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Cecil Pang
19-Sep-2003, 12:25
Does anyone here use Ansco 130 paper developer? It seems that there is only one supplier of Glycin in the US and I am wondering whether I should give it a try.

tim atherton
19-Sep-2003, 12:43
there's this stuff - not sure if it's the same. Haven't tried it.

http://www.fineartphotosupply.com/chemicalspage2.htm

as well as, I think, Photogpraphers Formulary

Gem Singer
19-Sep-2003, 14:51
Hi Cecil,

About ten years ago, when Forte first introduced their warmtoned paper, I talked to the chief chemist at Alta Chemicals in Oaklahoma. He had just formulated a warmtone developer that was designed to be used with the new Forte warmtone paper. It was called Zonal Pro HQ warmtone Paper Developer. He hinted that the developer was similar to Ansco 130. I assumed it contained glycin. When I tried it with the Forte warmtone paper, it gave a beautiful result. Similar to a platinum/paladium tone. The formula is proprietory, so I cannot verify that it actually contains glycin.

The Zonal Pro developer and the Forte paper are available at B&H, in N.Y., in your neck of the woods. It's worth a look see. It may save you time and money. As far as I know, Photographer's Formulary is the only supplier of photographic grade glycin in the US. Perhaps, in the entire world.

Bill_1856
19-Sep-2003, 15:22
Ansco 130 is available from Photographers Formulary, and it's beautiful stuff. It gives almost an Amidol quality, and (unlike Amidol) seems to last forever.

Richard Knoppow
19-Sep-2003, 15:40
Agfa/Ansco 130 is very similar to Dektol with the addition of Glycin. You can make essentially the same thing by adding Glycin and some Potassium bromide to Dektol. Glycin 11 grams/liter of stock, Bromide 3 grams/liter of stock. 130 is less likely to produce greenish blacks. The only problem with Glycin is its high cost. For comparison here are the two formulas.

Kodak D-72 (Dektol) Stock Solution Water 500.0 ml Metol 3.1 grams Sodium Sulfite, dessicated 45.0 grams Hydroquinone 12.0 grams Sodium Carbonate, monohydrated 79.0 grams Potassium Bromide 1.9 grams Water to make 1.0 liter

Agfa/Ansco 130 Stock Solution Water (at 125F or 52C) 750.0 ml Metol 2.2 grams Sodium Sulfite, dessicated 50.0 grams Hydroquinone 11.0 grams Sodium Carbonate, monohydrated 78.0 grams Potassium Bromide 5.5 grams Glycin 11.0 grams Water to make 1.0 liter

Dilution for both is the same.

Gem Singer
19-Sep-2003, 16:15
I just looked, and B&H has Photographer's Formulary 130 paper developer in stock. It is available in several sizes.

ronald lamarsh
19-Sep-2003, 17:49
I've been using the Formularies 130 developer for years and it does give beautiful results. I can suggest getting the kit directly from the formulary as glycin doesn't keep well in powdered form and the stuff in their kits is always fresh.

jnantz
19-Sep-2003, 22:37
i have been using 130 for about 2+ years now for prints as well as for film. if you like what it does for prints, you will probably like it as a film developer.

when it was sold as gaf universal developer, the can used to say "film 1:5 68 6 1/2 mins, agitate" i recommend that you use it at about 72 and depending on its age, you kind of vary the development times ... i develop by inspection so i really have no idea how long i actually develop for, maybe around 7-7.5 mins.

if you order it from the formulary, ask them to send it to you with the freshest glycin they have. they make it every week.

Michael Veit
20-Sep-2003, 00:49
So what is the shelf life of Glycin? I ordered some from Formulary ealy last week (without knowing it has "keeping" problems) and now wonder whether I'll be able to use it up before it goes bad (100 grams). Any way of storing the stuff to extend its half-life?

Henry Ambrose
20-Sep-2003, 12:38
Ansco 130 is wonderful. Lasts a long long time even as working solution. Print, pour it into a bottle and use it next time. I don't know how long this can go on as I usually throw it out when its a couple of months old or I've done lots of prints. I use a sloppy replenishment scheme, simply adding some stock to the used developer if it seems slow or low contrast., add 100ml or so (to two liters) to bring it back up. It gets brown and funky and still works great. When starting fresh I dilute 1:3.

As Richard Knoppow stated above it does NOT give greenish blacks (which give me the creeps). I get neutral to warm results which suits me exactly. Higher dilutions give warmer prints. I use it on Ilford RC, fiber and Bergger fiber papers. Nice fluffy high tones and deep neutral to black chocolate blacks. One minute with RC, three minutes for fiber. 130 likes to be warm - keep your tray 72-75 degrees F.

Glycin is not that hard to keep. Keep it cool and sealed up tightly with no air space in the package. I have some over a year old and its still good. When fresh mine has been creamy white, I understand as it goes bad it gets dark. In solution it keeps longer. Ansco 130 stock will keep at least 6 months with no change that I can detect, I suspect it'll go longer than that without any problem if its well sealed in glass with no air.

I'll second John Nanian's comments about 130 as a film developer. It works pretty well!

jantman
22-Sep-2003, 17:05
As to suppliers of Glycin, I'm almost 100% sure that Photographer's Formulary stocks it, and Bostick & Sullivan probably does too. I don't know for sure, and don't have their catalogs handy.

