Photos at Occupying Wall Street

[Hugo Zhang]

Anybody here in the forum has been there with a LF camera as they are in many cities now? I am thinking of camping in LA city hall, site of Occupying LA, for a day or two with my Graflex Super D for some random portraits. Any suggestions or ideas?

And Domenico is coming with me. :)

[Mark Woods]

Go for it Hugo. The LA police seem to be better behaved than the police in NYC and Boston.

[Ed Kelsey]

"The LA police seem to be better behaved than the police in NYC and Boston."

Really ? Rodney King didn't think so.

[Jay DeFehr]

I was thinking of going down to the demonstration here in Seattle. Our police are very polite and professional, it seems.

[Mike Anderson]

"The LA police seem to be better behaved than the police in NYC and Boston."

Really ? Rodney King didn't think so.

That's why they're better behaved. They learned. (don't want to get into politics here. please. sorry. thank you.)

...Mike

[Brian C. Miller]

I was thinking of going down to the demonstration here in Seattle. Our police are very polite and professional, it seems.

+1! I was going to come down with my Super Graphic, but not my 8x10 monorail.

Were you thinking of Saturday or Sunday?

[Jay DeFehr]

I was planning to let the weather dictate, but if you'll be there one day or the other, I'd love to meet up for coffee.

[Renato Tonelli]

I was at the NY march last week and saw several young people with 35mm and MF cameras; I spotted someone with an 8x10 but it was so crowded that I did not try to approach him.
I didn't bring anything; I was not in the mood for any hassles...

[MIke Sherck]

I drove past our new encampment last evening. Due to an unexpected "honey-do" list when I got home from work there wasn't enough light for the 8x10 I wanted to use but I drove past just to see.

It looks like a homeless camp. I expected to see signs, people up and about, but there were just some long tables, sleeping bags, people sitting around talking. Not very interesting photographically. Now the weather's turning and they've all promised to move out for the weekend so my little town can have the harvest festival they've planned. The protesters are supposed to be back Sunday night. Maybe it'll be worth a negative or two by then.

Mike

[Brian C. Miller]

I was planning to let the weather dictate, but if you'll be there one day or the other, I'd love to meet up for coffee.

Either day works for me. The weather looks good for the weekend, and the bus runs roughly the same. However, Saturday looks like it will be the busiest, with the "protesters" planning to put up 500 tents.

For those that don't know, Westlake park isn't really a park, it's a plaza surrounded by stores and it isn't very large. The last time grass grew there, there were deer and hunters with bows. Yes, there are "green spaces" in "downtown" Seattle, but Westlake isn't one of them.

[tgtaylor]

Here in San Francisco they are camped-out in front of the Federal Reserve Bank which occupies an entire city block at the foot of Market Street. The Socialists Workers Party is represented by just a couple of sign bearing protestors conspicuously stationed across the street - a sign that there may be some ideology conflict between the two groups. I walked through the encampment yesterday afternoon with a Pentax PZ-1 loaded with Neopan 400 and shot about 20, 25 frames - one of a sign-bearing gentleman attired in typical financial district fashion. The police have cordoned off the portico with iron barricades permitting only employees to enter or leave and several media vans are parked and waiting nearby. The atmosphere, though, was peaceful and had a decidedly hippie flavor to it. I have been working on a special project for some time adding one or two images at a time when something happens or when I run across a view that fits.


Thomas

[Michael Cienfuegos]

The unwashed in San Diego had to take down their tents and tables, the City had booked the area for a dance concert this evening. They made only one or two arrests. I wanted to go down today, but with all the police activity and my own errands, I was unable to go, and my GF has plans for me all weekend. If they are back on Monday I will probably be there with my Speed,

[r.e.]

My impressions from visiting Zuccotti Park today:

There are maybe 1,000 people, if that, occupying the park. They represent every conceivable cause and range in age from late teens to elderly. It reminded me of a late 60s/early 70s sit-in, but without the waft of marijuana. The participants are quite civilized, indeed pretty laid back. There's music, art, people making silk-screened T-shirts with political slogans in exchange for a donation, a meditation group, etc.

The police are good natured and probably bored. They don't seem to have anything to do except ensure that gawkers like me don't create bottlenecks on the sidewalk around the park.

