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Steven Tribe
20-Jan-2012, 05:55
My, almost completely seized up, Universal Heliar has come back to me to-day. I promised, a long time ago, to have a go at fixing this problem and post photos and description. I understand there are a number of owners who have similar, if quite not so acute, problems.

This is also of relevance for cleaning the inside middle bi-concave lens and the insides of the other lenses.

I think that Voigtländer has changed the location of the only lock screw during the long life of the Universal. Tim Deming mentioned that his was hidden underneath the broad aperture ring. Mine wasn't - it was only screw in the side of the barrel in front of the aperture ring.
I should also explain that mine is a pre-Universal engraved type - before Voigtländer decided on the Universal name. I have no reason to believe that the mechanism was changed when they decided to make it a standard product.

I would label this a ** level difficulty job.
** means that it can done on a kitchen table with good lighting with ordinary tools at one session. Knowledge of clockwise/anticlockwise is required as well as a container (soup dish?) for the 3 small screws and a soft cover to the table. The Heliar is very well put together and the problem with friction in the turning system doesn't mean that the screws are going to be difficult. Remember this one is older than almost everyone else's Heliar!
The first photo shows Heliar. The second shows the aperture ring removed (just a single screw which goes down to a rather concealed hole/thread in the aperture disc) and the locking screw (central in the photo) for the front/lens assembly. Note that this screw is fortunately steel - otherwise we would have a rash of total failures with severed brass screws. When this is removed, the front assembly can be unscrewed from the front -the last photo.

Steven Tribe
20-Jan-2012, 06:16
The front drive of the middle lens of the Heliar is provided by 3 angled slots cut out of a brass barrel. I suppose it is 3 to maintain the centre position of the inner, shorter, barrel which is the mount for the central lens. The system is exactly the same, but with better engineering, as the method used with projection lenses. These slots provide much more movement than the 0 to 5 soft marking on the front rim indicate. The movement is restricted by a short slot and a screw. This screw has to be removed and this allows the friction surfaces/diagonal slots to be accessed. Photo 1 shows this restricting slot.
The following photos show the various components when the outer barrel is pulled off.

Steven Tribe
20-Jan-2012, 07:11
The inner tube can now be moved to both extremes of the long diagonal slots - well beyound the usual movement allowed. The two barrels can be totally separated by removing the two screws holding each of the three sliders. I don't recommend doing this unless absolutely necessary. Each of these has a separate stamp *,** and ***, matching a similar mark on the barrel. This reminds me of the stamping marks on engine bearings which are marked in the same way - indicating the correct pairing. The fact that the screws have perfectly alligned head slots is also a danger signal.
I am sure that this could be done - but the following method seems to work OK without taking the risk.
I cleaned the visable hardened grease off and then applied small quantities of terpentine around the edge and repeatedly moved the barrel in and out. The semi dissolved grease was removed from the edge and the 3 lots. This was repeated for 30 minutes with the turning ceming easier and easier. It is obvious that there is/has been metal to metal contact as there are scratch marks in the visable area which follow exactly the oblique movement of the outer barrel. The barrels were left to dry in a warm place. New grease (very little) was applied at the edge of the overlap and down in the slots. After copious in and out movements, the excess grease which hadn't been forced into the working area, was removed.
Assembly was extremely easy. Locating the fixing hole for the soft focussing adjustment is easy. The thread for the iris ring cannot been seen when the iris ring is in place (too deep too dark), so the exact location of the hole must noted on the aperture scale before the ring is put back on.
I forgot to mention that the middle lens can be removed using a standard lens wrench.
I have also posted a photo of the rubbish that was removed from this operation.

Steven Tribe
20-Jan-2012, 13:45
A few afterthoughts!

