Wanderlust 4x5 P&S

[Larry Kellogg]

They cleaned up their act over 20 years ago. But personally I waaaay prefer 42nd Street of 1986 to the Disneyland that it is now. Actually I prefer the city as a whole of those days of yore....

Just don't mess with the painted ladies or the mean Disney characters:

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/08/19/nyregion/times-squares-topless-women-should-be-regulated-mayor-says.html?smprod=nytcore-iphone&smid=nytcore-iphone-share

[Mike Bates]

No confusion here. The only thing that makes sense is to distribute as many cameras as possible at the pickup party, saving the shipping costs for that many cameras. Then start shipping the cameras that weren't picked up. Shipping is likely coming out of their own pockets anyway.

I'm interested to see who posts the first photo from a Travelwide. Probably a photo from the pickup party itself.

[plywood]

I'm interested to see who posts the first photo from a Travelwide. Probably a photo from the pickup party itself.

Yes, I do hope they post a few pictures of backers at the party holding their new TW90's. I would also expect a few of those fortunate enough to pick up their cameras to give us first impressions of the handling and feel of the camera. If I lived close I'd bring my 90 Angulon and some loaded film holders and a long cable release. Might not have time to calibrate the focus scale but you just might be fortunate and hit it right on.

[Tin Can]

Hello Ben,

Did I miss an email with Sunday's location and time?

[Steve Pitchford]

No confusion here. The only thing that makes sense is to distribute as many cameras as possible at the pickup party, saving the shipping costs for that many cameras. Then start shipping the cameras that weren't picked up. Shipping is likely coming out of their own pockets anyway.

I'm interested to see who posts the first photo from a Travelwide. Probably a photo from the pickup party itself.

Mike & et. al. ,


Some time back I suggested that they (the guys)may have some cash issues when shipping time came, and that perhaps we should all chip in. Looks like that time may have come. I've bought and sold many items on ebay and think the cameras could ship USPS for $19.95 or less. Maybe it could be done thru a PayPal account, that would make it easy. Count me in.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[Larry Kellogg]

Good Guy Steve.

[plywood]

I think only backers in the US would volunteer to do this because all backers outside the US were already charged $40 additional to have their cameras shipped, even Canada.

[Andrew O'Neill]

Yup, $40 shipping and I'll also get dinged for duties at the border…but still a cheap 'lil 4x5 camera.

[Ben Syverson]

Our pick-up party is tomorrow, and I'd love to see any LFF members there, even if you didn't order a camera! I'd be happy to see more friendly faces.

We'll be at the space 2PM-4PM on August 23. Our studio is at 3065 N Rockwell St in Chicago—PM me for more details if you want to show up.

[Brian Puccio]

Our pick-up party is tomorrow, and I'd love to see any LFF members there, even if you didn't order a camera! I'd be happy to see more friendly faces.

We'll be at the space 2PM-4PM on August 23. Our studio is at 3065 N Rockwell St in Chicago—PM me for more details if you want to show up.

What's the agreed upon social media hashtag for this? #travelwide? #wanderlust? #4x5pointnshoot? I need to live vicariously though all of you until the shipments go out.

[Ben Syverson]

I recommend #travelwide — it's specific and short!

[plywood]

Our pick-up party is tomorrow, and I'd love to see any LFF members there, even if you didn't order a camera! I'd be happy to see more friendly faces.

We'll be at the space 2PM-4PM on August 23. Our studio is at 3065 N Rockwell St in Chicago—PM me for more details if you want to show up.

Although stuck here in Puget Sound would sure like to see some photo's posted of the first backers holding their new Travelwides. For those fortunate enough to pick up their cameras and hobnob with Ben and Justin, have fun folks.

Is there any word when shipping will begin?

[Jim Cole]

Is there any word when shipping will begin?

The word from the latest Kickstarter Update was "soon". Not very specific.

[Larry Kellogg]

Monday morning, oh five thirty.

[plywood]

Monday morning, oh five thirty.

Was this in regard to Jim Cole's comment? (that's 2:30 AM here on the west coast, I'll probably be awake, old folks have trouble sleeping)

But seriously, it really is time for Ben to commit to a timeline for shipping to backers. If that is unreasonable then I like to know why.
If it's the money for shipping that's holding up the show then I'd chip in $20 and I'm sure a few other US based backers would but I don't know how many others would go along with with that idea.

[Larry Kellogg]

It's a joke. I have no idea, but doubt the boys will be up before eight.

[Ben Syverson]

But seriously, it really is time for Ben to commit to a timeline for shipping to backers. If that is unreasonable then I like to know why.
If it's the money for shipping that's holding up the show then I'd chip in $20 and I'm sure a few other US based backers would but I don't know how many others would go along with with that idea.
It's not unreasonable to want a timeline, but unfortunately, I can't give you one. The reasons why: 1) We haven't had all the parts and collateral until this week, and 2) we need to completely optimize the shipping process to save me money. It's oddly difficult to get a quote on bulk shipments from different carriers. They really make it difficult. The easy thing to do is to ship through a fulfillment service which already has contracts with USPS, UPS and FedEx, but they're all pretty expensive, and most of them are too full-featured.

So honestly, international fulfillment is just not that easy. Bear with us! We will get these out as quickly as we possibly can.

[rfesk]

Ben, I for one am not in a gosh awful hurry but will gladly send an extra $20.00 for shipping. That shipping can really add up.

[plywood]

It's not unreasonable to want a timeline, but unfortunately, I can't give you one. The reasons why: 1) We haven't had all the parts and collateral until this week, and 2) we need to completely optimize the shipping process to save me money. It's oddly difficult to get a quote on bulk shipments from different carriers. They really make it difficult. The easy thing to do is to ship through a fulfillment service which already has contracts with USPS, UPS and FedEx, but they're all pretty expensive, and most of them are too full-featured.

So honestly, international fulfillment is just not that easy. Bear with us! We will get these out as quickly as we possibly can.

Thank you Ben for that answer to my question. I'm quite sure it was on the mind of several backers.
I'm sure shipping for 1000 cameras could exceed $20K total and that would be a serious out of pocket expense.

Have fun and hopefully less pressure at the pick-up party. Post a few pictures if you can.

[Tin Can]

I just picked mine up and will open the box later tonight. Ben and his wife are wonderful people and I am glad to finally meet them.

I dare complainers to do anything this complicated.

Now back to my impossible projects...LOL :)

[Peter De Smidt]

What a tremendous achievement! Congratulations to everyone involved!

[plywood]

Just looked at Justin's instagram feed. Now I see why you don't just throw all the parts in a carton and let us do the assembly. Dividing up over 10K screws of 2 different sizes into 1000 cartons would be as much work as assembling the doggone things in the first place.

Oh, by the by, how many showed up at the pick-up party?

[Tin Can]

I lied, I have a 90mm f6.8 WA Wollensak on it and looking for infinity in moments. On a huge heavy tripod!

[Larry Kellogg]

Go Randy, Go! Who will be the first backer to post a shot?

[Corran]

Can't wait!!!

As soon as I get mine I'm slappin' some lens on there and taking it out into the woods with a few holders and nothing else. Oh, the tripod too, for now.

[pierre506]

I just picked mine up and will open the box later tonight. Ben and his wife are wonderful people and I am glad to finally meet them.

I dare complainers to do anything this complicated.

Now back to my impossible projects...LOL :)
Let's see the real one, Randy.

[Ben Syverson]

I just picked mine up and will open the box later tonight. Ben and his wife are wonderful people and I am glad to finally meet them.

I dare complainers to do anything this complicated.

Now back to my impossible projects...LOL :)
It was great to meet you, Randy! I can't wait to see what you shoot with your Travelwide! Time to break out some flash bulbs and get your Weegee on. :)

[sperdynamite]

So jealous!! Post pictures! :-)

[Roger Thoms]

So did anyone document the event? Any photos or how about a YouTube video. Come on folks let see some action. :)

Roger

[Larry Kellogg]

I'm waiting for the convergence that will happen when people shoot some NEW55 on the TravelWide.

[Tin Can]

So did anyone document the event? Any photos or how about a YouTube video. Come on folks let see some action. :)

Roger

I did not and on purpose. That is their business. Ben shot 2 pics of me aiming a sample camera with lens.

[Ben Syverson]

I'm waiting for the convergence that will happen when people shoot some NEW55 on the TravelWide.
The first guy who picked up a Travelwide was also a New55 backer, and is planning on shooting some with the Travelwide. I'll urge him to post his results here!

[BarryS]

I'm waiting for the convergence that will happen when people shoot some NEW55 on the TravelWide.

I'm looking forward to the convergence of me and the Travelwide.

[Tin Can]

Modified to my liking. Old Ricoh flash handle with working Foto-Mite. Bogen QR for balance, help stand up and ease of using on tripod.

Sighted in and calibrated Raptor 90mm f6.8 which I bought here on the Forum.

138845

[Peter De Smidt]

Looks good, Randy.

[Roger Thoms]

Randy, looks nice, must be exciting to have the camera in hand. I have everything it need, just waiting for my camera to arrive. Looks like it will be soon, yahoo, better get some film holders loaded.

Roger

[Larry Kellogg]

LOL, Randy, can you eject flash bulbs? I'm thinking of all the flash shots in Raging Bull, the best ones at 1:50 in this trailer: http://youtu.be/YiVOwxsa4OM

[Tin Can]

LOL, Randy, can you eject flash bulbs? I'm thinking of all the flash shots in Raging Bull, the best ones at 1:50 in this trailer: http://youtu.be/YiVOwxsa4OM

Of course they eject, too hot to handle. All flash bulb heads or handles have an ejection method. The method varies. Foto-Mite has an ejection button. Foto-Mite is very lightweight, since it is BC, Battery and Capacitor and both must work. The battery is very expensive, more than a mint Foto-Mite. Old capacitors are often bad. If shooting people I put a special plastic shield over the bulb and reflector, a very ugly bag-like antiquity.

Let's keep this about the camera. Flash has it's own threads.

[Larry Kellogg]

Ok, got any pics?

[Tin Can]

Ok, got any pics?

I don't many post pics, but they look like 90mm Raptor lens on any other 4x5 camera.

Soon this thread will be flooded with pics.

Patience my friends. :)

[plywood]

That a neat bit of kit Randy. I'm curious as to what your impression is of the feel of the helical. Is there any perceptible lash in the focusing action?

[Tin Can]

That a neat bit of kit Randy. I'm curious as to what your impression is of the feel of the helical. Is there any perceptible lash in the focusing action?

I will not be reviewing the camera in any way.

[Andrew O'Neill]

I wonder when mine will arrive...:confused:

[Tim Meisburger]

Aparently mine has already arrived at my office in San Francisco. Unfortunately, I'm in Bangkok:(

Someone will be coming out this way September 8, so I guess I'll have it then.

Randy, so WeeGee! Hope you have a cigar and an old hat for prowling the late night streets of Chicago.

Bravo fellows! Mountain climbed. Job well done.

[Roger Cole]

So they are already shipping?

That's curiosity not impatience, BTW.

[Roger Thoms]

Just hope that I get a tracking number and that they require a signature. Sure don't want it left on the front porch here in SF. On the other hand I'm working nights so I'm home during the day.

Oh and Randy, no review, cool no spoilers, I like that.

