on is whether I will find a lens with a minimimum focus distance small enough to photograph the entire model sharp. I am yet undecided on which camera to purchase (if indeed LF cameras are compatible with this form of photography at all) but I will be restricted to a 4x5 field camera as this will give me more of a chance of getting in nooks and crannies than a 10x8 although I know its going to be a squeeze.

Any advice much appreciated.

[Mark Woods]

Without some prism arrangement, I doubt is you could shoot LF. Also, your DOF would be exponentially less than on a smaller format camera. Also, one of the standard approaches to miniatures is to get the lens at the scale height of a scale person, something very difficult for LF. Finally, you could shoot extremely long exposures at small T/Stops. An ideal lens solution to this problem is the Innovision Lens system. Here's a link: http://www.innovision-optics.com/

[Kirk Gittings]

Personally, I would stitch with a DSLR and T/S lenses and do focus stacking when appropriate.

[Shortstack]

Personally, I would stitch with a DSLR and T/S lenses and do focus stacking when appropriate.

I thought dslr might be the only option. I wonder what kit the likes of James Casebere use. His table top models are photographed with a seemingly great DOF and displays prints in sizes upwards of 46x80". Also I wonder if anyone has attempted to focus stack high res LF scans?

[Sevo]

LF certainly does not make that job any easier. In theory, it might be possible to combine relay lenses (snorkels) with LF cameras for increased DOF and to place a huge camera within a comparatively small model - but what with the limited coverage of these systems, the actual film area will be smaller than LF, so that the only use of the LF camera would be to get additional rear tilt capabilities.

But unless you have your heart set on solving that problem with LF, there now are much better solutions at lower price - snorkeling it would be a very nineties and extremely expensive high-tech approach. Stitching and focus stacking can create infinite DOF of inanimate subjects with software cheaper than an hours worth of the cinematography expert you'd have to hire along with the snorkel, and you can now rent excellent, compact DSLR tilt lenses which will deliver higher resolution than any relay system.

[ic-racer]

If you want it to look like a model then large format is great. If you want it to look realistic, then a film format closer to the actual scale is better.

[Kirk Gittings]

If you want it to look like a model then large format is great. If you want it to look realistic, then a film format closer to the actual scale is better.

I have no idea what you mean by this?

[Sevo]

I have no idea what you mean by this?

To photograph a scale model to have the same proportions and perspective as the real thing, you have to get proportionally close - which is hard to do with a large format camera due to the camera size and the tiny DOF you get at the magnifications it implies. Hence relay lenses, endoscopes, mirrors, focus stacking etc.

Shooting it to look like a model requires the usual tools and techniques for the regular table top pack shot - something that used to be a LF domain (and has not improved in quality by now being mostly done on cheaper, smaller cameras)...

[TheDeardorffGuy]

Twenty years ago I was a photographer for several model railroad manufacturers. I shot locomotives with trains on some of the most realistic layouts you can imagine. I was photographing miniature topography. No difference in shooting interior models. I shot 4x5 chromes. I used two lenses. A 190 4.5 Raptar. It was nice and bright and very sharp. I used all the front movements. The other lens was a 3 inch Dagor. It was intended for 2 1/4 X 3 1/4 but with the bellows extension I had covered 4x5. the max length was usually 5-7 feet and 4 feet tall. I have tried to stitch with fair sucess but I think I'd rather use film.

[Shortstack]

Twenty years ago I was a photographer for several model railroad manufacturers. I shot locomotives with trains on some of the most realistic layouts you can imagine. I was photographing miniature topography. No difference in shooting interior models. I shot 4x5 chromes. I used two lenses. A 190 4.5 Raptar. It was nice and bright and very sharp. I used all the front movements. The other lens was a 3 inch Dagor. It was intended for 2 1/4 X 3 1/4 but with the bellows extension I had covered 4x5. the max length was usually 5-7 feet and 4 feet tall. I have tried to stitch with fair sucess but I think I'd rather use film.

That's good to know, thanks for that. What kind of bellows extension length would you be looking at for an acceptable minimum focus distance with these lenses? Also, my intention is to have everything sharp within a table top model, is that something you achieved with the above? Sorry if the questiions seem naive, very new to LF.

[TheDeardorffGuy]

That's good to know, thanks for that. What kind of bellows extension length would you be looking at for an acceptable minimum focus distance with these lenses? Also, my intention is to have everything sharp within a table top model, is that something you achieved with the above? Sorry if the questiions seem naive, very new to LF.

Ok, yes it was sharp with in the area I was shooting. The Alphax shutter stops down further than the parked F64. It does about f 140. Measured with calipers and divided into 190mm. As far as extension goes I used a bellows extension calculater. The true F stop would have been around F 300 or more. But the calculator takes care of that. same with the 75mm Dagor. You really need to watch the movements carefully. The sky can go soft easily. When you do this type of closeup work there are some comprimises you may need depending on your camera.. I found I had better images shooting outside with a light box set up using new queen sized bedsheets. Very bright with quick shutter speeds. 1/10 of a sec...