- Do not dispair if the weakest point in the mechanism - the single small steel screw has sheared off. There is plenty of clearance inside for the end of a new, slightly larger screw and thread. And the machining is on items which can be separated from the glass.
- I used quite heavy grease, although I was tempted to use lighter fractions of lubricant. The adjustment is a hand adjustment process - not a finger activity. Lighter lubricants might have made it easier, but there is a greater risk of lubricant "drip" and solvent condensates on the, rather difficult to get at, inner surfaces.

Steven Tribe
21-Jan-2012, 03:59
A final note!

My Heliar needed "handles" which have been (well) made by Grimes. The existing threads on the rim turned out to be M2.5 rather than the standard M3. So I have cut new M3 threads.
The handles give an opportunity to measure the effort needed to turn the soft focus ring, which may help others to diagnose their own Universals. Easy, OK and stiff can mean many things!
I placed my fishing spring balance on one of the handles and measured the pull required to turn it in both directions.
Starting moment was around 3 kilos and the rotation continued with just 2 kilos.
I would be interested in hearing what others measure this too?

Steven Tribe
10-Apr-2018, 04:46
This is a thread I started 6 years ago.

The photos were lost in a LFPF crash some years ago. I have now located most of the original photos which I post below to help understanding the text.

I have just taken my Universal out for a spin and can confirm that the soft focus adjustment is still OK after six years of no use!

Steven Tribe
10-Apr-2018, 04:50
And a final photo.

Miguel Coquis
10-Apr-2018, 21:53
And a final photo.

Excellent job !!!

nerologic
23-Nov-2019, 19:57
This is incredibly helpful. I need to clean some internal grime from a pre-Universal and now have the confidence to do so without great trepidation.

nerologic
23-Nov-2019, 22:47
That was not bad at all. In and out in under an hour with some extensive cleaning (mechanisms moved, just needed to clean some crud on each element). Thanks so much Steven.

mhayashi
11-Jun-2021, 17:30
Hello, Steven and everyone with universal heliars.
I’ve got an universal heliar and am trying to clean the element surfaces in between the front element and the middle one.
My sample is pre WWII but not the very first one without “universal”.

I removed the rear element and the screw on the side to control the aperture blades, then what’s the next step?
Do I need to remove the aperture ring as shown in the pic?

Thanks for your help!

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nerologic
11-Jun-2021, 17:37
Yes, take off aperture ring and the black sheath part will slide off toward the front. I see you already have the nubs off. Keep track of how the middle element is oriented. It may be symmetrical or it may need to be in a certain direction. Put tape on the outside to remember, maybe. I am worried I got distracted by someone and put mine in backwards after losing orientation. Could you do me a favor?


It all has the last 2 digits of the serial number written on several of the components. The middle lens element has wiring on it. Can you tell me if that goes in with the top of the numbers pointing toward the front or the rear element?

Thanks!!!


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nerologic
11-Jun-2021, 17:40
Like this, Steven’s SN must have ended in 45, and mine had that number written in pencil on the glass elements toohttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20210612/6c45f4a125c65af5fbfa599d76e97be5.jpg


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nerologic
11-Jun-2021, 17:41
Overall, it was pretty easy to clean in the end as long as the threads are all clean enough to unscrew.

mhayashi
11-Jun-2021, 17:52
nerlogic, thanks for your help!
Yes, indeed my serial number ends with 98.
The retaining sheath is engraved with 98.
It’s amazing how Voigtlander had the passion and effort to keep the universal heliars to the highest quality!!
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mhayashi
11-Jun-2021, 17:54
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mhayashi
11-Jun-2021, 18:16
It all has the last 2 digits of the serial number written on several of the components. The middle lens element has wiring on it. Can you tell me if that goes in with the top of the numbers pointing toward the front or the rear element?



The middle element has both concave curves.
What do you mean by “wiring”, writing?

nerologic
11-Jun-2021, 18:35
Writing, yes.

I need to pull mine apart to get a flange made (so I can ship it), so you’re giving me the motivation to go do it. I’ll check my middle element alignment later tonight too. Thanks!