The national and local news networks are out in force. However, they don't seem to be doing a whole lot, probably because there isn't anything dramatic happening. It's kind of like a mini-Woodstock but without the rock 'n' roll. CNBC has created a "Speaker's Corner" which it is streaming live over the internet. Lots of people were lined up to talk, but you can't hear a word that they are saying. Unlike Hyde Park, where the audience is the surrounding crowd, these people are talking at normal volume into a mic to whoever is listening over the Internet.

I found it amusing that Brooks Brothers has a flagship store on one side of the park, and that there's something called The High School for Economics and Finance on another.

I think that Mike Bloomberg has completely lost it and I doubt that his police commissioner is giving him a whole lot of support. This is a pretty tame event. As for Bloomberg's threat the other day to move in to carry out "ordinary cleanup", the "occupiers" seem to be doing a bang-up job of keeping the park clean, right down to having dedicated bins for waste that can be composted.

Lots of amateur photographers, almost all digital. Saw one well-dressed woman with a shiny, new looking Voightlander, but not a single Leica. No medium format, no large format. Saw one guy using a tripod to take photos with a really tiny, thin camera the size of a cell phone, which it may well have been.

[Noah A]

I've been planning a portrait project involving the participants and supporters of the Occupy Wall Street movement. As a former newspaper photojournalist, it felt like too big of a story for me not to attempt to document it in some way. However my time as a street photographer has passed, that kind of work just doesn't interest me anymore (in terms of doing it, I still admire it when other people do it well).

I decided to focus on the people involved, it's a pretty diverse group and with lots of different backgrounds and goals. I wanted to shoot 4x5 portraits in a simple, studio style.

This involved some logistics--getting power for the lights, getting a background worked out (I've shot in this style before and normally I just tape seamless to a wall, but there were no flat walls available in the Philly site and probably not in the other sites either). So I got a Honda generator, a Lastolite collapsible background, and went to it.

I started shooting yesterday and after I had gotten warmed up with my first three portraits, one of my Profoto monolights broke. I don't know what happened. My assistant swears it didn't blow over but the umbrella was deformed and it jammed into the light, breaking the protective glass dome. Thankfully the flashtube was OK. My replacement should come tomorrow so with luck I'll shoot again in Philly on Thursday and/or Friday and in New York next week.

I'm shooting with the Technikardan and a 210 Apo-Sironar-S on the new Portra 160, which is absolutely brilliant for this kind of work. Light is from two Profoto Compact 600s and a Honda 2000i.

I posted some rough scanned polaroids (ok, fuji-roids), here as a preview:

http://noahaddis.com/news/?p=75

[Jim Michael]

I decided to focus on the people involved, it's a pretty diverse group and with lots of different backgrounds and goals. I wanted to shoot 4x5 portraits in a simple, studio style.


I've been photographing protests, beginning back in 1987 with Freedom March II and then picking up again a couple of years ago with Tea Party, anti-abortion, anti-mosque, 2nd Amendment bring your guns, gay rights, "pro marriage", etc. This protest is quite different from the ones I've covered over the last couple of years. Maybe it's the group dynamic that hasn't been there before.

[r.e.]

...there were no flat walls available in the Philly site and probably not in the other sites either).

If yesterday was typical, I don't think that you'll have much of a problem setting up at Zuccotti as long as you don't obstruct the sidewalk. You will probably notice a crowd of people and additional police about a block away. These are people lined up to see the 9/11 memorial, which is behind the High School for Economics and Finance. I think that it might be possible to do a project that incorporates several elements, including the "occupation", the high school, the memorial, Brooks Brothers, Brookfield Properties, etc.

That said, I wonder where Occupy Wall Street is going. Most of the New Yorkers that I've spoken with support the cause, not surprising since it is anti-bank, but very few people seem to be backing up their support with action. I suspect that part of the problem, from the protestors' side of things, is that Zuccotti Park is not exactly centrally located and it isn't very large. The dynamic might be quite different if this was taking place at, for example, Union Square. My overall impression is that there is a disconnect between what the media are reporting and the reality. Bloomberg's hamfisted approach mostly serves to stoke the fires. If he had any strategic sense, he'd just let them sit there indefinitely.

[paulr]

The police are good natured and probably bored. They don't seem to have anything to do except ensure that gawkers like me don't create bottlenecks on the sidewalk around the park.

