lens options for a Calumet 4X5...(economy-driven)...

[Dean Taylor]

hello--

student photographer (read: 'budget') trying out LF...

I have looked into lens boards for a Calumet 4X5 (540 CHROME LARGE FORMAT VIEW CAMERA BODY http://is.gd/6yc7N6 )--not cost prohibitive at all...and all that remains for me to begin exploring 4X5 is the matter of the lens. Here is my (clumsy) question:

As it would seem to be the case that a lens for this 4X5 may run upwards of four hundred dollars (or more) have any of you encountered a photographer who has made a go of--for lack of a better term--gerryrigging a lens/shutter front from an inexpensive camera (garage sale, ebay, etc.) to the Calumet lens board? Or, is it more likely than not that by attempting same I would be throwing away fifty or so bucks? Or--and, if that is somehow feasible (and not to press the issue) is it within the realm of practical possibility that I might purchase a Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D (about a hundred bucks) and attach it to the lens board?

I dare pose these tedious/tacky suggestions as temporary remedies to a temporary scarcity of funds--i.e., until I can manage the proper Calumet lens from keh, and, in order to get started loading b & w 4X5 film in the Calumet and, off I go! Just the mathematical possibilities kindle excitement: 4X5 = 20 sq inches of negative--a HUGE canvas for me to fill (pardon the metaphor: I also paint murals w/acrylics)!

Someone had mentioned the possibility of a 135mm from an old Speed Graphic--what would be a reliable resource for purchasing same?

Thanks again!

Dean

[Gem Singer]

Dean,

KEH is a good place to shop. They have a liberal return policy if you are not satisfied with your purchase.

The Calumet camera you have selected is a fine beginners camera. It is made in the Netherlands by Cambo. Calumet owns Cambo, so parts and accessories are readily available.

However, a 50mm lens from a 35mm camera will not cover the 4x5 format.

KEH lists many previously owned lens with shutters on their website. A 135, 150, 180, or 210 (made by a major manufacturer) is a "normal" focal length for 4x5. KEH bargain quality lenses are quite satisfactory.

Caltar lenses are re-branded by Calumet and are made by Rodenstock, Schneider, etc. They usually can be purchased at lower prices.

Be sure to leave room in your budget for film holders, a focusing loupe and cloth, a cable release, a light meter, and a sturdy tripod.

[Mike Anderson]

Something like a Nikkor 50mm f/1.8D won't work well because 1) doesn't cover 4x5 2) doesn't have a shutter 3) is hard to mount to a lens board.

You should find a 4x5 lens (w/shutter), then get a lens board specific to the camera AND with the right size hole for the shutter (http://www.largeformatphotography.info/lensboard_hole_sizes.html) you get. Regarding lens board, know that there are a couple different Calumet 4x5 families that take different Calumet lens boards so you need to be sure you get the right kind of Calumet lens board.

You can get a decent 210mm lens from KEH (http://www.keh.com/Camera/format-Large-Format/system-Large-Format/category-Fixed-Focal-Length-Lenses?s=1&bcode=LF&ccode=6&cc=55942&r=WG&f) for less than $200. You don't want one that has a "DB mount", which means it doesn't have a shutter.

[Jim Jones]

Buying camera and lens together can be less expensive than buying them seperately, and there is not the problem of buying or improvising the lensboard. Most of my large format gear came from ebay, but I can afford to gamble. KEH, Midwest Photo Supply, and a few others are reliable sources. Occasionally live auctions, newspaper ads, and Craig's List have LF gear. Gerryrigging lenses from cheap cameras rarely works well. They probably won't have enough covering power for 4x5, and image quality can be inferior. Old lenses designed for 4x5 can still perform well. Most of mine are decades old.

Knowledge is power. The more you study LF photography, the better shopper you will become. Sites like this and the many books on LF photography can be valuable. A good public library is a great asset.

[rdenney]

I would look for a 150mm to 210mm plasmat (Schneider Symmar, Caltar II-N, Caltar S-II, Rodenstock Sironar, Nikkor-W, Fujinon-W, to name a few that are common on the used market). These are like 45-60mm lenses on a 35mm camera.

I see a 180mm Nikkor-W in bargain condition at KEH for $179, a 180mm Schneider Symmar-S for $235, a 210mm Fujinon-W for $205, and a 210mm(370mm with the front cell removed) Schneider Symmar Convertible for $165. These are the going rates, and it's usually not hard to find deals like these. Any of these would do the trick, and all would be very much better for sharp photography than the lenses I started with. They were all top-line lenses when new, and were expensive and made for professional use. The best of these would only be slightly better than the worst (i.e., would require significant experience to explore those differences) and all will provide enough coverage to accommodate the movements on your Cambo-made Calumet so that you can explore what a view camera is all about.

All of these will use a Cambo lens board with a 42mm hole. They have one for $37.

Rick "it's a great time to be buying large-format stuff" Denney

[John Kasaian]

Yeah, you can get a very nice lens for a 4x5 for $200, maybe less. Lenses off Speeders generally won't give you much wiggle room on a 4x5, kinda defeating the purpose of a view camera. The ubitquitous 127mm Ektar which I've seen for as little as $50 in a supermatic shutter is really a nice lens, but dosen't allow for movements. Sometimes you can find 203mm Wollys & Ektars and 215mm Ilex lenses in shutters for a bit less than more modern 210s from the "big three" and they are very fine performers.

