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Frank Petronio
22-Jan-2012, 11:58
I don't want to promote rumors but is there any fact to the notion that film prices will rise (as of January 22, 2012) ?

vinny
22-Jan-2012, 12:43
They already did as of the 15th at least at b&h.

Robert Jonathan
22-Jan-2012, 13:00
E100G in 8x10 jumped up for a few days, then went back down to it's original $119/free shipping price.

Portra in 4x5 and 8x10 are still the same, but it also jumped for a few days last week, then went back down.

Fujichrome 20 sheet boxes are definitely looking better and better... but I like Fuji film anyway. :)

vinny
22-Jan-2012, 13:08
Those bastards! I paid $78.50 for tmy in 4x5. It was and now is $71.95

MWitmann
22-Jan-2012, 14:54
at Badgers the prices jumped up at the few days ago. The ektar 4x5 went to 26$, from 23..also the portra 160/400

John Kasaian
22-Jan-2012, 22:24
Why pay top dollar for a dying horse?

Thebes
22-Jan-2012, 22:51
Why see LF color neg film go away because we can't pay a buck more a sheet when many pay top dollar for soft focus lenses whose long term value is unlikely to hold?

akfreak
23-Jan-2012, 02:50
Why see LF color neg film go away because we can't pay a buck more a sheet when many pay top dollar for soft focus lenses whose long term value is unlikely to hold?

Amen

Wayne
23-Jan-2012, 09:42
I don't want to promote rumors but is there any fact to the notion that film prices will rise (as of January 22, 2012) ?

Not only did the price change, their packaging has a bright new look!

http://www.macodirect.de/images/IL408_400.jpg http://www.focus-on-imaging.net/news/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Ilford-film.jpg

SamReeves
23-Jan-2012, 09:47
Yup.

Fudgee and Foma for me.

Roger Cole
23-Jan-2012, 10:01
Ilford black and white was already more expensive. Kodak could go up and still be cheaper, or the same.


Why pay top dollar for a dying horse?

Because:

1. It's ill, but reports of its death are so far greatly exaggerated, and
2. Even ill, it's still the best horse in the race, at least in color. I like Fuji E6 films but since Ilfochrome died before I got back into it, I don't have any interest in LF E6 any more. My only interest in E6 now is for projection, and that means 35mm and while Portra 400 is good, in medium speed since Fuji killed Astia it's E100G for me. In neg film, Fuji just can't really compete any more, and in LF they don't even try to compete in North America.

Drew Wiley
23-Jan-2012, 10:56
Just get used to it. Prices are going up all over the place due to dramatic increases in
raw materials and shipping. Looked at how much Ilford papers have recently gone up?
Looked at the price of silver? Petrochemicals? I'm sure glad I stocked up on some things a years ago when they were already too high, because they're a lot worse now.
This is not a situation unique to Kodak. It's called inflation, and after about a decade
of keeping things artificially depressed, the ice has finally cracked.

akfreak
23-Jan-2012, 23:10
Here is inflation for ya FRESH Fujifilm Fujichrome Astia RAP 100F in 4x5 20 sheets is $39.95 a great price IMO, (20 pcs at 4x5 = same surface at 10 pcs of 8x10 right?) Why they cant just leave it at 8x10 and sell it as 10 pieces for the same price is beyond me. Greedy Jerks)

So here is the Inflation part. Fujifilm Fujichrome Astia RAP 100F in 8x10 is not available to the USA! It is freshly made and available in Japan (in 8x10). However to get it sent here it cost $500 for 10 pcs, this is before any dutys or scanner ruining events that may take place. I got the weak US $ vs the YEN or some crap like this when I questioned the ridiculous price.

Now Kodak is under the knife so I expect to see all color Neg and Slide 8x10 start to creep up to retarded prices like the Gouger of the Astia RAP 100F who has access to it.