Yeah, I was down there a few evenings ago, definitely not during any moments of drama or even any organized demonstration. The cops, like the occupiers, were just hanging out, talking amongst themselves. In a way they were just adding to the human presence. Which is a funny kind of subversion ... if you gather enough protesters, the police dept. is required to add its own. Kind of like a matching grant from the city.


As for Bloomberg's threat the other day to move in to carry out "ordinary cleanup", the "occupiers" seem to be doing a bang-up job of keeping the park clean, right down to having dedicated bins for waste that can be composted..

I am not taking sides on this particular issue ... just saying that I appreciate Bloomberg's quandarry. The park is a kind of murky gray area. Techincally it's privately owned, and the owners have asked to have it cleared. I don't know what the actual legal rammifications are for this kind of private/public space, but I'm glad Bloomberg has backed away from any strong arm tactics concerning the park.

And yes, the occupiers seem to be amazingly well organized and tidy. Many of them are unwashed and living on the pavement in sleeping bags, and they still do a better job of keeping house than I do at home.

FWIW, I'd be surprised if anyone would hassle a photographer, except maybe for blocking the street or sidewalk.

[Brian C. Miller]

I was at the "Occupy Seattle" (ah...) grouping(?) this last Saturday. I exposed six sheets, and nine 120 rolls. (developing in D76...)

Anyways...

Locally this was more like Sakura-Con or the Fremont Solstice Fair and parade, but the dress code for the participants was slacker/hippie/homeless, and nobody was naked. There were a couple of belly dancers and a few "zombies," though. Rhetoric was the same old "rich and big corporations bad" and "feel good and blessings" stuff, and absolutely no direction. They went for a meander in the afternoon down to the Pike Place Market and back. (Oh, yeah, they really showed the "banksters" their stuff by hanging around the market on a Saturday. Yeah...)

Jay DeFehr showed up with an Ansco camera. He was hard to locate, as black jackets were very common. (I wore my yellow bicycle jacket and had my trusty Dahon pack bike. Yes, I was fully clothed.) The little bike was great for getting around during the march, as reloading a Holga is slow. As for film cameras, somebody had a Mamiya RB, and another fellow had a Graflex Miniature Speed Graphic and a pinhole camera.

I got a free T-shirt in size gargantuan.

Yay. Whoopee. Oh, those banks and major corporations are sooo intimidated...

Banal pictures to follow.

[r.e.]

The park is a kind of murky gray area. Techincally it's privately owned, and the owners have asked to have it cleared. I don't know what the actual legal rammifications are for this kind of private/public space, but I'm glad Bloomberg has backed away from any strong arm tactics concerning the park.

A bit of trivia. The owner, Brookfield Properties, is a Toronto company that among other things built the Montreal Forum, home to what is, obviously, the world's greatest hockey team :) http://www.brookfieldofficeproperties.com/_Global/25/img/content/Files/Timeline/Brookfield%20Office%20Properties%20History%20revised%201.11.pdf

It is interesting to read about what is going on between NYC Police Commissioner Ray Kelly and Brookfield. Commissioner Kelly and Mayor Bloomfield don't seem to be on the same page, which might be why the cops at Zuccotti Park are are not into All Blacks Haka mode.

P.S. Looking forward to this weekend's NZ/France final. Allez la France!

[Jay DeFehr]

Yes, the Seattle chapter was a little, well, Seattle-like, meaning well behaved and generally positive. The speakers ranged from forgettable to grating, and what struck me most was that almost every person in attendance was carrying a camera. In a sense, the event covered itself, and that, for me was the most interesting part of the phenomenon.

The best part was meeting Brian Miller, who let me handle his Super Graphic, and persuaded me that coffee roasting is best done by one's self. Thanks for that, Brian, one more contraption and process to tinker with.

I shot with my Ansco Shur-Shot, from ground level, as it seemed to complement the spirit of the event. I'll post an example photo in the tiny formats thread. I met a nice young man working to prevent the redeployment of traumatized troops, against doctor's recommendations. Unlike many of the other causes vying for support, his seemed well organized, focused, and important.

[Two23]

This protest is quite different from the ones I've covered over the last couple of years. Maybe it's the group dynamic that hasn't been there before.


They're probably just mostly stoned, judging from what I see on TV. :D :D :D


Kent in SD

[Jim Michael]

They're probably just mostly stoned, judging from what I see on TV. :D :D :D


Kent in SD

They looked more collaborative than wasted. And I didn't see any donuts or other munchie evidence. Maybe it's more of a situation in which they have come to collaborate on the message than coming with a message. Although individually they tend to carry their specific message, not unlike the Tea Party folks. Tea Party is similar in that there are many messages under a single banner. The 2nd Amendment folks have a singular message.