If you can't get it that way, try a lab-quality chemical supply store. Remember to order AR quality. Maybe have a high school or college order it for you to make it easier.

Cecil Pang
23-Sep-2003, 11:35
I got a pack of Photographer's Formulary 130 from B&H and made my first print on Ilford Galerie last weekend. I thought 130 was a cool to neutral tone developer but to my surprise, the image came out quite warm. It was not brown, but more a bronze color. I toned the print with KRST 1:15 for five minutes. When I developed Galerie in Sprint developer (which I understood was Dektol), five minutes in KRST 1:15 was enough to remove the green cast as well as to slightly increase DMax. Five minutes is probably not enough with the use of 130 developer.

What is the color of fresh Glycin? The pack I got was light beige in color.

jnantz
16-Nov-2003, 14:03
cecil:

when glyicn is fresh, it is white in color. the formulary is, from what i understand, the only place left that makes it. there is a very good chance that all the other people that may have some are re-selling what they are buying from the formulary. there are others that sell a different glycin, which isn't the same as the photo-chemical. you can order the chemical direct from the from them, and just ask them to send you the freshest stock they have. it is made about once a week, and they don't mind at all sending you some after the "new batch" is pulvarized/dried out. the developer is best when fresh glycin is used to make it.

good luck! john

SMBooth
11-Nov-2011, 17:46
Is it possible to substitute liquid glycin you find in the chemist shop for powdered glycin (mine is almost black!). If so at what ratio?

Thanks

Gem Singer
11-Nov-2011, 17:59
Are you certain that you are not referring to liquid glycine?

Glycin and glycine are two different substances.

(you realize that this thread is almost nine years old, don't you?)

SMBooth
11-Nov-2011, 18:28
DOH ! Yes to both, I am confusing the two products thanks.

David R Munson
11-Nov-2011, 22:24
So long as someone else already bumped this old thread, I'll add my +1 for 130 being awesome. I used it for a long time until I had to give up my darkroom. In Korea, I used some Ilford developer because that's all I could get, and right now I'm not printing at all, but back in the US next year when I can set up to print again, I'm going straight back to 130. I've never gotten such beautiful results as I got with 130 and Agfa 111.

Wayne
12-Nov-2011, 06:50
Hi Cecil,



The Zonal Pro developer and the Forte paper are available at B&H, in N.Y.


Ah that was a heartwarming bit of nostalgia. But I want to keep reminding people that there are efforts to bring back Forte warmtone paper, though the economic situation is not helping that effort. But here is the Adox blog about the effort http://www.polywarmton.com/page5/page5.html

and here is where you can register to pre-order boxes, with no pre-payment

http://www.polywarmton.com/index.html

which I look at as more symbolic than anything, but if people don't show ongoing interest in bringing back the paper then of course it will never happen.

jnantz
12-Nov-2011, 08:02
i'm using pitch black ansco 130 to process paper negatives
it works very nice.. i just cracked open my last of 6 gallons " stock" i made up
1.5 years ago, and it works as well as fresh.

David R Munson
12-Nov-2011, 08:28
I would also like to note that while my experiments in developing film with 130 were very limited (4 sheets of 8x10), the results were spectacular. I was doing brush development by inspection and while the photographs themselves weren't anything to write home about, those might still be the technical best I've ever achieved in terms of good negatives. When I did it, the developer looked about like tar, only thinner.

evan clarke
12-Nov-2011, 13:32
Formulary makes the Glycin. Keep,it in the fridge and it keeps a long time and quite well. I use a Glycin film developer in addition to the 130 so I go through a lot. I buy 2 pounds at a time and store as outlined, never had tomthrow anynaway..Evan Clarke

paulr
13-Nov-2011, 18:05
So what is the shelf life of Glycin? I ordered some from Formulary ealy last week (without knowing it has "keeping" problems) and now wonder whether I'll be able to use it up before it goes bad (100 grams). Any way of storing the stuff to extend its half-life?

This for me was the one drawback with 130. My powdered glycin generally darkened badly by the time it was six months old. I never tested how big a difference this would make, but heard from people, including the guy who ran the Formulary, that this corresponds with it losing its oomph. Possibly a tightly sealed glass container would help a little, possibly refrigeration ... but I haven't heard of any of these things extending the shelf life by much.

It's a curious case of the mixed solution having a longer shelf life than the dry powder. My 130 working solution would last several months, and I've had stock solution last close to a year.

It's wonderful stuff. I used it (in combination with Ansco 120) for almost ten years. A couple of times, when I had a negative that needed extreme help with shadow separation, I'd break out the amidol. But the differences were extremely subtle, and working with amidol is expensive, messy, and annoying in comparison.

Jan Pedersen
13-Nov-2011, 18:20
Glycin keeps very well in the freezer to. I just checked a container that i know is more than two years old and the Glycin is still white as the day i received it.

mikebarger
13-Nov-2011, 18:39
Ditto on freezer keeping qualities.

Richard Wasserman
13-Nov-2011, 18:39
Glycin keeps very well in the freezer to. I just checked a container that i know is more than two years old and the Glycin is still white as the day i received it.


This has been my experience also.