Roger

[BarryS]

Aparently mine has already arrived at my office in San Francisco. Unfortunately, I'm in Bangkok:(

Someone will be coming out this way September 8, so I guess I'll have it then.

Randy, so WeeGee! Hope you have a cigar and an old hat for prowling the late night streets of Chicago.

Bravo fellows! Mountain climbed. Job well done.


Are you sure the package is the Travelwide?

[Ben Syverson]

Are you sure the package is the Travelwide?

I'm sorry to say—it is absolutely not. We're still assembling cameras and organizing logistics.

[Tim Meisburger]

Oh well... I have some photographic package at my office, and I have no idea what it is! Now I think I will ask them to open it.

[Larry Kellogg]

It must be your new Linhof Master Technika 3000, Tim. If I were closer, I'd pick it up and watch over it for you.

[Tim Meisburger]

Ha ha. It was a filter set I bought from Stone... Forgot all about it. Now I'm traumatised and will go online and see if I can change my shipping preference to Thailand...

[Roger Cole]

Just hope that I get a tracking number and that they require a signature. Sure don't want it left on the front porch here in SF. On the other hand I'm working nights so I'm home during the day.

Oh and Randy, no review, cool no spoilers, I like that.

Roger

And I hate when stuff is sent with signature required. I work nights all the time, and sleep with a box fan going and, sometimes, earplugs. So I get a note that basically means the next day I have to sleep on the couch in the living room so I'll hear the doorbell, put out a note saying "night work day sleep, I am home so please allow time for me to wake and get to the door" and then mess up my sleep for a day.

I've had in sure hundreds of packages left on the doorstep in the ten years I've lived here and never had anything bothered.

[Oren Grad]

For entertainment while we wait:

https://instagram.com/justinlundquist/

[Brian Puccio]

And I hate when stuff is sent with signature required. I work nights all the time, and sleep with a box fan going and, sometimes, earplugs. So I get a note that basically means the next day I have to sleep on the couch in the living room so I'll hear the doorbell, put out a note saying "night work day sleep, I am home so please allow time for me to wake and get to the door" and then mess up my sleep for a day.

I've had in sure hundreds of packages left on the doorstep in the ten years I've lived here and never had anything bothered.

I order tons of stuff off the internet. Getting a mailbox at the local UPS store (formerly known as Mailboxes Etc) was fantastic. Always someone to sign for whatever I'm getting delivered and I can pick it up on the way home from work. Plus when I move I don't have to worry about changing addresses just because my lease is up and I found a better place. Unlike PO boxes, UPS, USPS, Fedex and anyone else can deliver packages there. I'm sure there's a similar service in your city, maybe by UPS or maybe by someone else. My store is a franchise, so they pretty much just pay for UPS branding, none of them are actual UPS employees, FWIW.

UPS offers a new feature now that when a package is heading to your address, they'll email you the date they'll be there. It's a free service. They also mention a time, but I've never found it to be accurate. You can choose to divert the package to another location for a few extra dollars. http://www.ups.com/mychoice/

(I'm not sure if traveled will ship by UPS or not.)

[Corran]

For entertainment while we wait:

https://instagram.com/justinlundquist/

Nice! That's a lot of camera parts.

[Roger Cole]

I order tons of stuff off the internet. Getting a mailbox at the local UPS store (formerly known as Mailboxes Etc) was fantastic. Always someone to sign for whatever I'm getting delivered and I can pick it up on the way home from work. Plus when I move I don't have to worry about changing addresses just because my lease is up and I found a better place. Unlike PO boxes, UPS, USPS, Fedex and anyone else can deliver packages there. I'm sure there's a similar service in your city, maybe by UPS or maybe by someone else. My store is a franchise, so they pretty much just pay for UPS branding, none of them are actual UPS employees, FWIW.

UPS offers a new feature now that when a package is heading to your address, they'll email you the date they'll be there. It's a free service. They also mention a time, but I've never found it to be accurate. You can choose to divert the package to another location for a few extra dollars. http://www.ups.com/mychoice/

(I'm not sure if traveled will ship by UPS or not.)

There is, less than two miles from my house. I've thought about it but I can generally get stuff shipped without signature required and I've never had anything stolen or messed with. The rare times I can't get someone to ship without a required signature (B&H is or was bad about that depending on the value) haven't been that often. But if I find it more of a problem I will do this. I think the UPS store is open until 7 PM or so, 6 anyway and that's good enough. I'm up by then.

[Corran]

I remember when I ordered my Nikon D800E from B&H, with overnight shipping - almost $3400 total. Most expensive thing I've ever bought without a loan. I lived in a ratty apartment a mile away from the university I was attending, and it wasn't the greatest place in terms of safety and security.

So imagine my surprise when I came home late the following day of the release, having got a shipping notification but not a tracking number, and finding the box on my doorstop. It sat there from probably around noon till 9pm or whatever when I got home, being a workaholic Master's student. I was really lucky it was still there!!

I like signature confirmation sometimes! :) Even if it might be inconvenient in the short-term when I'm not there and they actually bother to do it.

[plywood]

I live in a neighborhood that is such that I would not want stuff left at the door. Since I'm going to be gone between 9/28 and 10/18 I do have some concern about the arrival time of the TW90. But it is understandable why Ben simply cannot accommodate over 1000 individual shipping needs so I'm just hoping it arrives before then. Of course, I have a good relationship with my neighbors and I'm quite sure they can pick up mail and check the front door each day so perhaps it is not such a huge risk after all.

[Larry Kellogg]

It looks to me like Justin is the assembly team and that he has a throughput of about fifty cameras a day.

I wish they would ship in batches. I have friends who make a well known camera accessory, by laborious handwork, and they lost a huge quantity of their product when a UPS truck burned. That nearly sunk them. I just hate to think of all the cameras sitting on one truck.

[Kuzano]

I used Mail Boxes Etc and it's successor for over 13 years. Never lost a package. I was in an industrial area of service shops where nobody was there at the same time. UPS and Fedex used to leave packages with neighboring shops and then you would have to wait until your neighbor was back in his/her shop.... perhaps up to a week later. These were all low traffic shops with renters working out of them.

Mail Boxes at $15 per month or less, was a godsend. Still operating that way today. Somebody signs for every package and keeps it behind the counter, with a note in my box.

I offered to pay the owner extra for package protection. He wouldn't hear of it. The monthly box rent for a small box was the most he would ever charge me....13+ years.

[Ben Syverson]

It looks to me like Justin is the assembly team and that he has a throughput of about fifty cameras a day.

I wish they would ship in batches. I have friends who make a well known camera accessory, by laborious handwork, and they lost a huge quantity of their product when a UPS truck burned. That nearly sunk them. I just hate to think of all the cameras sitting on one truck.
We're both assembling cameras, and our throughput is much higher than 50 per day…

[David Karp]

Hey Randy,

I will be using a 90mm Raptar with mine too! There was a quick bump in price on 90mm Angulons way back when, so I picked my Raptar up for a very reasonable price. If I remember, it came from a seller in Chicago. Looking forward to playing with mine.

[Corran]

I wonder if there's much, or any, difference between an Angulon and Raptar. I saw a 90mm f/8 Dagor on eBay yesterday, sold for $250 or so. I have an Angulon but it's not good until f/22 - I would like the option to shoot wider without having mushy corners!

I have an extra 90/8 SA with a damaged rear element (2 gouges in the glass, small) that I'm going to try with the TW. It's worth nothing with the damaged glass so I won't feel bad throwing it around in a small messenger bag with a few film holders.

[Larry Kellogg]

We're both assembling cameras, and our throughput is much higher than 50 per day…

Glad to hear it, sorry to leave you out, Ben.

[David Karp]

I wonder if there's much, or any, difference between an Angulon and Raptar. . . .

I can't say from experience. I can say that the image circle on the Raptar is big. There is room for way more movement than I thought there would be when I popped it on to my Walker Titan. I never tried to make a test photo to see what things look like with extreme movements applied, so it could be that the only useable part is of the image circle is from straight on.

[Roger Cole]

Not applicable to the Travelwide but even mushy corners are often useful especially in a wide angle lens. The most common reason I have for running out of coverage with a 90 is using front rise where there's a building involved, and often enough those corners are featureless sky, in which case they don't need to be sharp just illuminated.

[Kuzano]

Damage to the rear glass is the worst... no way to shoot around it, I would try it.

I would also not make a final decision on the damaged elements without talking/checking with Jon (john) at FocalPoint.com. He's done some work for me which I was very happy with. Also check with various LF lens repair persons in hope of locating a rear element for the SA.

[rdenney]

I wonder if there's much, or any, difference between an Angulon and Raptar. I saw a 90mm f/8 Dagor on eBay yesterday, sold for $250 or so. I have an Angulon but it's not good until f/22 - I would like the option to shoot wider without having mushy corners!

I have an extra 90/8 SA with a damaged rear element (2 gouges in the glass, small) that I'm going to try with the TW. It's worth nothing with the damaged glass so I won't feel bad throwing it around in a small messenger bag with a few film holders.

Fill the gouges with black ink and I bet you'll never notice their effects.

Rick "surprised by how much damage it takes to be noticeable" Denney

[Corran]

Yeah good suggestion of course, I just haven't even used the lens yet. It came with some other stuff last year and has just been sitting on my shelf.

Or I'll nab something like this one day:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151693183567

[Tin Can]

Yeah good suggestion of course, I just haven't even used the lens yet. It came with some other stuff last year and has just been sitting on my shelf.

Or I'll nab something like this one day:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151693183567

Why wait for that.

As I scanned lower on that page a nice Wolly is live bait.

[Corran]

Yeah I saw that, but I don't need another ~90mm lens!! :)
The Angulon I have is acceptable, as I've mentioned, at smaller stops. The SA would only be for shooting wider. We'll see, I'll try them both.

[Tin Can]

no comment

[Drew Bedo]

Capture the images you can with the equipment you have, wish for the "best there is", upgrade to what is available at the proce you can afford.

The whole point of the TravelWide is simplicity and light weight. I have rat-holed a compact 90mm from a press camera. There must be other 90mmlenses of better optical quality but . . .this one has been on my little Zone VI because the camera will fold up with the lense mounted. Whenever I can get a TW (new or slightly used) that lens will go on it, and I'll take what pictures can be made with that set-up.The TW with one Grafmatic will go into a small SLR bag and my back will thank me.

[Corran]

I like that I can change the lens for the situation at hand (not in the field, I mean before going out to shoot).

I will be trying out a 65/8 SA on it as well.

[plywood]

I tested my ratty Angulon f6.8 on a home built 4X5 and it is about what I expected, OK for the snapshot, small 2X enlargement I intend to use it for. I'm keeping an eye out for a super but not seriously. I'll probably be just as happy to stop the lens I already have down to f22 and use the TW on a tripod. For my other 4X5 the next lens I want is a Wollaston lens. They are available from Rinehold Schable, a APUG member. I think the 190mm f3.2 will be about right on 4X5 for portraiture and general not wide angle landscape.

[Ben Syverson]

One thing to note is that the Angulon ƒ/6.8 varied… a lot. It was manufactured over a very long time period. The "bad" ones should be good for contact prints and small enlargements. The "good" ones can stand up to 5x or 10x enlargement. Though they all have slightly weak corners wide open. The ƒ/8 and ƒ/6.8 symmetrical-ish designs are of course incredible across the field.