What is the deal with Fuji not letting people around the world have access to all of its products. If Kodak is on it's deathbed why isn't Fuji trying to finish them off by flooding the market with film at cut rate prices. Then like a drug dealer after the competition had been eliminated and people are hooked start to limit the supply and drive up the price.

LF color film is a weird business indeed. To me it only makes sense product is based on cost of materials, so a price per SQ inch should govern the price. Well this isn't the case, 4x5 vs 8x10 is way different when you compare actual sq inches of product $ for $.

Sorry to get off the Kodak subject, I did my part and placed a nice fat order of ektar Fresh 4x5 and 8x10 it is sitting nicely in the freezer as we speak.

JC Kuba
23-Jan-2012, 23:38
Here is inflation for ya FRESH Fujifilm Fujichrome Astia RAP 100F in 4x5 20 sheets is $39.95 a great price IMO, (20 pcs at 4x5 = same surface at 10 pcs of 8x10 right?) Why they cant just leave it at 8x10 and sell it as 10 pieces for the same price is beyond me. Greedy Jerks)

So here is the Inflation part. Fujifilm Fujichrome Astia RAP 100F in 8x10 is not available to the USA! It is freshly made and available in Japan (in 8x10). However to get it sent here it cost $500 for 10 pcs, this is before any dutys or scanner ruining events that may take place. I got the weak US $ vs the YEN or some crap like this when I questioned the ridiculous price.

...

LF color film is a weird business indeed. To me it only makes sense product is based on cost of materials, so a price per SQ inch should govern the price. Well this isn't the case, 4x5 vs 8x10 is way different when you compare actual sq inches of product $ for $.


I just bought some 8x10 Astia from Badger a month ago. It was $183 for 20 sheets. Not way different from 4x$40 and even less than 4x current Badger price for 4x5 which is $50.

edp
24-Jan-2012, 00:32
(20 pcs at 4x5 = same surface at 10 pcs of 8x10 right?)

No.

vinny
24-Jan-2012, 00:35
new math!

Kuzano
24-Jan-2012, 00:55
What is the deal with Fuji not letting people around the world have access to all of its products. If Kodak is on it's deathbed why isn't Fuji trying to finish them off by flooding the market with film at cut rate prices. Then like a drug dealer after the competition had been eliminated and people are hooked start to limit the supply and drive up the price.

Where are you buying your drugs. My guy hasn't raised his prices in years, and the quality is going up (at least it feels like it is???) :D

Steve Smith
24-Jan-2012, 02:03
20 pcs at 4x5 = same surface at 10 pcs of 8x10 right.

Only if 10 = 5.


Steve.

rfesk
24-Jan-2012, 04:57
I believe that the latest T-max 400 is the most advanced B&W film ever. It will likely never be surpassed. I am stocking up on it while it is available from Kodak. You never know what is in the future.

Learned my lesson: Wish I had shot more Kodachrome in 120 when it was available and still being processed.

akfreak
24-Jan-2012, 05:26
No.
drrr i knew that 4 pcs of 4x5 from an 8x10sheet still not worth 500 usd from japan, fresh, This is a current film in Japan

John Kasaian
24-Jan-2012, 18:55
I believe that the latest T-max 400 is the most advanced B&W film ever. It will likely never be surpassed. I am stocking up on it while it is available from Kodak. You never know what is in the future.

Learned my lesson: Wish I had shot more Kodachrome in 120 when it was available and still being processed.

Agreed.
But.
There is a point of dimishing returns on technology.
I've always been miffed that I never got to try the legendary Kodak Technical Pan in 8x10.
No, not really.
FP-4+ and HP-5+ are pretty great emulsions.
All the advancements & technology in the world (even TMY) can't replace whats at the other end of the cable release:)

vinny
24-Jan-2012, 19:17
I have some tech pan in 8x10 and a few boxes in 4x5 I've yet to touch. I'll be sure to post the results some time when I shoot it.

Robert Jonathan
24-Jan-2012, 20:03
Just bought 20 sheets of 8x10 Provia (who needs Astia?) to keep Fuji alive!