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mhayashi
11-Jun-2021, 18:49
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I don’t see any writing on the middle element at this point.
Do I need to take the lens element from the brass casket??

mhayashi
12-Jun-2021, 08:42
I add additional photos for others in future….
I needed to realign the aperture scale marking line zeroed to f4.5, so the apertures are wide open.
I removed the retaining screw on the side as shown in pic, realigned the blades so that the dent of the aperture blade ring to accept the screw through the barrel is right at the position f4.5.

Everything was ok until I broke the screw with a excess torque against the retaining ring when assembling.
Now I can’t remove the retaining ring, so I’m going to enlarge the hole by milling, removing the remainder of the screw from the brass and retapping….
Very interesting to learn the mechanisms and the engineering though….

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berndinho
27-Jun-2021, 13:23
Hello,
I've read the thread carefully and hoped to find help here.
I recently bought a Heliar like Steven (unmarked Universal). Unfortunately, it was hit hard during transport and now has a dent in the soft focus ring. The soft focus ring is hard to turn, but it works.
I leave it that way for now, because the risk is too great that more will break. I want to clean the heliar, but I can't open it. I am afraid of doing something wrong.
The rear lens came off easily! I removed the screw on the aperture ring. How's it going from here? Do I have to unscrew the threaded ring at the back (in front of the aperture)? It's very stuck, that's why I'm asking about it here. Thank you for your support.

mhayashi
27-Jun-2021, 19:20
You need to remove the screw that holds the front barrel and the inner tube barrel.
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It’s not necessary to remove the aperture retaining ring lock screw to disassemble.
I don’t recommend to do so since the retaining ring has a dent to accept the lock screw right at the position.
You should mark the dent position of the retaining ring before you unscrew the lock screw!!!
Otherwise you may break the lock screw unable to match to the dent and trying to screw in the perpendicular threads of the retaining ring by excess torques like me and the only recovery is to remove the lock screw by milling the hole.

Steven Tribe
28-Jun-2021, 05:13
Very good suggestions. I know “milling”sounds beyond the average DIY enthusiast, but drilling out is a lot more amateur friendly. There is nothing odious in cutting a slightly larger thread!

berndinho
28-Jun-2021, 07:01
Many thanks for your help.

To see the Heliar like this:
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... do I have to unscrew this threaded ring first:
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?

mhayashi
28-Jun-2021, 15:18
In regards to the second picture, no, don’t remove the retaining ring that holds the aperture blades.
The retaining ring is set at the right position just to allow the aperture blades turn back and forth smoothly.
That’s what I meant to your question. Otherwise, you will mess up.

Just remove the big screw in the middle of the first picture, not the one you are pointing at by the driver. That little screw is the lock screw to hold the retaining ring just right at the position. You will need to remove the retaining ring and adjust the blade slot ring dent positioned right (the red arrow in your first picture) to accept the outermost screw that controls the aperture blade movements IF you turn back and forth the aperture blades AFTER you remove the screw here, because the dent position MOVES slightly when you turn the aperture blades then the blade slot ring moves and the f4.5 sign and the pointer won’t match when aperture blades are wide open.

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You want to remove the front element from the middle element, right??

berndinho
28-Jun-2021, 21:47
Thanks again for the answer!

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This is my lens with the only screw visible. This comes out easily. I leave it in there!
I want to clean all glasses.
The rear element is already unscrewed.
So what's the next step?

mhayashi
28-Jun-2021, 23:08
Once you unscrew it, turn the outermost barrel unclockwise.
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Don’t move the aperture blades.

berndinho
28-Jun-2021, 23:25
How can I do that without loosening the screw?
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mhayashi
29-Jun-2021, 00:45
You need to remove that screw first.

berndinho
29-Jun-2021, 01:55
OK - I'll try later. This thread warns against not loosening this screw. That's why I was irritated and hesitant.

berndinho
29-Jun-2021, 06:17
Thank you very much, it‘s very easy after removing the screw!
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mhayashi
29-Jun-2021, 06:22
Great!