PS, we have a significant chunk of cameras assembled... We may ship these in smaller (250-500) batches just to clear room in the studio. It feels really great to look at a giant stack of cameras. At points, it felt like we'd never get here.

[Larry Kellogg]

To me, it's all about the lens in enabling this little plastic camera to punch far above its weight class.

So, I bought a Super and can't wait to see what kind of negatives it can produce. I'm ecstatic that they added the flocking to improve contrast, that might not have occurred to me.

I also have a fine 65mm lens, and with a dedicated TravelWide for each lens, I'll be all set to have fun.

[plywood]

PS, we have a significant chunk of cameras assembled... We may ship these in smaller (250-500) batches just to clear room in the studio. It feels really great to look at a giant stack of cameras. At points, it felt like we'd never get here.

That's great news. Will you be able to use tracking numbers so that we could be notified when shipped. In my neighborhood I'd like to be home when it arrives since a stolen TW would be irreplaceable.

[Brian Bullen]

Will any copal 0 90mm lens fit into the Travelwide. I have a fuji f8 and want to make sure it fits in case I ever get my hands on one of these. Thank you!

[Steve Goldstein]

Pretty much any Copal 0 90mm should fit, the question is the back-focus distance and whether you can achieve infinity focus. The camera was nominally designed for the f/6.8 Angulon, with 89.8mm flange focal length per some old Schneider spec I found. If the FFL is longer (e.g. Nikkor SW around 97mm) you'll have to use some of the helical's travel just to get to infinity, then whatever's left of the helical range will focus you closer. If your lens' FFL is shorter the you might not be able to focus at infinity.

The good news is that, of the ten 90mm lenses for which I was able to find a spec for flange focal length, the plain-old Angulon was the shortest. This means that all should be able to focus at infinity, with close focus will be limited by the remaining helical travel from there. I don't know what the total travel is, I don't recall if Ben and Justin ever published a spec for that. Here's my list:

Angulon f/6.8 89.8mm (in Copal 0, different in Copal 00)
Fujunon-SWDS f/5.6 102.5mm
Fujinon-SW f/8 99.2mm
Grandagon-N f/4.5 98.0mm
Grandagon-N f/6.8 94.0mm
Nikkor-SW f/4.5 97.4mm
Nikkor-SW f/8 97.0mm
Super-Angulon f/5.6 102.7mm
Super-Angulon f/8 98.8mm
Super-Angulon-XL f/5.6 103.5mm
Osaka f/6.3 ??
Wollensak WA Raptar f/12.5 ??

There are slight differences in the Schneider lenses depending on whether they're in Copal, Compur, or Prontor shutters, I've quote the Copal.

[Brian Bullen]

Thanks Steve for the detailed answer! Ben Syverson's first post states the helical travel as 20mm so if a Fuji SW f8 is used then basically there is only 10mm of travel left. That doesn't sound like much left over for close focusing. Of course stopping down to f32 or beyond will help bring in hyper focal , but for handheld that might limit ease of use.

[Steve Goldstein]

10mm of travel with a 90mm lens will allow you to focus at roughly 900mm, a shade under 3 feet. This may not prove to be much of a limitation in real life.

The f/6.8 Angulon will have 20mm of travel available, giving a closest focus of about 495mm. This is entering macro land at close to 1:5, so you might open up half a stop with transparency film.

[Dan Fromm]

Thanks Steve for the detailed answer! Ben Syverson's first post states the helical travel as 20mm so if a Fuji SW f8 is used then basically there is only 10mm of travel left. That doesn't sound like much left over for close focusing. Of course stopping down to f32 or beyond will help bring in hyper focal , but for handheld that might limit ease of use.

Sorry to be such an idiot, but I can't for the life of me see how you can put a point and shoot's plane of best focus where you want it when working close up.

[Ben Syverson]

Sorry to be such an idiot, but I can't for the life of me see how you can put a point and shoot's plane of best focus where you want it when working close up.
Perfectly valid question! My method involves a little one-time prep:


Put the camera on a tripod with an accessory rangefinder mounted about 1 meter away from a computer screen.
Set the rangefinder to 1 meter, and move the camera back and forth until the text on the screen lines up perfectly in the rangefinder patch.
Look through the lens using the ground glass, and focus the helical until the text on the screen is sharp.
Make a small mark on the front of the camera with a white china marker


The reason for this setup is that you can't 100% trust the distance markings on the rangefinder at the close end of its range.

When you're ready to shoot:

Set the rangefinder to 1m
Set the lens to your new mark
Look through the RF and lean back and forth until the subject is focus.


I don't actually use a viewfinder at all—the RF shows the center of the frame, which is enough. If I'm shooting a portrait, I'll line up the RF on the eyes, and then tilt down just before taking the shot (to reduce headroom). If you put the patch on the horizon you'll minimize keystoning on buildings (or produce a 50/50 landscape).

I've tried another close focus trick borrowed from the cold war and Minox document photography—attach an arms-length piece of string to the camera, put the subject at the end of the string, and mark the focus. It works best for inanimate detail shots, since stretching a piece of string out to someone's face is rather off-putting. :)

[Brian Bullen]

Steve, thanks again, the helical travel math part of this is not something I'm familiar with. Is it just travel x fl= distance?

Dan, you're not an idiot. When I say close focus, I mean 2-5ft range and with a range finder, stopping down some and a 90mm on 4x5 this is totally realistic. It may not be razor sharp but the results would be more than adequate. If I wanted to ensure "perfect" focus I'd bring a tripod and probably a camera with movements.

[sperdynamite]

At 3 feet a 90 at f8 should give you half a foot DoF, and a whole foot at 16. Should be a pretty reasonable margin for error. However if I knew I was gonna work at minimum focus distance I'd probably use the ground glass. Even if the stock one only shows the center, I would think that nailing focus there and using the sport finder for overall composition will get you there... I'm sure Ben has done A LOT more with the camera though so default to his advice for sure. Half a foot wide open, 1 foot 1 stop down. :-)

BTW, The FINDlab is about to start doing a dev/scan workflow like they do with 120 and 35mm film. I believe they're going to be able to run E6 and C41/B&W and they'll provide a scan from their Imacon 848. Indie Film Lab already does this but it's nice to see another player. FINDlab scans are good for prints up to about 16x20 from smaller formats, and that's from their Frontier SP3k, the 848 should be way better. Check them out!

[Steve Goldstein]

Steve, thanks again, the helical travel math part of this is not something I'm familiar with. Is it just travel x fl= distance?


It's a little more complicated than that, but not horrible. (1/f1) + (1/f2) = 1/f.

f is the lens' focal length. f1 is the distance from the lens to the film, f2 is the distance from the lens to the subject. For the example I used earlier, f = 90 and f1 = 100, giving f2 = 900 (millimeters).

The above is accurate for a simple thin lens where distances are measured from the center of the lens. For real lenses you need to measure from the nodal points, of which there are two, front and rear. Practically speaking, though, measuring from the center of the shutter, about where the iris is located, will probably be good enough. Don't forget to stop down.

[Kuzano]

Gosh.... Is there going to be a TWGroup Forum, somehow connected with Wanderlust, so that one does not have to print out all these 234 pages for the information bits included here?

Maybe someone can cast a TWG club pin, looking of course like a TravelWide? Then maybe a BOD could be set up, and politics could come into play?:cool:

OK, maybe just the TWG forum.... a subset or forum of LFPI here?

[Kevin Crisp]

I signed up for the email notifications, as I'd like to buy one when generally available. But they don't send out updates.

[Ben Syverson]

I signed up for the email notifications, as I'd like to buy one when generally available. But they don't send out updates.
There's nothing to say to the general public at the moment. Stay on the list, and we'll let people know the minute you can preorder again!

[Brian Bullen]

Steve, once again, thank you for providing this really useful information.
Cheers!

[Dan Fromm]

At 3 feet a 90 at f8 should give you half a foot DoF, and a whole foot at 16.

Did you use DofMaster? I ask because I just asked it about the setup and got your answers.

But and however they're insane. The CoC DofMaster uses for 4x5 is good for contact printing, will allow no enlargement. What's the point of shooting 4x5 if all you can do is print contacts?

[Oren Grad]

What's the point of shooting 4x5 if all you can do is print contacts?

Dan, I contact print my 4x5's; rarely, if ever, enlarge them at this point. A chacun son gout.

That said, I don't expect results from the TW in hand-held use at close range to be satisfactory for my taste, and maybe not in hand-held use at all. But an ultrasimple, ultralight 4x5 to perch on top of a tripod is also a useful tool for me. Again, and reiterating what should be obvious: there's no one best way.

[Tin Can]

I had to look that phrase up, my biggest HS regret is NOT taking French!

http://french.about.com/od/vocabulary/a/a-chacun-son-gout.htm

[Dan Fromm]

Oren, I first met the phrase "chacun a son goût." when I was a schoolboy learning (naturally) schoolboy French. Each has his own taste. Anglophones confuse the preposition "a" (means "to") with "a" the first person singular present of the verb avoir (means he/she/it has).

You're right, there's no disputing tastes.

[Steve Pitchford]

[QUOTE=Ben Syverson;1271246]One thing to note is that the Angulon ƒ/6.8 varied… a lot. It was manufactured over a very long time period. The "bad" ones should be good for contact prints and small enlargements. The "good" ones can stand up to 5x or 10x enlargement. Though they all have slightly weak corners wide open. The ƒ/8 and ƒ/6.8 symmetrical-ish designs are of course incredible across the field.

PS, we have a significant chunk of cameras assembled... We may ship these in smaller (250-500) batches just to clear room in the studio. It feels really great to look at a giant stack of cameras. At points, it felt like we'd never get a 4x5 camera without tilts and swings.

Ben,
Great news! Great progress.
Also, I have to agree with you on the choice of lens for the Travel Wide. The 90mm Angulon is light, compact, and will work with several different shutters. There were so many because the lens was a known workhorse. Uncoated lenses produced before WWII were not often precisely manufactured. Coated lenses came to market about 1960. The coated lenses can be better especially for color. A good discussion of the Angulon lenses exist on this site (LFP) posted byThalmann on 9, Oct 2010 These coated lenses have serial numbers in the 6,000,000 range made from about 1960 forward. Anyone interested can check the "Age of Lenses" chart at http://www.schneideroptics.com/info/age_of_lenses/, to check their own lens mfg. period. Just note that Schneider was not known for accurate record keeping. Some lenses were said to be better due to quality control inspections of production lenses for the best ones, which would then be sold to another company such as Linhof (Technika series). I have one of the Linholf lens, serial no. 5,291,xxx; had it in a drawer for 20 years and just took it out for the Travelwide investment adventure. It would barely fire, so I had it CLA'd by Joe at Tempe Camera - came out good as new. I also have the Illex Calumet Wide Field 90mm lens, which I love and use with my Wista. I have closely compared these two lens for coverage and sharpness. Using a Bogen tripod and cable release and equal f/stops, developed at the same time. To me the results appear to be equal, almost identical. The only difference I could tell was the Calumet WF 90 did pull up the foreground just a bit, but object definition and contrast were equal. I have a beautiful Wista and several lenses but I don't always have time, so for me the TravelWide is all about lite weight and speed, with the exception of when I'm using it as a Pinhole camera.
Keep up the great work.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[Corran]

Just as an anecdotal observation, I have two Angulons, one normal and one "Linhof Select." They both perform similarly.