Oh wait, it's Kodak that's dying, right? Whoops...

Drew Wiley
24-Jan-2012, 21:41
I've got plenty of 8X10 TechPan on hand, but it's all for special highlight masking
(high contrast) usage. It's a relatively disappointing film for general usage. Most
of us LF shooters, particularly of the contact printing school, wouldn't care much for
the poor separation at the extremes. Makes a bit more sense with small cameras,
but even then capacity for detail is a poor tradeoff for the so-so tonality. It's also a
thin film that doesn't stay very flat in a conventional filmholder. And it's the only film
that I've ever used that doesn't cooperate with pyro.

jp
25-Jan-2012, 11:27
I used to use tech pan once in a while in 35mm. It's contrast was difficult with most developers. The special tech pan developer worked well, and once-used d76 1:2 would tame it decently. Even still, it wasn't as suitable for general use as tmax100 or pan-x.

akfreak
25-Jan-2012, 20:25
Just bought 20 sheets of 8x10 Provia (who needs Astia?) to keep Fuji alive!

Oh wait, it's Kodak that's dying, right? Whoops...
(who needs Astia?---------------------> AKFREAK does, It is perfect for Portrait work. I love the colors, This is the only place I can find it (http://www.japanexposures.com/shop/product_info.php?currency=USD&products_id=69) for $500 20 sheets, This is Fresh so they are making it at the Japan factory. But in My opinion it is complete robbery to ask such a price for it. I will never spend a penny there on that website ever!

Sal Santamaura
25-Jan-2012, 21:44
...in My opinion it is complete robbery to ask such a price for it...It's important to understand how Japan Exposures works. Dirk, as a sideline business, takes orders from customers throughout the world who can't get specific Japanese photographic products in their own countries. He obtains the items for his customers at retail in Tokyo stores, then adds roughly a 30% markup plus shipping and sends things on their way.

Most retail operations charge a 100% markup over cost. Considering the service that Dirk provides, which includes not only buying the items but also packing them for international shipment, then physically taking them to the post office, I think his prices are perfectly reasonable.

There are two direct factors that cause the price you describe as "complete robbery" to be so high. First, retail cost of photographic items in Japan has been higher than in the US for decades. Second, the US dollar has crashed in relation to the Japanese Yen. Indirect factors driving that price up are the continuously decreasing quantity of 8x10 transparency film sold, which means indirect costs much be spread over fewer boxes, and the fact that Astia has been officially discontinued in all sizes/formats. Tokyo retailers undoubtedly understand and take advantage of the fact that those who demand this ever-more-limited supply will pay 'top Yen' to get what's left.

Dirk provides a valuable service to those who want and can afford something unobtainable any other way. He's not quitting his day job from the resulting profit. :)

akfreak
26-Jan-2012, 04:25
Well I am glad Dirk is able to help out the some folks that can afford it. This is what pisses me off, If in fact Fuji makes this film fresh, why is it not available to the rest of the world besides a person who buys retail and marks it 30%. Look I dont mind paying a fair price for film but $500 a box is way, way out of line. Even as a favor to those who can afford it.

If Fuji currently makes it and it's available to Japan, then I should be able to order it thru Adorama, or B&H it's not like they dont sell grey market merch anyway. The whole Idea of paying 30% over retail plus the exchange rate plus shipping and duty's on top is so out of line. Defend it if you wish, I cant be the only one to see this is profiteering or gouging.

I am sorry I wont do business like that,. I just wont. Just say if I was to buy 5 boxes, I could get on a plane go to Japan, buy it myself and ship it over and still save money.

Am I missing something here, I must be real dense if I just see this as wrong to pay $500+ a box for 8x10 color slide film. I can get it in 4x5 for $36 a box for 20 sheets. I know it inst 8x10 but come on, $500+ a box. I can get 14 boxes of 4x5 for the same price of 1 box of 8x10, this is 280 sheets of 4x5.