A funny thing happened at a 2nd Amendment "open carry" rally at the state capitol. A protester wearing a sidearm was told to remove the stick on his sign. "You can have guns, but no sticks" say the capitol police.

[mcfactor]

My girlfriend has been down at Wall Street for the past few weeks (intermittently) with the 8x10, taking portraits. I will post a link when she puts them up. There is a surprising diversity in the crowd that is really refreshing to see.

-Noah

[paulr]

The coolest thing I witnessed was the "human microphone." They're not allowed to have any amplification devices, so for a couple of purposes (a poetry reading, and some dispute over leadership) they had a setup where a chorus of people in the crowd would repeat every phrase uttered by the speaker.

like ...

"i just want to say ..."
"I JUST WANT TO SAY ..."

"that we need to focus on the following issues ..."
"THAT WE NEED TO FOCUS ON THE FOLLOWING ISSUES ..."

It was a pretty brilliant solution, and also gave all the proceedings a kind of mythic scop, like individuals getting backed by a whole Greek chorus. I'm sure they learned this from other similar groups, but I'd never seen it before.

[mcfactor]

this is a teaser: http://neweconomies.tumblr.com/

[r.e.]

this is a teaser: http://neweconomies.tumblr.com/

Thanks, looking forward to seeing more on the Tumblr site.

[jeroldharter]

this is a teaser: http://neweconomies.tumblr.com/

Nice portrait but could you spare us the Mother Jones propaganda?

[r.e.]

Nice portrait but could you spare us the Mother Jones propaganda?

Is that directed at the photographer or the subject?

By the way, here is the photgrapher's web site: http://suzannafinley.com/

[jeroldharter]

Is that directed at the photographer or the subject?

By the way, here is the photgrapher's web site: http://suzannafinley.com/

To the link of the picture with the Mother Jones "information" attached. It runs on like a schizophrenic's manifesto. If you happen to click on it (iPad clumsiness) in some way you get a pop up asking for money.

[r.e.]

To the link of the picture with the Mother Jones "information" attached. It runs on like a schizophrenic's manifesto. If you happen to click on it (iPad clumsiness) in some way you get a pop up asking for money.

Got it. Click on the post under the photo showing income distribution info, get taken to Mother Jones, get presented with donation request.

I kind of get the sense that the photographer is on-side with the cause :)

[Mark Woods]

I've heard on the alternate news outlets that the LAPD is going to attack like the Oakland PD did last night. They know how to do it and just haven't so far. So be careful. Usually the PD do it early in the morning so they meet less resistance.

[r.e.]

Given that it has now come out that one of the Oakland protesters is a two-time Iraq vet who is in hospital with a fractured skull, I'm not sure that the LA police will be in a huge hurry to emulate their brethren in Oakland. But hey, what do I know, I haven't lived in LA for a long time :) Meanwhile, Zuccotti Park continues to be pretty laid back.

[Mark Woods]

Those of you who don't like the politics should think about the Iraqi vet who came back whole after 36 months protecting the country to be shot by the Oakland PD. His position should be thought about if not respected.

[sully75]

Those of you who don't like the politics should think about the Iraqi vet who came back whole after 36 months protecting the country to be shot by the Oakland PD. His position should be thought about if not respected.

He gets my respect. From the sound of things, it sounds like he has a pretty serious/life threatening head injury. Pretty ironic that the guy survives a war for his country and then gets seriously injured by the police while acting peacefully.

[ecoleica]

Hey all this is one of my first posts on this forum and I have only been shooting on my 4x5 for a month or so. I shot this portrait while walking around the 'Occupy the Octagon' protest that is happening in my town of Dunedin, New Zealand. This was shot on a Horseman LE with a 210mm lens. I used Tmax 100 120 film (still wating on the sheet film tank).

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6057/6249245426_4d4e52b940_b.jpg

I hope you like it

[Allen in Montreal]

The LA Times quotes the police chief as saying he would move for the moment,

for public relations reasons

I don't have the link right now, but I am sure you can find it.