[Drew Bedo]

The only French I know is that phrase from the mid '70s song by Patty Labell.

[Larry Kellogg]

The only French I know is that phrase from the mid '70s song by Patty Labell.

Ok, that will get your face slapped. C'est pas gentil.

[Ben Syverson]

I've always loved the phrase contre-jour. I love that literally, it means "against the day"—and that Pynchon used the literal translation as the title for his mind-boggling novel of science and anarchy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Against_the_Day).

In any case, it sure beats "backlit."

[Larry Kellogg]

I've always loved the phrase contre-jour. I love that literally, it means "against the day"—and that Pynchon used the literal translation as the title for his mind-boggling novel of science and anarchy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Against_the_Day).

In any case, it sure beats "backlit."

Ok, that Pynchon novel is up next, after I defeat Mason & Dixon. I'm 70% through. Ben, have you read Mason & Dixon?

I know an English teacher who abandoned Against the Day, so I know I have my work cut out for me. Please, no spoilers.

For easier reads, Inherent Vice is hilarious and relatively understandable, even if it never really makes sense. The film is terrific. The screenplay and novel are so close that it does not matter which you experience first. Bleeding Edge was a pretty good novel about the deep internet.

[sperdynamite]

Did you use DofMaster? I ask because I just asked it about the setup and got your answers.

But and however they're insane. The CoC DofMaster uses for 4x5 is good for contact printing, will allow no enlargement. What's the point of shooting 4x5 if all you can do is print contacts?

I did yes. I wasn't aware that was the case. Obviously, I'll try and nail the focus point as much as possible! Of course, I've never minded a tiny bit of softness overall.

[jb7]

I've always loved the phrase contre-jour. I love that literally, it means "against the day"

Me too. Always loved that phrase.

While I'm here, congratulations on your project having achieved the 'lumière du jour'

Well done. Never doubted you for a minute...

[Kuzano]

Me too. Always loved that phrase.

While I'm here, congratulations on your project having achieved the 'lumière du jour'

Well done. Never doubted you for a minute...

Soup of the day????:(

[Tin Can]

Soup of the day????:(

Light of day,

[Kuzano]

Ah!

[Tin Can]

Badly underexposed M2 flashbulb bar scene, shot tonight with the rig I posted.

My good friends, Turbo and company. The other guy is a professional Alaskan Firefighter who has been working the West Coast fires. He will be home in 2 hours and then back to fight.

God Bless them all.

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[Tin Can]

Also went to Central Camera with Travelwide. Several other people had already showed them the cameras. A father daughter team with 2 hanging on their necks!

[Corran]

Nice ones Randy. You get the prize?

[Tin Can]

Nice ones Randy. You get the prize?

First time I shot was today. 8 handheld without GG using the supplied sports finder.

I need to get way closer to everything. I don't shoot 90's on 4x5.

Just seeing what I can do handheld.

The flashbulb shot was spur of the moment as they had 4 minutes and gone to Alaska. Good thing I actually believed they were running out the door...

[Roger Cole]

I had to look that phrase up, my biggest HS regret is NOT taking French!

http://french.about.com/od/vocabulary/a/a-chacun-son-gout.htm

I took French in high school and I still didn't understand it!

Granted, that was pre-Norman invasion and it's been a while... ;)

[sperdynamite]

So jealous! Man I can't wait for mine. I was hoping I would be the first to strobe the thing haha. :-)

[Tin Can]

So jealous! Man I can't wait for mine. I was hoping I would be the first to strobe the thing haha. :-)

That's one M2 flashbulb (http://camera-wiki.org/wiki/Flashbulbs) not a strobe. :)

[diversey]

Nice shots! I did not follow the post. Did you make those shots with your new 4x5 P$S?


Badly underexposed M2 flashbulb bar scene, shot tonight with the rig I posted.

My good friends, Turbo and company. The other guy is a professional Alaskan Firefighter who has been working the West Coast fires. He will be home in 2 hours and then back to fight.

God Bless them all.

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[Tin Can]

Nice shots! I did not follow the post. Did you make those shots with your new 4x5 P$S?

Yes, David shot with this Heiland Foto-Mite (https://books.google.com/books?id=yl0zAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA18&lpg=PA18&dq=Heiland+Foto-Mite&source=bl&ots=BfOT9kLeCz&sig=QMxZU1tvOo3nwAsdIZ7uuz5dUKc&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFUQ6AEwDmoVChMIuL26xNPWxwIVgkg-Ch2jJgZ_#v=onepage&q=Heiland%20Foto-Mite&f=false) flashbulb holder, M2 bulb and Travelwide camera. http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?86921-Wanderlust-4x5-P-amp-S&p=1270585&viewfull=1#post1270585

I was at least 2 stops slow. GN 320 shot at 1/25th X sync f32 at 5 feet. I need to open up to f16. More testing!

[diversey]

Very nice, indeed! Thanks.


Yes, David shot with this Heiland Foto-Mite (https://books.google.com/books?id=yl0zAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA18&lpg=PA18&dq=Heiland+Foto-Mite&source=bl&ots=BfOT9kLeCz&sig=QMxZU1tvOo3nwAsdIZ7uuz5dUKc&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFUQ6AEwDmoVChMIuL26xNPWxwIVgkg-Ch2jJgZ_#v=onepage&q=Heiland%20Foto-Mite&f=false) flashbulb holder, M2 bulb and Travelwide camera. http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?86921-Wanderlust-4x5-P-amp-S&p=1270585&viewfull=1#post1270585

I was at least 2 stops slow. GN 320 shot at 1/25th X sync f32 at 5 feet. I need to open up to f16. More testing!

[Ben Syverson]

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So. Cool.

Randy, what was your approach to focusing? At ƒ/32 you could probably zone focus, right?

[Tin Can]

So. Cool.

Randy, what was your approach to focusing? At ƒ/32 you could probably zone focus, right?

Hi Ben,

I installed my 90mm Raptor hand tight, no tools. Mounted camera on tripod outside, looked for infinity focus on GG center which I found hard to do with my naked eye. So I grabbed a thread counter loupe, focused on a distant high voltage wire center of GG. Then, it took me a few moments to realize the genius of your rubber focus grip, which is easily removed and replaced on the 'splines' to make the notch align with infinity mark.

Then I did the same thing inside at 5 and 25 ft on a brightly lit USAF focus chart. And marked the actual helical positions.

So yes, I now have 3 known zones of fine focus. Then we come into hyper-focal estimations which aren't that big of deal. Setting the helical at 10 ft, gave me good focus from 5ft to infinity.

This shot was done that way, handheld on a slightly swaying bridge, notice the wood handrail 4 ft away bottom right. # No sharpening done. 1/100th @ f32 HP5. #2 PS Blur sharpen which looks terrible at 100% PS view but works at small magnification.

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[Pali K]

Randy those are so cool! Thanks for sharing your process on focusing too. You are making this camera shine for all its intended purposes.

May need to get one myself when I can get my hands on it!

Pali

[Tin Can]

I know this must be annoying to those who do not yet have their camera, but at least 16 people in Chicago also have this camera, so I will carry on.

Minimized my outfit by using an AGFA BC flashbulb holder. Because of it's battery box it sits beside sports finder.

Changed lens to 90mm f6.8 Calter II-S and sighted in more carefully, at 3, 5 feet and infinity and marked locations with white gaff.

I shot these 2 handheld, the tripod was for sighting in.

HP5 scanned as color neg, the muted colors are close to actual and not manipulated by me. No sharpening, no adjustments, no spotting, as scanned. Shot at estimated 3 feet across bar, Blue color M3B flashbulb, @ f16, 1/8th second, X sync.

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[Corran]

Cool.

Doesn't bother me, but I'm chomping at the bit to get this camera!

I can't wait to try out something I think will work - my 58mm XL. The 65mm f/8 that's supposed to work with it as a fixed-focus lens has a 70.5mm FFD. The 58XL is 70mm. Since it's so close I feel like it should work reasonably well, perhaps with a slight spacer or something. I'm hoping I can shoot two TW, one with 58XL, the other with my Nikkor 90mm, and be set for some of the arduous canoeing/hiking I have been doing.

[Oren Grad]

Doesn't bother me, but I'm chomping at the bit to get this camera!

+1

Eagerly awaiting mine, but in the meantime I'm happy to read progress reports from the lucky pioneers. Please do carry on!

[Tin Can]

I forgot last nights Drama. Right after this the pouty girl left and the man's new iPod was gone.

He worried and ranted a bit. He is the doorman, he should be more aware.

Then he called his phone, she answered and brought it right back at 1:30 am!

[Winger]

+1

Eagerly awaiting mine, but in the meantime I'm happy to read progress reports from the lucky pioneers. Please do carry on!

Same here! And I have to do some cleaning and searching in order to find my lens. I got it while we were in IA and we've moved back to PA. Things are just a little chaotic still and I haven't found the lens, yet. Figures.

[plywood]

I know this must be annoying to those who do not yet have their camera, but at least 16 people in Chicago also have this camera, so I will carry on.

Minimized my outfit by using an AGFA BC flashbulb holder. Because of it's battery box it sits beside sports finder.

Changed lens to 90mm f6.8 Calter II-S and sighted in more carefully, at 3, 5 feet and infinity and marked locations with white gaff.

I shot these 2 handheld, the tripod was for sighting in.

HP5 scanned as color neg, the muted colors are close to actual and not manipulated by me. No sharpening, no adjustments, no spotting, as scanned. Shot at estimated 3 feet across bar, Blue color M3B flashbulb, @ f16, 1/8th second, X sync.

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Don't feel bad Randy, I'm just happy your sharing your experience. The rest of us folks are in the same boat and it will be all the sweeter when it arrives. I've made a pest of myself asking Ben for a shipping date and had to apologize to him in the main comments section of their Kickstarter page. Of course I'll still be a pest, that is my nature. It does not matter, Ben usually ignores me anyway.

[AuditorOne]

You need to find a Grafmatic Randy and then you can really shoot pictures.

Great info, keep em coming.

[Roger Thoms]

Randy, thanks for posting, your results look great.

Roger

[Tin Can]

You need to find a Grafmatic Randy and then you can really shoot pictures.

Great info, keep em coming.

I have Grafmatics, but won't use them with this camera.

I go out with one holder in camera and one in my back pocket. 4 shots, perfect for my tiny tanks and hangers.

[bobwysiwyg]

Just started following this thread. Question, will the Wanderlust be marketed generally once the kickstarters are taken care of?

[plywood]

Just started following this thread. Question, will the Wanderlust be marketed generally once the kickstarters are taken care of?
I think that is their intention. I once asked Ben the minimum number of cameras that had to be run to make a second batch economically viable. He said 500. My guess is that they, Ben and Justin would have to gather 500 pre-paid orders before they would commit to a second run. Doubt very much they would have the liquidity to run a second batch and then hope they sell so as to recover their investment. This makes me think all future sales would have to be pre-paid. They have already spent multi-thousands of dollars out of pocket thus far to bring this campaign to where it is. My guess is they face at least another $20K (or more) expense to get them shipped to backers.

[bobwysiwyg]

Thanks, makes sense both business-wise and in general. I'll check their website to see how one might pre-order if possible.

[bobwysiwyg]

Darn! Wish I had followed this sooner, would love to have one. Checked the Travelwide site and no mention of pre-ordering, at least not yet. Took their suggestion and signed up for the news letter. I sure hope there is a second run. :(

P.S. Should anyone getting one out the first batch would like to sell it, for whatever reason, let me know.