I guess I am way off base and should be happy it is available at all in 8x10.

Helcio J Tagliolatto
26-Jan-2012, 05:44
I believe that the latest T-max 400 is the most advanced B&W film ever. It will likely never be surpassed. I am stocking up on it while it is available from Kodak. You never know what is in the future.

Learned my lesson: Wish I had shot more Kodachrome in 120 when it was available and still being processed.

Regarding 400 ISO film, I think so.
But image quality wise you must say "Acros".

JC Kuba
26-Jan-2012, 08:11
AKFREAK - You might try calling Badger and see if they will be getting any more 8x10 Astia in. I noticed he got a couple batches in the last two months. I have no idea how he got hold of it. The 8x10 Astia I got from him has an expiration date of 3/2013.

John Kasaian
26-Jan-2012, 08:49
If enough demand is there (which is assured if Kodak is absent from the market) why won't the US distrbutor import the stuff?

Drew Wiley
26-Jan-2012, 09:17
This isn't a situaton unique to film. I have customers routinely asking for certain items
mfg in Japan, but the US branch won't import them. These big Japanese mfg corps tend to be very hierarchical with a lot of infighting. I can understand Jeff's frustration
and in the past have gotten all kinds of conflicting responses from Fuji USA regarding
the availability of specific films. Perhaps they just don't want to sell it for dramatically
less here than they can get in Japan. And the buying power of the dollar is rather
weak at the moment. Wish I had some cash to keep more Astia 8x10 in the freezer,
but with the demise of Cibachrome, I'm shifting most of my color work to negs.

Sal Santamaura
26-Jan-2012, 09:23
...If in fact Fuji makes this film fresh, why is it not available to the rest of the world...Because Fuji's USA (and similar entities in other countries outside of Japan) distributor/subsidiary/whatever has decided, based on local sales history, not to import it. Also note, again, that Astia is discontinued in all sizes/formats:

http://fujifilm.jp/information/articlead_0129.html

and a translation at

http://www.ephotozine.com/article/fujifilm-to-discontinue-range-of-film-17376


...I dont mind paying a fair price for film but $500 a box is way, way out of line...So, you'd consider $385 a box reasonable?


...If Fuji currently makes it and it's available to Japan, then I should be able to order it thru Adorama, or B&H it's not like they dont sell grey market merch anyway...Why do you think Adorama or B&H would be able to offer 8x10 Astia for much less than Japan Exposures does?


...I guess I am way off base and should be happy it is available at all in 8x10.I'd say so, yes. And, if you're that much enamored of it, you should buy a dedicated film freezer, then fill it with 8x10 Astia before every box in the world is sold to others. String your finances out to accomplish that just like Michael A. Smith did with the final run of Super-XX :)


...calling Badger and see if they will be getting any more 8x10 Astia in. I noticed he got a couple batches in the last two months. I have no idea how he got hold of it. The 8x10 Astia I got from him has an expiration date of 3/2013.What was Jeff's price per box?


If enough demand is there (which is assured if Kodak is absent from the market) why won't the US distrbutor import the stuff?For the same reasons previously enumerated. Its low sales volume. It's discontinued.

Helcio J Tagliolatto
26-Jan-2012, 10:21
Perhaps they just don't want to sell it for dramatically
less here than they can get in Japan.

Exactly what Fujifilm Brazil told me, regarding bringing here 4x5" Acros.

JC Kuba
26-Jan-2012, 13:42
What was Jeff's price per box?



$183

Drew Wiley
26-Jan-2012, 13:50
Jeff's price was quite good. I'm assuming someone in Japan was closing it out. If it was
mfg fresh again, the price would probably be way higher. There's just no way film prices are going to stay stable regardless. This is a new era with rapid inflation for
anything regarding petrochemicals. And if you think one brand is still a bargain relative
to another, it won't be long until they have to raise prices significantly too. Quality
distinctions are a different issue. Glad my 8x10 doesn't have a motor-winder yet.

akfreak
27-Jan-2012, 00:30
Because Fuji's USA (and similar entities in other countries outside of Japan) distributor/subsidiary/whatever has decided, based on local sales history, not to import it. Also note, again, that Astia is discontinued in all sizes/formats:

http://fujifilm.jp/information/articlead_0129.html

and a translation at

http://www.ephotozine.com/article/fujifilm-to-discontinue-range-of-film-17376

So, you'd consider $385 a box reasonable?