I've heard on the alternate news outlets that the LAPD is going to attack like the Oakland PD did last night. They know how to do it and just haven't so far. So be careful. Usually the PD do it early in the morning so they meet less resistance.

[E. von Hoegh]

He gets my respect. From the sound of things, it sounds like he has a pretty serious/life threatening head injury. Pretty ironic that the guy survives a war for his country and then gets seriously injured by the police while acting peacefully.
Police using "non-lethal" weapons, no less.:mad:

[tgtaylor]

I shot almost a roll of Neopan 135 at the Occupy Oakland encampment last Saturday. I haven't developed the roll yet as I thought that I would finish it when the police moved-in to eject the campers. But the police made their move the night that I was out of town.

Occupy Oakland is calling for a gathering/demonstration in front of City Hall this afternoon at 5pm. I would go but the sixth game of the World Series starts at 4:30pm unless cancelled again because of rain. It's been a great Series so far and I have managed to watch the games so far despite being pressed with other matters.

Meanwhile the San Francisco police massed in the early morning hours to move on the Occupy San Francisco group but suddenly changed their minds at around 5am. MAybe they sensed the earthquake that struck at 5:36am.

Thomas

[mdm]

He must have doubled as Graham Henry at the Dunedin dissapointment parade?


Hey all this is one of my first posts on this forum and I have only been shooting on my 4x5 for a month or so. I shot this portrait while walking around the 'Occupy the Octagon' protest that is happening in my town of Dunedin, New Zealand. This was shot on a Horseman LE with a 210mm lens. I used Tmax 100 120 film (still wating on the sheet film tank).



I hope you like it

[Hugo Zhang]

I've heard on the alternate news outlets that the LAPD is going to attack like the Oakland PD did last night. They know how to do it and just haven't so far. So be careful. Usually the PD do it early in the morning so they meet less resistance.

I was planning to bring a tent and a sleeping bag and my Graflex Super D. Now I guess I have to order a new item to prepare for the worst:

http://www.amazon.com/Israeli-Civilian-Mask-Nato-Filter/dp/B0002XJ2OU

Oh, and a helmet.

[Brian C. Miller]

Yeah, you'll need that if you want to stand out there with no effect. But otherwise it's just a serious nuisance. You can still operate the camera, no problem. The biggest problem is some nut with no aim throwing a rock. Bicycle helmets are good enough for that.

I'm almost done developing what I shot weekend before last, only eight more sheets to go. I got all the roll film done. And there's a local "Occupy..." bunch that just started hanging out by the court house. I got home late, so I didn't have time to go photograph them.

[Allen in Montreal]

I was planning to bring a tent and a sleeping bag and my Graflex Super D. Now I guess I have to order a new item to prepare for the worst:

http://www.amazon.com/Israeli-Civilian-Mask-Nato-Filter/dp/B0002XJ2OU

Oh, and a helmet.

Hugo,

These masks are very hard to photograph with. Last resort only.
Try to find an old Canadian army mask, they filter better (longer per canister), the filter is set off to the side, not hanging in front, and the glass opening are perfectly square with the user's eyes, making shooting much easier.

A lot of TV cameramen have gone to a fireman's style mask, which is great, but much more $$$

If you go for a helmet, don't get an all black colored helmet, the cops might mistake you for a Black Block type, which would not be a good thing.
As with every demo these days, there is always a small group that tries to hijack the event and get violent, just to be violent.
Until event participants like this (Occupy) start actually seizing these few thugs and tossing them over to the cops there is always the risk it will get crazy and you don't want to be dressed like them.
(that said, it looked like the Oakland cops just want to crack a few heads as much as the few "black block" wanted to smash stuff, so you just never know what will happen when the masses get caught between the 2 sides).

When I drove by Occupy MTL today, there was one cop, sitting a 1/4 block away, just watching. That was it for police presence.
I think you will start to see "flash mob" demos, and the cops here just want to watch for a quick assembly of the group.

[Axon990]

I took my 3x4 Anniversary Speed out, loaded with Efke PL 25 orthochromatic film. I'm fairly pleased with these three, although I haven't quite gotten the hang of tray developing large batches.

http://i.imgur.com/TSx8Q.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Vthja.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/OEwHV.jpg
I kind of missed the focus on this because I was shooting wide open. Oh well, this is how we learn.

If anyone has any tips on how to better shoot moving crowds with LF, I'd be glad to hear them.