[Winger]

I found my Angulon, yay! And along the way I also came across this lens that I rescued from somewhere. It only works with a cable release and doesn't need to be cocked. It's a 105mm, but is there a chance it might be made to work on the Travelwide? If not, anyone have ideas where else it might work? I know only what it has on it for info.

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[Old-N-Feeble]

I don't think the 105mm Tominon covers 4x5 at infinity. Sorry... :(

[HMG]

I found my Angulon, yay! And along the way I also came across this lens that I rescued from somewhere. It only works with a cable release and doesn't need to be cocked. It's a 105mm, but is there a chance it might be made to work on the Travelwide? If not, anyone have ideas where else it might work? I know only what it has on it for info.

139277

From an old Polaroid MP3 or MP4 copy camera. You've probably seen those. Info on them if you google around but the 2 big issues are coverage (as noted) and also that they were designed for "flat field".

[Dan Fromm]

Bethe, O-n-F is right. The thing is a tessar type optimized for shooting above 1:1. Even if it were a garden variety f/4.5 tessar type, it still wouldn't cover 4x5. I like me tessars but they has their limits.

[Ben Syverson]

I think that is their intention. I once asked Ben the minimum number of cameras that had to be run to make a second batch economically viable. He said 500. My guess is that they, Ben and Justin would have to gather 500 pre-paid orders before they would commit to a second run. Doubt very much they would have the liquidity to run a second batch and then hope they sell so as to recover their investment. This makes me think all future sales would have to be pre-paid. They have already spent multi-thousands of dollars out of pocket thus far to bring this campaign to where it is. My guess is they face at least another $20K (or more) expense to get them shipped to backers.
I re-ran the numbers recently, and we could actually do 250 at a time. We wouldn't need to pre-sell all 250, since (although it may not seem like it now) we do have some profit margin built in. We have about 6000 people on our mailing list, and get multiple daily requests to purchase a camera, so I think we could finance another run in probably a day or two. But I want to wait to ship this first batch first, so we know how to calculate shipping costs for future runs.

Once we do the first run of 250, it will help to finance the parts for another run. So that should be the last preorder needed to bootstrap us into monthly production. Looking forward to it!

[Brian Puccio]

I re-ran the numbers recently, and we could actually do 250 at a time. We wouldn't need to pre-sell all 250, since (although it may not seem like it now) we do have some profit margin built in. We have about 6000 people on our mailing list, and get multiple daily requests to purchase a camera, so I think we could finance another run in probably a day or two. But I want to wait to ship this first batch first, so we know how to calculate shipping costs for future runs.

Once we do the first run of 250, it will help to finance the parts for another run. So that should be the last preorder needed to bootstrap us into monthly production. Looking forward to it!

That's fantastic! I'm glad this is coming together for you guys. I hope the stress levels are starting to go down. :)

[letchhausen]

That's great news! I was worried that the pain and angst of this process (not to mention the whining) might have scared you guys off from continuing. Glad to hear that the future is now. I like Randy Moe reminding us that you don't need a ton of film or holders. One of the things I've always liked about shooting 4x5 is that I don't take a ton of shots and can keep up with my photographic production. With the TW I can get a few shots off in places or times when I normally wouldn't be able to.

[Winger]

I don't think the 105mm Tominon covers 4x5 at infinity. Sorry... :(

Bethe, O-n-F is right. The thing is a tessar type optimized for shooting above 1:1. Even if it were a garden variety f/4.5 tessar type, it still wouldn't cover 4x5. I like me tessars but they has their limits.

Oh well. And I was wondering that as well. I know exactly what this lens was going to be used for, though it never was. It came with a Polaroid holder for pack film, so I'll guess that it would cover the area of FP100C equivalent. I scored both as they were gathering dust because the lab went digital. Since it was going to be used to photograph gel electrophoresis plates, it wouldn't have been in use for long anyway 'cause they stopped doing those, too.

So, I wonder what else I can do with it...

[Winger]

I re-ran the numbers recently, and we could actually do 250 at a time. We wouldn't need to pre-sell all 250, since (although it may not seem like it now) we do have some profit margin built in. We have about 6000 people on our mailing list, and get multiple daily requests to purchase a camera, so I think we could finance another run in probably a day or two. But I want to wait to ship this first batch first, so we know how to calculate shipping costs for future runs.

Once we do the first run of 250, it will help to finance the parts for another run. So that should be the last preorder needed to bootstrap us into monthly production. Looking forward to it!

That's pretty cool!

[plywood]

That's fantastic news Ben. Considering all the whining I've been doing about when you are going to ship it is good news you might break even on this whole venture or eventually make a buck or two. At least a few of us in the wilderness are enjoying Randy (Weegee) Mo's first results.

[Steve Pitchford]

Ben,

Many hands make lite work. Hire some. Oh, before you do the second run take a vacation, let the wind blow thru your hair.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[bobwysiwyg]

I re-ran the numbers recently, and we could actually do 250 at a time. We wouldn't need to pre-sell all 250, since (although it may not seem like it now) we do have some profit margin built in. We have about 6000 people on our mailing list, and get multiple daily requests to purchase a camera, so I think we could finance another run in probably a day or two. But I want to wait to ship this first batch first, so we know how to calculate shipping costs for future runs.

Once we do the first run of 250, it will help to finance the parts for another run. So that should be the last preorder needed to bootstrap us into monthly production. Looking forward to it!

Very glad to hear this!!

[Dan Fromm]

So, I wonder what else I can do with it...

Another example of the corrupting power of found money, sorry, lenses. More seriously, if you ever shoot macro (magnification > 1:1) you have a lens that will do it.

FWIW, years ago I tested all of the MP-4 Tominons except the 105. The longer ones (50, 75, 135) were worse than inexpensive alternatives so I'm not hopeful that the MP-4 105 will be very good. The 17 and 35 were worse than expensive alternatives, were very usable and cost-effective.

To add to the confusion, I've seen reports that the gelcam 75/4.5 is good at all distances on 2x3. I doubt this but it is possible. There's certainly no guarantee that gelcam Tominons are identical to MP-4 Tominons of the same focal length and I'm very happy with my gelcam 127/4.7 (no MP-4 equivalent).

[europanorama]

Oh well. And I was wondering that as well. I know exactly what this lens was going to be used for, though it never was. It came with a Polaroid holder for pack film, so I'll guess that it would cover the area of FP100C equivalent. I scored both as they were gathering dust because the lab went digital. Since it was going to be used to photograph gel electrophoresis plates, it wouldn't have been in use for long anyway 'cause they stopped doing those, too.

So, I wonder what else I can do with it...
electrophoresis plates
it could be that the russian filmproducer i have found could deliver such plates. must dig it out saw it recently.
maybe slavich-a different one-is still producing films.

[Dan Fromm]

electrophoresis plates

Still in use, readily available.

[plywood]

Ben, have you found a shipping solution yet?

[Tin Can]

I want to clear up the focus issue I showed here with my first usage of the 90mm f6.8 Raptor.

I remounted it on my Travelwide and more carefully sighted in 3, 5 ft and infinity.

Then I complicated test by using AG1B tiny flashbulbs in Tilt-a-Mite. My 3rd iteration of flash bulb holder, smallest yet.

First, focus IS way better.

Second, flash sync is off with this Raptor., still getting way underexposed flash pics. I found this with thin negs, and when I used the same AG1 type bulb in the Tilt-A-Mite with a 240mm Calter II-S at f16, same speed and fstop as Raptor I got a medium density neg.

Lessons learned, the Raptor is a good lens, shutter has issues with flash. AG1 bulbs are powerful and work well with a cooperative shutter.

First pic is Raptor heavily corrected, but focus is great.

Second is Calter. Pic demonstrates good exposure and sharp focus @f16

All complicated by being zone focus selfies.

139382139383

[csxcnj]

I re-ran the numbers recently, and we could actually do 250 at a time. We wouldn't need to pre-sell all 250, since (although it may not seem like it now) we do have some profit margin built in. We have about 6000 people on our mailing list, and get multiple daily requests to purchase a camera, so I think we could finance another run in probably a day or two. But I want to wait to ship this first batch first, so we know how to calculate shipping costs for future runs.

Once we do the first run of 250, it will help to finance the parts for another run. So that should be the last preorder needed to bootstrap us into monthly production. Looking forward to it!

Ready and waiting.

[Drew Bedo]

This is a new piece of equipment. Every one will be a sort of beta-tester during this first year of use.

I am sure that there will be a learning curve for the Travelwide. there will be a best-sharpness set up. there will be a most cost-effective set up. There will be a lightest-weight and best landscape or Portrait or macro way of working.

[rfesk]

Maybe Really Right Stuff will make a special adapter for it!

[Drew Bedo]

Sure; someone will.

there will be third party accessories to meet various needs. I'll be looking in the DIY section for mods, adaptors and add-on buts.

Whenever I can get ahold of a TravelWide body, I will try to do some extreme telephoto work with a spotting scope. That will need a Brcket to hold the camera nody and scope in alignement and a tube to exclude light. Cardboard and Gaffers tape will work, but . . .something purpose built would make me feel better.

[HMG]

I think it's time for a new thread; something like Using the Travelwide. Since I don't have mine yet, and have nothing to show, it's presumptuous of me to start it. How about you Randy?

[Oren Grad]

I think it's time for a new thread; something like Using the Travelwide. Since I don't have mine yet, and have nothing to show, it's presumptuous of me to start it. How about you Randy?

Yes, if Randy or any other early user is so inclined, we're at the point where it would make sense to launch either or both of a Travelwide image thread and a Travelwide tools-and-techniques thread, in the appropriate sections.

[Tin Can]

Yes, if Randy or any other early user is so inclined, we're at the point where it would make sense to launch either or both of a Travelwide image thread and a Travelwide tools-and-techniques thread, in the appropriate sections.

I will try to hold off. 2 new threads are a good idea.

Name them properly and Mods will put them in the right place.

I suggest "Wanderlust 4X5 Images" for one and "Wanderlust 4X5 Tips, Setup & Usage" for the other. Maybe a "Show Off Your Travelwide".

We could make them now, but the threads may be lost before the rest of the users get here!

Where are the other early adopters? At least 16 cameras were picked up over 2 weeks ago. Lurkers!

[Drew Bedo]

While waiting on the TravelWide, check out this discontinued item:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/301618028419?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2648&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

The seller said that he once had three bodies; kept a shooter and sold a shooter . . .now is trying to get a GRAND for the first production body, S/N 001.

[Corran]

Does anyone remember the guy who was trying to sell a whole bunch of Globuscope cameras on these forums? This was a few years ago. They were some lot of forgotten bodies found in a warehouse or something.

[cdholden]

His name is Grant Kernan and I think I got the last 2 of the bunch. I had 3 at one time and later sold 2 of them but kept S/N # 003.

[Ben Syverson]

The Globuscope was a sweet looking camera, and eerily similar to the Travelwide. Amazingly, despite the resemblance, we had never seen one when we designed the Travelwide! Some of the coincidences are pretty crazy— the radius on the walls of the 4x5 back is a very similar detail. Ultimately, I think the design process led us to a similar shape simply because it's the most compact rational shape for what it's trying to achieve.