Why do you think Adorama or B&H would be able to offer 8x10 Astia for much less than Japan Exposures does?

I'd say so, yes. And, if you're that much enamored of it, you should buy a dedicated film freezer, then fill it with 8x10 Astia before every box in the world is sold to others. String your finances out to accomplish that just like Michael A. Smith did with the final run of Super-XX :)

What was Jeff's price per box?

For the same reasons previously enumerated. Its low sales volume. It's discontinued.


With Kodak about to go out, I did just buy a freezer. I just bought 11 boxes of ASTIA in 8x10 5 Boxes of Velvia 50, 10 boxes of Kodak E100G 8x10, 5 boxes on Ektar in 8x10 and 10 in 4x5. I am still waiting for my ASTIA 4x5 order to show up (10 boxes) So YeaH I did buy all I could find. Also hell no $385 a box is not reasonable! Where did you pull that number. I would pay around $200 a box for ASTIA in 8x10 no more!

I guess I will cram the freezer full of Ektar and E100G and ASTIA in 4x5 and 120!

I contacted Badger and he said No go on the ASTIA

Sal Santamaura
27-Jan-2012, 09:20
..Also hell no $385 a box is not reasonable! Where did you pull that number...If Dirk charges $500 per box and that includes a 30% markup, it means he's paying (in Yen) the equivalent of $385 per box for it at retail in Tokyo.

Oren Grad
27-Jan-2012, 09:42
Also hell no $385 a box is not reasonable! Where did you pull that number.


If Dirk charges $500 per box and that includes a 30% markup, it means he's paying (in Yen) the equivalent of $385 per box for it at retail in Tokyo.

As of five minutes ago, Yodobashi is asking Y29,500 for a box of 20 8x10 Astia 100F. X-rates.com says that that's currently equivalent to $380.25.

Drew Wiley
27-Jan-2012, 09:45
AFREAK - too bad you missed Badger's last batch. 8X10 in this product has always been difficult to get in this country. The bottleneck is Fuji USA, because Astia has always been a very poor seller compared to Provia and Velvia. It is officially discontinued from mfg. And a least one prominent in the US raises the price like crazy once a sheet film becomes scarce, so it happens here too; but they don't have it anyway. About your only hope is if Badger is lucky enough to find some more at a reasonable rate. It's a wonderful and unique film. Too bad more people didn't learn its
advantages; but you know, everyone nowadays wants candy colors.

akfreak
28-Jan-2012, 05:42
AFREAK - too bad you missed Badger's last batch. 8X10 in this product has always been difficult to get in this country. The bottleneck is Fuji USA, because Astia has always been a very poor seller compared to Provia and Velvia. It is officially discontinued from mfg. And a least one prominent in the US raises the price like crazy once a sheet film becomes scarce, so it happens here too; but they don't have it anyway. About your only hope is if Badger is lucky enough to find some more at a reasonable rate. It's a wonderful and unique film. Too bad more people didn't learn its
advantages; but you know, everyone nowadays wants candy colors.
YES to all I just ordered 10 more boxes in 4x5

Robert Jonathan
28-Jan-2012, 20:48
I just bought 11 boxes of ASTIA in 8x10 5 Boxes of Velvia 50, 10 boxes of Kodak E100G 8x10, 5 boxes on Ektar in 8x10 and 10 in 4x5.

Holy moly! That's more than I can spend. Where'd you get the 8x10 Astia?

akfreak
28-Jan-2012, 22:17
I got it from a friendly source :))))