[redrockcoulee]

Hugo,

These masks are very hard to photograph with. Last resort only.
Try to find an old Canadian army mask, they filter better (longer per canister), the filter is set off to the side, not hanging in front, and the glass opening are perfectly square with the user's eyes, making shooting much easier.

A lot of TV cameramen have gone to a fireman's style mask, which is great, but much more $$$

If you go for a helmet, don't get an all black colored helmet, the cops might mistake you for a Black Block type, which would not be a good thing.
As with every demo these days, there is always a small group that tries to hijack the event and get violent, just to be violent.
Until event participants like this (Occupy) start actually seizing these few thugs and tossing them over to the cops there is always the risk it will get crazy and you don't want to be dressed like them.
(that said, it looked like the Oakland cops just want to crack a few heads as much as the few "black block" wanted to smash stuff, so you just never know what will happen when the masses get caught between the 2 sides).

When I drove by Occupy MTL today, there was one cop, sitting a 1/4 block away, just watching. That was it for police presence.
I think you will start to see "flash mob" demos, and the cops here just want to watch for a quick assembly of the group.

Yes the Canadian masks are though not comfortable can be worn when photographing or videotaping. Fairly good vision and the canisters must work. No, never in a riot but did work in counter terrorist training when live agent (in very small doses) was in play.

[Edwin Beckenbach]

Occupy Los Angeles
4x5 crop, 150mm Sironar-S, f22 4 minutes

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/393227_2542643001865_1127410661_33020006_1218561683_n.jpg

[Brian C. Miller]

I kind of missed the focus on this because I was shooting wide open. Oh well, this is how we learn.

If anyone has any tips on how to better shoot moving crowds with LF, I'd be glad to hear them.

The best thing to do is use a fast film, and then stop down. Unless you have an accurate rangefinder on your camera, it will always be a guess. For myself, I would first use GG to focus before they started marching, and then stop down and run along.

[eddie]

Occupy Los Angeles
4x5 crop, 150mm Sironar-S, f22 4 minutes


great image!

better hurry. "da man" is coming for the occupiers!

[Ari]

Wondering if I can get some feedback from anybody here.
I just finished a few days at "Occupy Ottawa", taking some portraits.
Initially, I simply went to see who was still there; as I progressed, I tried to figure out what I was doing there, much like the protesters themselves.
Here's the link:
http://www.aritapiero.com/occupy-ottawa.html

Thanks in advance.

[r.e.]

I like the photograph of the police officer on a park bench. Which park? Looks like somewhere by the bike path on the Rideau Canal close to downtown.

A very different scene from what I've seen at Zuccotti.

[jeroldharter]

Nice work. If you were to back up 40 years this group of portraits could be depicting the de-institutionalization of state psychiatric hospitals.

[Ari]

Nice work. If you were to back up 40 years this group of portraits could be depicting the de-institutionalization of state psychiatric hospitals.

:):):)

[Ari]

I like the photograph of the police officer on a park bench. Which park? Looks like somewhere by the bike path on the Rideau Canal close to downtown.

A very different scene from what I've seen at Zuccotti.

Thanks; it's Confederation Park, on Elgin street.

[E. von Hoegh]

Nice work. If you were to back up 40 years this group of portraits could be depicting the de-institutionalization of state psychiatric hospitals.
#22 makes me say to myself, "I will hug him and pet him and call him George":)

[Ari]

#22 makes me say to myself, "I will hug him and pet him and call him George":)

Do you mean the second photo, or are you referring to something else entirely?
My apologies if it's the latter.

[r.e.]

Do you mean the second photo, or are you referring to something else entirely?
My apologies if it's the latter.

I think that he's actually referring to photo 21, the one with the guy with the mouse. Not clear which will be George :)

[Ari]

I think that he's actually referring to photo 21, the one with the guy with the mouse. Not clear which will be George :)

Thanks for clarifying.
Why don't we call them both George? :)

[r.e.]

Ari,

Don't mean to trivialize this.

I think that Bloomberg is fueling this and I have nothing but respect for the people who demonstrated in New York today.

I think that your photograph of the police officer, wearing poppy, talking with a demonstrator, is very good, and that your series raises some interesting questions about why this exercise of civil disobedience is leading, in New York, to violent crackdowns by the authorities.

[Ari]

Well, thank you, r.e.; that was taken on Remembrance Day, just a snapshot of the campsite that I took as filler material for the portraits.