Unfortunately, a lot of these Globuscope bodies went out without focusing helicals, which is the most challenging and critical component.

[Drew Bedo]

And in Stailless Steel no less. Stout for sure, but weight? And at half the asking for a non-collectable "shooter" it would still be too high for me. I'll just wait in line for my turn at a TravelWide.

[EdSawyer]

I expect that seller is Grant (the seller of the ebay globuscope). Nice cameras, but at that price (or even half that), just get a Cambo Wide and have way more functionality, probably similar weight, not much bigger size (if at all), etc.

[Jim Cole]

Ben, have you found a shipping solution yet?

I guess not.

[B.S.Kumar]

I expect that seller is Grant (the seller of the ebay globuscope).

Don't think so. Grant lives in Canada, and the eBay seller is in Phoenix, AZ.

Kumar

[EdSawyer]

ah, perhaps so then.

[Ben Syverson]

Hi everybody,

I'm finishing up the instruction sheet for the Travelwide 90 (http://wanderlustcameras.com/downloads/travelwide/travelwide90-instructions.pdf), and I'd love to get your feedback. I'm trying to fit quite a bit on one 8.5x11" sheet. Am I missing anything major?

You can click on the image to get the PDF.

http://wanderlustcameras.com/images/2015/travelwide90-instructions.jpg (http://wanderlustcameras.com/downloads/travelwide/travelwide90-instructions.pdf)

[Tim Meisburger]

Looks clear to me. Its amazing you could even include information on how to load holders.

[Jac@stafford.net]

I have read this entire thread and frankly I see no merit whatsoever in the project.
So it is said, and I ignore.
.

[Nigel Smith]

I'd probably go to 2 pages so I could make the font size a bit bigger.

Do you want suggestions on typos/errors/content?

[Tin Can]

Since I had no instructions and didn't actually need them, it did take me a while to realize how easy step 31 actually is, IF you do precisely what you instruct. Self taught again...

Pretty slick design that is not obvious how well it was done.

Step 31 a milestone in camera design.

Not kidding!

[rdenney]

I have read this entire thread and frankly I see no merit whatsoever in the project.
So it is said, and I ignore.
.

This needed to be said?

Rick "sheesh" Denney

[Steve Pitchford]

Hi everybody,

I'm finishing up the instruction sheet for the Travelwide 90 (http://wanderlustcameras.com/downloads/travelwide/travelwide90-instructions.pdf), and I'd love to get your feedback. I'm trying to fit quite a bit on one 8.5x11" sheet. Am I missing anything major?

You can click on the image to get the PDF.

http://wanderlustcameras.com/images/2015/travelwide90-instructions.jpg (http://wanderlustcameras.com/downloads/travelwide/travelwide90-instructions.pdf)

Hi Ben,

The drawings look great and seem very descriptive. The words are another issue. The font desperately needs changing to a more legible style. Even with my computer view clicked up several times it was still not legible. In fact it was worse. That's my critique and I don't want to sound nasty. I was once a graphic designer and learned how valuable it is to select a good font style, out of the several thousand type style that exist, for the need at hand. You can do better, thousand of yet to be taken photographs may depend on it. Ha ha.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[Ben Syverson]

I have read this entire thread and frankly I see no merit whatsoever in the project.
So it is said, and I ignore.
.
You really have to love someone who reads 242 pages of commentary on a project and THEN decides it's not worth his time. :)

[Roger Thoms]

Did you click on the image to bring up the PDF? The PDF is very legible even on my IPhone and IPad.

Roger


Hi Ben,

The drawings look great and seem very descriptive. The words are another issue. The font desperately needs changing to a more legible style. Even with my computer view clicked up several times it was still not legible. In fact it was worse. That's my critique and I don't want to sound nasty. I was once a graphic designer and learned how valuable it is to select a good font style, out of the several thousand type style that exist, for the need at hand. You can do better, thousand of yet to be taken photographs may depend on it. Ha ha.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[Ben Syverson]

Hi Ben,

The drawings look great and seem very descriptive. The words are another issue. The font desperately needs changing to a more legible style [snip]
Steve,

Oh no! Did you click the image to open the PDF? I tried to make everything as legible as possible, given the 6pt type size. See below. Honestly, I'm going to post how-to videos that will make all the steps much more clear. I hope people go to the website if they can't read the type!

http://wanderlustcameras.com/images/2015/travelwide90-type.jpg

[Tin Can]

Did you click on the image to bring up the PDF? The PDF is very legible even on my IPhone and IPad.

Roger

Agreed! I can easily read it and I usually have trouble.

[Tin Can]

Steve,

Oh no! Did you click the image to open the PDF? I tried to make everything as legible as possible, given the 6pt type size. See below. Honestly, I'm going to post how-to videos that will make all the steps much more clear. I hope people go to the website if they can't read the type!

http://wanderlustcameras.com/images/2015/travelwide90-type.jpg

And loading film holders into the camera like that works great.

I was prying up the springs with my clumsy fingers and wondering...

[plywood]

No trouble reading the PDF on my pad although the use of the removable rubber collar with the focusing bracket was self evident when first presented in update 7 over two years ago. All in all I think it will be sufficient for even the novice using 4X5 for the first time. Wouldn't it be cheaper not to print these up to put in each box? Since they are in PDF already I'm sure most backers can just print them out at any time, right?

[plywood]

Anyway Ben, you know what we are really waiting for.......
That KS update no. 34 'in the next few days' with the low down about when and how shipping will begin.

[Roger Cole]

You really have to love someone who reads 242 pages of commentary on a project and THEN decides it's not worth his time. :)

If you believe that he did that. It's too dark under that bridge to read that much. ;)

I love the idea and am really looking forward to mine. :)

[Larry Kellogg]

I have read all of the commentary and feel that this project has great merit. There, I said it.

I think the instruction sheet is wonderful, and well thought out. I didn't have trouble reading it once I downloaded the PDF. I'll go back through it more carefully to see if I have any specific suggestions.

This is like the old Kodak data sheets that came with each roll of film which were basically a Photo I course on one sheet of paper. Unfortunately, they did away with them.

You could fill up the back side with a zone system tutorial and some ways of developing the film. :-)

[BarryS]

The instruction sheet is nicely done. I find it very readable, and the layout and illustrations are excellent. As someone that does a lot of writing for my job--I appreciate it when information is presented clearly and concisely.

[Larry Kellogg]

Oh, what about explaining how to set the close focusing point for the 65mm and when to use the shims? I just saw that you said the instructions are available on the website.

[AuditorOne]

I printed the instruction sheet and had no problem reading it. Very well done.

I would suggest putting the instructions for the 65 helical on the opposite side.

[Kuzano]

TO: Jack@stafford.net

I have read this entire thread and frankly I see no merit whatsoever in the project.
So it is said, and I ignore.
.


That's OK. We appreciate your opting out of the program. Somebody already bought yours and others were lined up to do so.

There may be a fairly full queue already for the next 250, so we are not missing your participation, in the least.

[rdenney]

Ben, it's fine once printed, and the PDF is easy to read on both iPhone and iPad.

I have never followed the edict to never change shutter speeds when cocked. Changing the speed while unwound is actually forbidden on a few classic cameras (not LF). My shutters seem to have survived these decades, so I'm open to learning something really new, or alternatively at least wondering if that edict needs to be emphasized with boldface.

Rick "who nearly broke a vintage Leica once by doing that" Denney

[Tin Can]

Ben, it's fine once printed, and the PDF is easy to read on both iPhone and iPad.

I have never followed the edict to never change shutter speeds when cocked. Changing the speed while unwound is actually forbidden on a few classic cameras (not LF). My shutters seem to have survived these decades, so I'm open to learning something really new, or alternatively at least wondering if that edict needs to be emphasized with boldface.

Rick "who nearly broke a vintage Leica once by doing that" Denney

My first rule is, never touch a Leica, I never want to break one!

[Brian Puccio]

Instructions look great! I've seen camera instructions from multi-billion dollar companies that are less clear.

Also, nice snag on that new domain!

[bobwysiwyg]

The instructions look very good even on my Kindle Fire which is where I would reference them when I snag a camera from the second batch.. I hope, I hope.:rolleyes:

[Steve Pitchford]

Hi Ben,

You are right the PDF looks great. My adobe reader had upgraded it's self and was waiting for a browser restart and wouldn't take any action commands. I apologize for my unwarranted criticism. On another note; if you needed to make more information (than fits on an 8x10 sheet) of a specific type available users could be referred to your website. And of course we'll be blogging about it here on the LFP, the best resource of all.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[HMG]

I too think the instructions are great. Only caveat is that until we have the camera in hand, it's difficult to know for sure. One comment I'd make is that the section on loading film holders is nice, but not absolutely necessary (since it's not camera specific). So if you need more space on the page for other sections, you might consider leaving that section out.

[Ben Syverson]

I too think the instructions are great. Only caveat is that until we have the camera in hand, it's difficult to know for sure. One comment I'd make is that the section on loading film holders is nice, but not absolutely necessary (since it's not camera specific). So if you need more space on the page for other sections, you might consider leaving that section out.
Thanks! That's probably true about the film holder section, but it seems like the majority of our first backers & customers are first-time 4x5 shooters—so I wanted to give them a quick overview. I might rework the whole instruction sheet when we move past this first shipment. It would be nice to have a little booklet!

[HMG]

... it seems like the majority of our first backers & customers are first-time 4x5 shooters—so I wanted to give them a quick overview.

That surprises - and pleases - me.

[Steve Pitchford]

Thanks! That's probably true about the film holder section, but it seems like the majority of our first backers & customers are first-time 4x5 shooters—so I wanted to give them a quick overview. I might rework the whole instruction sheet when we move past this first shipment. It would be nice to have a little booklet!

Ben,

A pocket size booklet of field camera use would be great. The hard part (the way of the TAO) would be in selecting what topics would or would not be included. There's so much out there. The easy part would be that the members of the LFP site could write it for you. There would be many contributors and there is an abundance of historical and reference info on the site. The site members have always been generous with their knowledge, and of course want to support large format photography's unique genre.

Happy trails,
SteveP

[Drew Bedo]

I would think that the section on using the camera, aside from the specifics of managing the TravelWide itself, would be the basics of photography: Exposure, focus and DOF, etc. The use of movements won't be an issue of course.

There would be other sections dealing with film management: Loading and handling film holders, developing and so on.

[AuditorOne]

Kodak did the same in the early 20th century and the information they provided in their little booklet "How to Make Good Pictures" is still quite valuable information.

[plywood]

Kodak did the same in the early 20th century and the information they provided in their little booklet "How to Make Good Pictures" is still quite valuable information.

I have the 1953 edition of that book. Although the technology has changed the basic lessons are the same.

It would be nice to have the instructions plus other information (like a DOF chart) in a small pocket guide like the ones Kodak used to put out as "Kodak Master Photoguide", little booklets on heavy card stock about 3 by 4 inches in size.

I'm not talking about something for free and would expect it to be something we could order from Wanderlust Cameras for a reasonable price.

[Ben Syverson]

Yeah, I would love to do some Photo 101 in a booklet for the next run or the one after. When the time comes, I will tap this brain trust!

I just shot my first instant photo on the Travelwide… I picked up a Fuji PA-145 holder and some FP-3000B. It's a real shame this material is discontinued, because it's perfect for the Travelwide. You can actually do low light photography at ƒ/6.8! :) I'll post some examples in a day or two.