[BrianShaw]

I'd suggest buying an affordable but proper LF lens that will offer movements, as "it's a great time to be buying large-format stuff" has suggested. If even that exceeeds budget it is possible to get a, for example, 135mm Optar in shutter that might even be working for around $50 if one shops patiently. Although movements will be limited, you might not really need or desire to use much in the way of movements until later when more experience with LF has been achieved.

[Edward (Halifax,NS)]

You can get a decent 210mm lens from KEH (http://www.keh.com/Camera/format-Large-Format/system-Large-Format/category-Fixed-Focal-Length-Lenses?s=1&bcode=LF&ccode=6&cc=55942&r=WG&f) for less than $200. You don't want one that has a "DB mount", which means it doesn't have a shutter.

If you were to get a 210mm lens with fair glass in an excellent shutter, for under $200, you can replace the glass with a lens in a DB mount eventually. I got a Sinaron-S in excellent condition, in a DB mount for about $150.

If you do not use filters I would jump at the 210mm Sironar-N with a dent in the filter ring for $159. I was tempted to buy this one for the shutter. Mine is currently mounted in a mismatched Prontor Press shutter.

http://www.keh.com/camera/Large-Format-Fixed-Focal-Length-Lenses/1/sku-LF06009000850F?r=FE

[jp]

A lens with a dented filter ring can also be used with square filters (like cokin compatible ones which are pretty cheap on ebay; straight outta shenzen)

$200 range should buy a reasonable 150 or 200mm lens with working shutter.

If you want to gerryrig something up, go right ahead; for a second or third lens, but it's a tough way to get started.

[rdenney]

If you were to get a 210mm lens with fair glass in an excellent shutter, for under $200, you can replace the glass with a lens in a DB mount eventually. I got a Sinaron-S in excellent condition, in a DB mount for about $150.

For lenses in this focal range, it's just not an issue. They had several lenses this long in DB mounts for $50-100 less than the same lenses in a shutter. It would be hard to find a lens in an appropriate shutter for less than that difference, just to salvage the shutter for the cells in the DB mount.

I have a Sinar shutter and I keep looking for the smashing deals on DB-mounted lenses, but the only ones I typically see duplicate lenses I already own and usually bought for not much, if any, more than what the DB lens is being sold for. I think the reason to have a Sinar shutter is to get the behind-the-camera operability (if that's important) and the ability to use barrel lenses. At used prices, that DB mount isn't much cheaper than a shutter and board. Of course, the OP owns a Cambo, so he can't use the DB mount or the board and it would just be wasted.

Rick "who paid $200 for a 210mm Sinaron-S in a Copal shutter" Denney

[Edward (Halifax,NS)]

Rick "who paid $200 for a 210mm Sinaron-S in a Copal shutter" Denney

That sounds like an excellent deal. How was the glass?

I paid $162 for mine directly from Sinar Bron when they were clearing everything out in 2004. It wouldn't surprise me if it was new because it looked pristine when I got it.

[rdenney]

That sounds like an excellent deal. How was the glass?

I paid $162 for mine directly from Sinar Bron when they were clearing everything out in 2004. It wouldn't surprise me if it was new because it looked pristine when I got it.

The glass is perfect--a lovely multicoated Rodenstock APO-Sironar-N. Yes, it was a good deal, but I think yours was likely a better deal, heh.

Rick "who was inactive for the Sinar Bron clearance--too bad" Denney

[Kevin Crisp]

Agree you can get very good lenses with coverage for around $200 or less. I would NOT buy a lens with a meaningful dent in the front or rear outer threads. If you need to open it up to clean off haze, you're done for.

[Joseph Dickerson]

Yes, you can find really good (cheap) prices on really nice lenses, Sinaron, Symar, Nikkor et al, but you'll have to shop and wait.

In the meantime look for a Caltar IIe/Rodenstock Geronar. These are the same lens rebadged for Calumet. The are excellent stopped down, offer reasonable movements, especially the 210mm, and can be had inexpensively.

We have several of each focal length where I teach and they are very sharp, contrasty, and generally underrated.

JD

[rdenney]

Shop and wait? Wait for someone to answer the phone at KEH, you mean. They have a pile of good deals in stock right now. It's not like 20 years ago when I bought my 150mm Geronar, when it was half the price of a Symmar Convertible.

Rick "the lines are short these days" Denney

[Paul Fitzgerald]

there are several 8 1/2" / 6.3 Commercial Ektars on eBay right now, nice lens for 4x5, fairly cheap.

[Harold_4074]

For someone starting out, that 210 Symmar Convertible at $165 would be hard to beat.

For decades, my working LF setup was a Calumet monorail and a Symmar-S (150mm convertible). With the front cell removed, it makes a very nice portrait lens. Although 150mm is a bit wide for still life, it's not unworkable, and it is fine for landscape and architecture. 210mm is a good "normal" general purpose lens--a few years back, Calumet was selling cheap lots of used "classroom kits", all with 210mm lenses. I should have bought one for a spare....