[David Aimone]

I've been on a two week tour of the southwest ending with Zion, and have been out of touch. We're <still> waiting for Travelwide shipping detail, SERIOUSLY????


Anyway Ben, you know what we are really waiting for.......
That KS update no. 34 'in the next few days' with the low down about when and how shipping will begin.

[plywood]

I've been on a two week tour of the southwest ending with Zion, and have been out of touch. We're <still> waiting for Travelwide shipping detail, SERIOUSLY????

I don't know if we're ALL waiting "seriously". Some of us are waiting "jokingly".

[letchhausen]

I just shot my first instant photo on the Travelwide… I picked up a Fuji PA-145 holder and some FP-3000B. It's a real shame this material is discontinued, because it's perfect for the Travelwide. You can actually do low light photography at ƒ/6.8! :) I'll post some examples in a day or two.

This is awesome. I guess that means the holder fits under the spring. That's cool cuz I have a ton of Polaroid 667 hanging around the house. I love that stuff. You're instruction pdf is excellent and I agree that a little rudimentary detail can't hurt because I'm sure that your kickstarter crowd exceeds the denizens of this place. Hopefully people with patience and grace as well.

[rdenney]

I don't know if we're ALL waiting "seriously". Some of us are waiting "jokingly".

Some of us are waiting eagerly, but cheerfully.

Rick "still waiting for the New55, too" Denney

[plywood]

I don't know if we're ALL waiting "seriously". Some of us are waiting "jokingly".

Seems like only a very few are still commenting on this thread. The same is true in the main comments section their KS site. The rest of the backers appear to be;
Bored
Have moved on. (Might mean their TW 90's will start to appear on e-bay later.)
Have a lot more patience than me. (Includes just about all of them.)
Have real lives and no time to obsess over such trivial matters.
Or.....for the fortunate few, have already picked up their cameras and are now too busy making pictures and having fun.

Ok, I'd planned to go purchase the plywood for a new project today so I'd better get busy.

[Kirk Gittings]

Seems like only a very few are still commenting on this thread. The same is true in the main comments section their KS site. The rest of the backers appear to be;
1)Bored
2)Have moved on. (Might mean their TW 90's will start to appear on e-bay later.)
3)Have a lot more patience than me. (Includes just about all of them.)
4)Have real lives and no time to obsess over such trivial matters.
5)Or.....for the fortunate few, have already picked up their cameras and are now too busy making pictures and having fun.

Ok, I'd planned to go purchase the plywood for a new project today so I'd better get busy.

I'm most like 4). I would rather have it late-even really late-but when it was done right. I'll be happy to have it. I always had full confidence that they would come thru eventually (I have friends who know them in Chicago). But for me it is just a cool toy that may or may not find a place in my starting line up of cameras. Hence whenever it showed up (as long as they had worked the bugs out) was fine by me.

[Corran]

I'm here, reading the thread, but I have no time in my life for idle whining that it's not here yet. It'll get here when it gets here, and for the time being, I have way too many cameras as it is. That said, I can certainly see myself using it in a lot of new situations, where size and convenience is paramount. Just this morning I was shooting some photos at a symphony orchestra concert and I would've loved to have the TW and one DDS holder loaded with some HP5 or Tri-X.

I can understand the frustration if one was just getting into LF with the TW.

[Roger Cole]

Seems like only a very few are still commenting on this thread. The same is true in the main comments section their KS site. The rest of the backers appear to be;
Bored
Have moved on. (Might mean their TW 90's will start to appear on e-bay later.)
Have a lot more patience than me. (Includes just about all of them.)
Have real lives and no time to obsess over such trivial matters.
Or.....for the fortunate few, have already picked up their cameras and are now too busy making pictures and having fun.

Ok, I'd planned to go purchase the plywood for a new project today so I'd better get busy.


I'm most like 4). I would rather have it late-even really late-but when it was done right. I'll be happy to have it. I always had full confidence that they would come thru eventually (I have friends who know them in Chicago). But for me it is just a cool toy that may or may not find a place in my starting line up of cameras. Hence whenever it showed up (as long as they had worked the bugs out) was fine by me.

This.

I'm really:

5. Have plenty of other cameras to use and things to do, will be glad to add this one when I get it but not in any real hurry.

[plywood]

"...idle whining..."?
How about 'purposeful whining'? Although I cannot identify to what purpose my whining is exactly. However sometimes it has gotten a response from Ben, letting us all know he had not given up and checked himself into a local mental health facility after all the trouble with completing this project. I really do feel for Ben and Justin and if visiting Chicago would certainly stand them to beers at some local watering hole.

[Corran]

That wasn't aimed at you specifically, just the general malaise expressed by some.

[plywood]

That wasn't aimed at you specifically, just the general malaise expressed by some.

Yeah, I here you, some comments have been somewhat more demanding than mine. Ben has said that they get emails directly (presumably on their Wanderlust site) that are quite irate. Coming from even non backers demanding to know when cameras will be available. Sheesh, the nerve of some folks.

[Ben Syverson]

When we get irate emails from potential customers, I cheer myself in the knowledge that they must really want the camera. It's hard to know how big the market for this type of camera is, but we're about to find out.

In other news: When I promised to post instant photos from the Travelwide, I didn't realize how much fun I'd have taking portraits at work! I don't feel right posting photos of coworkers, so I took a quick bathroom selfie (cue collective groan). We're moving next week, so I already feel nostalgic looking at this photo!

http://wanderlustcameras.com/images/2015/3000-01-05.jpg

[Tim Meisburger]

I just hope I get mine before the Myanmar elections in November. During the bi-elections in 2012 I took a shot of Aung San Suu Kyi handheld with my Ikeda Anba and guestimate focus and framing and ended up with about a fifth of her face in frame. If I get the TW I'll do better next time!

Ben, not sure if you read this, but I tried to change my shipping address on KS, but could not figure out how to do it. I did send you the $40 additional for international shipping and PMed and emailed my address about a month ago, but haven't heard back, so I'm not sure if the change is in the system yet.

[Tim Meisburger]

Hmm... While I was writing this you posted, so I guess you do read this!

[plywood]

Your moving next week! Wow, that's my favorite thing......right next a broken leg. My condolences.

[Oren Grad]

In other news: When I promised to post instant photos from the Travelwide, I didn't realize how much fun I'd have taking portraits at work! I don't feel right posting photos of coworkers, so I took a quick bathroom selfie (cue collective groan). We're moving next week, so I already feel nostalgic looking at this photo!

That Blik seems so perfectly matched...

[thereisnocat]

We're moving offices in two weeks, and I was really hoping to get my camera before then so I could take shots of the millions of Elmos on Times Square before we move to Greenwich Village, but it really doesn't look like either my Travelwide or my Intrepid will be here in time. Oh well... I'll get it when I get it.

[Tin Can]

I just hope I get mine before the Myanmar elections in November. During the bi-elections in 2012 I took a shot of Aung San Suu Kyi handheld with my Ikeda Anba and guestimate focus and framing and ended up with about a fifth of her face in frame. If I get the TW I'll do better next time!

Ben, not sure if you read this, but I tried to change my shipping address on KS, but could not figure out how to do it. I did send you the $40 additional for international shipping and PMed and emailed my address about a month ago, but haven't heard back, so I'm not sure if the change is in the system yet.

I find the included metal finder works very well for framing. I have tried some other finders, but prefer the included one.

[Tim Meisburger]

Yes, that should help a lot. But also shooting a 90 rather than a 135 will make it easier.

[Larry Kellogg]

We're moving offices in two weeks, and I was really hoping to get my camera before then so I could take shots of the millions of Elmos on Times Square before we move to Greenwich Village, but it really doesn't look like either my Travelwide or my Intrepid will be here in time. Oh well... I'll get it when I get it.

Congratulations on moving out of Times Square! The Village is great, I much prefer it to Times Square. So, I guess no New Yorkers have gotten a TravelWide. Soon, soon.

The Art Book Fair is at PS1 this weekend, I'll be checking it out.

[David Aimone]

No whining here. I do this for a living and I've been hoping to have a portable 4x5 for professional work and every project missed hurts a bit. Waiting on a KS that has moved and continues to move at a snails pace is frustrating, that's all. I'm glad it's a luxury that most here have no urgent use for.

[Tin Can]

No whining here. I do this for a living and I've been hoping to have a portable 4x5 for professional work and every project missed hurts a bit. Waiting on a KS that has moved and continues to move at a snails pace is frustrating, that's all. I'm glad it's a luxury that most here have no urgent use for.

If only Pros were here on this forum, it would be a ghost town.

[plywood]

If only Pros were here on this forum, it would be a ghost town.

Enthusiastic amateurs are what keep any photo company afloat. Some of those hobbiest photographers are very technically and even artistically proficient (not me) but enjoy photography too much to turn it into a mere job.

[David Aimone]

Not a mere job, but a passion that I finally was able to do full-time starting a year or two ago, and things have really taken off. Couldn't be happier, except would really like to use this camera for mobile 4x5 before I die.


Enthusiastic amateurs are what keep any photo company afloat. Some of those hobbiest photographers are very technically and even artistically proficient (not me) but enjoy photography too much to turn it into a mere job.

[Larry Kellogg]

If only Pros were here on this forum, it would be a ghost town.

Agreed. I think it has always been hard to survive on the income from photography. I believe Paul Strand was able to devote himself to photography because of an inheritance from his father.

[Corran]

There's also a big difference between a pro commercial photographer and one who makes a living off of "art" photography. The full-time commercial photographer who uses primarily film is a rare bird, and LF doubly so. If you are doing that David, kudos. You must live in a market that supports that.

[plywood]

Not a mere job, but a passion that I finally was able to do full-time starting a year or two ago, and things have really taken off. Couldn't be happier, except would really like to use this camera for mobile 4x5 before I die.

Certainly not questioning your passion David. It's just that I've always thought that the bussness of photography is 90 percent bussness and 10 percent photography. Now, if one were fortunate enough to have someone else deal with the taxes, billing, accounts receivable, promotion, bonds and insurance, etc. then I'd think that would take the load off the artist/photographer to really do what they love.

Oh, I looked at your site, really nice work, both technically and artistically.

[Kirk Gittings]

Enthusiastic amateurs are what keep any photo company afloat. Some of those hobbiest photographers are very technically and even artistically proficient (not me) but enjoy photography too much to turn it into a mere job.

Absolutely. There are a lot of good reasons to keep photography a hobby and indeed some of the absolute best photographers I know don't make a living at it. Having said that I am in my 37th year doing photography full time (commercial, art and teaching) with no intentions to retire. I can't imagine doing anything else.

[mdarnton]

Enthusiastic amateurs are what keep any photo company afloat. Some of those hobbiest photographers are very technically and even artistically proficient (not me) but enjoy photography too much to turn it into a mere job.

I may have told this story before...... in the early 70s I worked in a small mall camera store. We had a customer, a doctor, who came in every time Canon brought out some new bit, and bought it. He had ALL of the F1 accessories and lenses. He barely knew how to load his camera, and I never saw a photo from him. One day I mentioned some resentment to the store owner, and he told me that I should be thankful for such people, since as a group they enabled companies to make so many of each item that the price could be low enough that even I could afford them. It was an excellent point.

[Kirk Gittings]

I may have told this story before...... in the early 70s I worked in a small mall camera store. We had a customer, a doctor, who came in every time Canon brought out some new bit, and bought it. He had ALL of the F1 accessories and lenses. He barely knew how to load his camera, and I never saw a photo from him. One day I mentioned some resentment to the store owner, and he told me that I should be thankful for such people, since as a group they enabled companies to make so many of each item that the price could be low enough that even I could afford them. It was an excellent point.

That is equally true of the workshop industry too.

[Tin Can]

Like the car biz, win on Sunday and sell on Monday.

[Drew Bedo]

No whining here. I do this for a living and I've been hoping to have a portable 4x5 for professional work and every project missed hurts a bit. Waiting on a KS that has moved and continues to move at a snails pace is frustrating, that's all. I'm glad it's a luxury that most here have no urgent use for.

David: If you have a commercial need foraTW type of P&S LF camera body, there is a Globus on e-Bay that has been reduced to $800 from a grand.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/301618028419?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

As an amature enthusiast photographer, I cannot justify the extra $600 or so and I'll have to wait till the opportunity for a TW comes along. I would think that one or two commercial shoots would pay for the Globus . . .but business is not my strong suite.

As written exchanges often do not read as they are intended: Ppease take these remarks to be well-meaning, helpful and respectful.

[BarryS]

I have a feeling the first Travelwides will be shipped out this week. Not based on any information, but it's been a month since the cameras have been available for pick up.

[sperdynamite]

I have a feeling the first Travelwides will be shipped out this week. Not based on any information, but it's been a month since the cameras have been available for pick up.

Lord I hope so. I have a beautiful wedding to shoot on a hill in Upstate NY and I was so hoping to snap off a few sheets of the ceremony on 4x5 as the sun goes down behind it.

[David Aimone]

Lord I hope so. I have a beautiful wedding to shoot on a hill in Upstate NY and I was so hoping to snap off a few sheets of the ceremony on 4x5 as the sun goes down behind it.

Don't hold your breath.

Every backer should have one of these cameras in their hands by now. And there still is no target date for that. The pickup parties should have been pickup yours and ship out theirs parties. Frustrating. But not surprising given the history of this project.

[plywood]

I have a feeling the first Travelwides will be shipped out this week. Not based on any information, but it's been a month since the cameras have been available for pick up.

Ben said he would post an update on the KS site when shipping was finalized. Since he has not done so then, as of this date, they haven't shipped. Like many other backers I'd like to understand why this is taking weeks to resolve.

[rdenney]

Give it a rest, guys.

Rick "tired of the pointless repetition" Denney

[Jim Cole]

Give it a rest, guys.

Rick "tired of the pointless repetition" Denney

Why? Silence is not "golden". They have to have an estimated shipping date by now. Why the info blackout? It's not that hard to throw out a little info. On another thread they said that the shipping problem turned out to be a "cakewalk". If so, then why the silence?

[letchhausen]

Give it a rest, guys.

Rick "tired of the pointless repetition" Denney

+1000

[Andrew O'Neill]

When mine finally arrives, I'll have to get my wife to pinch me to see if I'm dreaming...

[Ben Syverson]

We're 90% ready to ship the first batch (they're on pallets without labels), but the reality is that I'm on the final week of a 12 week project, and Justin is shooting all week on five sets simultaneously (five!), so we can't physically be there to move the shipment onto the truck. As much as it pains me to say it, the soonest we can do it is Thursday of next week. But in the scheme of things, this is not a long delay. And we'll have over 500 cameras (more than 1/3 our total) shipped.

So, I hate to beg your patience again, but: hang in there!

[rdenney]

Why? Silence is not "golden". They have to have an estimated shipping date by now. Why the info blackout? It's not that hard to throw out a little info. On another thread they said that the shipping problem turned out to be a "cakewalk". If so, then why the silence?

Because silence merely allows the same unproductive bitching to repeat itself, rather than escalating into new bitching.

Nobody really believes that Ben and Justin aren't eager to be done with this. Nobody believes they are withholding information just to annoy people. Nobody believes an update from them every two hours (or two days) will make it happen any faster (though responding to every complaint here could certainly make it slower). Nobody believes Ben is saying to himself, "if those pesky LF forum guys would shut up, I could ignore this for another month."

Every time they throw out a tidbit, the bitching starts up again. There is always an insatiable desire for information, which quickly leads to unhelpful advice (you could ship it this way, or that way!), requests for special consideration (I have a trip coming up!), tales of hardship (this is my living!), special needs (can't you just send mine to me now? Wouldn't take five minutes!), and so on. I've seen all of this just in the last week. All of that is based on the squeaky wheel principle, which everybody loves if they are squeaking and hates if they are being squeaked at. And I'll bet not one soul here, myself included, hasn't struggled to get a late project done, and knows that impatience feeds on itself counterproductively. The only information that resolves questions are answers. Until they have answers, they,d be fools to feed the beast. "Nothing's happening--we are just waiting" is not information.

It just may be that they are at the mercy of providers (the shippers likely being the latest, and maybe their day-job bosses) who really don't give a damn about the people here and their squeaking.

So, that's why I say, give it a rest.

Sorry if I'm coming off grouchy, but there it is. Remember, I also have at least one camera sitting on that pallet, and maybe two.

Rick "who has seen this cycle repeat endlessly, where an update escalates complaining rather than relieving it" Denney

[Jim Cole]

Because silence merely allows the same unproductive bitching to repeat itself, rather than escalating into new bitching.

Nobody really believes that Ben and Justin aren't eager to be done with this. Nobody believes they are withholding information just to annoy people. Nobody believes an update from them every two hours (or two days) will make it happen any faster (though responding to every complaint here could certainly make it slower). Nobody believes Ben is saying to himself, "if those pesky LF forum guys would shut up, I could ignore this for another month."

Every time they throw out a tidbit, the bitching starts up again. There is always an insatiable desire for information, which quickly leads to unhelpful advice (you could ship it this way, or that way!), requests for special consideration (I have a trip coming up!), tales of hardship (this is my living!), special needs (can't you just send mine to me now? Wouldn't take five minutes!), and so on. I've seen all of this just in the last week. All of that is based on the squeaky wheel principle, which everybody loves if they are squeaking and hates if they are being squeaked at. And I'll bet not one soul here, myself included, hasn't struggled to get a late project done, and knows that impatience feeds on itself counterproductively. The only information that resolves questions are answers. Until they have answers, they,d be fools to feed the beast. "Nothing's happening--we are just waiting" is not information.

It just may be that they are at the mercy of providers (the shippers likely being the latest, and maybe their day-job bosses) who really don't give a damn about the people here and their squeaking.

So, that's why I say, give it a rest.

Sorry if I'm coming off grouchy, but there it is.

Rick "who has seen this cycle repeat endlessly, where an update escalates complaining rather than relieving it" Denney

Actually, just the opposite! Ben just broke the silence and gave us an estimated shipping time. No more bitching required.

How about that! Thanks, Ben. Don't mind waiting a little longer now that we know what's going on.

[BarryS]

We're 90% ready to ship the first batch (they're on pallets without labels), but the reality is that I'm on the final week of a 12 week project, and Justin is shooting all week on five sets simultaneously (five!), so we can't physically be there to move the shipment onto the truck. As much as it pains me to say it, the soonest we can do it is Thursday of next week. But in the scheme of things, this is not a long delay. And we'll have over 500 cameras (more than 1/3 our total) shipped.

So, I hate to beg your patience again, but: hang in there!

Thanks for the update!

[plywood]

Give it a rest, guys.

Rick "tired of the pointless repetition" Denney

I agree with Jim Cole, why? You don't care when, fine, we get that, but there is absolutely nothing unreasonable in any of the backers asking why, for pity's sake is it taking so long to start shipping. And, Ben responded with an reasonable explanation. That they are as super busy on their day jobs. And, he even gave an earliest date that shipping would start. I get that, it doesn't make me upset at Ben at all and Ben, I thank you for responding with that information.

[plywood]

We're 90% ready to ship the first batch (they're on pallets without labels), but the reality is that I'm on the final week of a 12 week project, and Justin is shooting all week on five sets simultaneously (five!), so we can't physically be there to move the shipment onto the truck. As much as it pains me to say it, the soonest we can do it is Thursday of next week. But in the scheme of things, this is not a long delay. And we'll have over 500 cameras (more than 1/3 our total) shipped.

So, I hate to beg your patience again, but: hang in there!

Thanks Ben, you are obviously as busy as a one armed wall paper hanger so thanks for the update.

[rdenney]

Actually, just the opposite! Ben just broke the silence and gave us an estimated shipping time. No more bitching required.

How about that! Thanks, Ben. Don't mind waiting a little longer now that we know what's going on.

Go back and review the thread. Every substantive update has brought both encouragement, and also complaints. The complaints led in new directions. The attempts at engaging the complaints led to more complaints. Attempting to answer them all would have been a full-time job.

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera? Not a bit.

There is a time for complaining. But every few days is too often.

If your desire is for mere communication, fine. Me? I want the camera.

Rick "productive is me having the camera, not more squeaking" Denney

[Jim Cole]

Go back and review the thread. Every substantive update has brought both encouragement, and also complaints. The complaints led in new directions. The attempts at engaging the complaints led to more complaints. Attempting to answer them all would have been a full-time job.

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera? Not a bit.

There is a time for complaining. But every few days is too often.

If your desire is for mere communication, fine. Me? I want the camera.

Rick "productive is me having the camera, not more squeaking" Denney

I doubt that the 2 1/2 minutes that it took Ben to write that update had any effect on the shipping date.

Jeez, some of you guys are so defensive.

Plus, most of us wouldn't care if the cameras went out a few days later. At least we have a basic schedule to work with.

The "squeaking" usually starts after a month or more of silence after Ben himself promised updates every two weeks.

[Tin Can]

Thanks Rick. If I may, I am going to plagerize and paraphrase your message as I need exactly that type of reply to endless emails I get in my volunteer work.

If I answered every squeaky special needs request that is all I would be doing.

Amazing how good deeds are always punished.

If any person can write an astounding public post right here and now why they absolutely need this camera ASAP, I will ship mine to them.

Make your appeal good, we can all vote for the most needy writer.

Not kidding. No PM's. I keep my word.

[Larry Kellogg]

I think I probably have a camera on the pallet. Woo hoo! Hang in there Ben, good luck finishing your project. I figured you guys were busy. I can wait some more.

[rfesk]

I am looking forward to receiving mine also -- but have a LOT of empathy for their situation. I agree with rdenney 1000%.

[plywood]

Ben is telling you what he expects, based on what people are telling him. Supposing the shipper doesn't show up next Thursday? Ben'll have to come back on here explaining that they didn't show up, and then we'll have ten more complaints. Would not having that information about Thursday have delayed anyone receiving their camera?

Not going to happen. Ben controls when pick up happens. He calls the carrier with a request for pickup, the carrier gives him a day (if during the week usually the next day) and approximate time. In 35 years doing shipping and receiving for the same company (including large shipments) I never, not once, had a carrier not show up on the date promised. That included UPS, FedX, CF, at all levels of service.

A good example of KS creator communication is the Intrepid 4x5 project. A little over a month ago the creator promised an update every Friday. For the last month he has held to that promise. Although his project has slipped to 7 months past initial reward estimate you just don't see the backers complaining. When Ben posted that bit of information I did not see one sour remark from anyone, just 'thank you'.