[r.e.]

Well, thank you, r.e.; that was taken on Remembrance Day, just a snapshot of the campsite that I took as filler material for the portraits.

For what it is worth, I think that it is far and away the best of the series, and potentially an important photograph when the story of this movement gets told. It is one of the most striking photographs that I have seen in relation to this movement, and opposite to what is now going on with police behaviour in New York.

[r.e.]

Ari,

I sent a friend the URL for your photos this afternoon, who in turn wrote a Tweet about what happened at UC Davis in which he gave a link to your photos. His Tweet has now been Re-Tweeted by a single Twitter user to 1400 people. I suspect that it is going to get re-tweeted from there. Will send you details by personal message.

[Ari]

Rory, I pmed you, but I wanted to add my thanks once again.

[r.e.]

Ari,

Hey, this is interesting. Four more Re-Tweets, not big ones, but in four hours, the link to your photos has now gone to 1700 people.

[r.e.]

In tomorrow's Sunday New York Times, Robert Hass, age 70, former Poet Laureate of the United States, on being beaten with a billy club at UC Berkley ten days ago: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/20/opinion/sunday/at-occupy-berkeley-beat-poets-has-new-meaning.html?pagewanted=all?src=tp

If the moderators feel that offering this link is political, please feel free to delete. Given who Mr. Hass is, I just thought that there might be some interest in reading what he has to say. There's some fine writing in this piece.

[Jan Pedersen]

With all due respect i think there is way to much fat between the meat in this piece of writing, not unsurpricing coming from a poet.
I do have sympathy for the movement but as it developed here in Portland OR it was basically a group of homeless people getting together for the ride with very little leadership. The Mayor who himself need someone with strenght and knowledge close by to keep him a leader tried to take a sensible approach from the beginning but in the end had to serve the 99% Anything wrong with that?

[Ari]

Ari,

Hey, this is interesting. Four more Re-Tweets, not big ones, but in four hours, the link to your photos has now gone to 1700 people.

Thanks, Rory.
Wow, tekmology, eh?

[r.e.]

http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/11/16/faces-and-voices-from-zuccotti-park/

http://www.99facesofoccupywallst.org/#2277666/by-August-Bradley

[jeroldharter]

What a bunch of garbage. At least it is digital and they are not wasting film on it. Like an opotheosis of a Diane Arbus freak show.

[Jim Michael]

Looks like a cross section of who I see walking around Manhattan. Welcome to the 21st century.

[r.e.]

What a bunch of garbage.

For what it's worth, the photographer received a Hasselblad Masters award in 2008, and one of his photographs was selected for the cover of the annual book associated with the awards: http://www.hasselblad.com/masters-2008.aspx

His web site and blog contain some interesting technical material as well as his photographs: http://AugustBradley.com

[Brian C. Miller]

What a bunch of garbage. At least it is digital and they are not wasting film on it.

Can there ever be a waste of film?

I really wish that it had been shot on film instead of digital capture. I would absolutely love to see film supported as rabidly as any of these demonstrations. Life magazine published 100 Photographs That Changed the World (http://astore.amazon.com/lico04-20/detail/1931933847), and I don't think that there's a single digital capture in there.

There is no waste of film. After all, once upon a time Kodak's sales were 95% snapshots, 5% motion picture film. There was Techpan, even in 8x10. There was HIE. And now Kodak's film sales are 95% motion picture film and 5% snapshots. We band together to purchase film in $15,000 lots. The winds are cold, and the wolves howl. The little film girl begs upon the street. Come the cold, harsh morning, somebody will happen by, flick out a cell phone, and tweet, "fownd X-( gal QL" and attach a blurry 640x480 snap.

[Ari]

What a bunch of garbage. At least it is digital and they are not wasting film on it. Like an opotheosis of a Diane Arbus freak show.

I think he did a pretty good job.

[Robert Budding]

For what it's worth, the photographer received a Hasselblad Masters award in 2008, and one of his photographs was selected for the cover of the annual book associated with the awards: http://www.hasselblad.com/masters-2008.aspx

His web site and blog contain some interesting technical material as well as his photographs: http://AugustBradley.com

Awards or not, his portraits look way over-processed to me.

[Ari]

Awards or not, his portraits look way over-processed to me.

Perhaps, but would be overlooking the good work he did as a portraitist.

[jb7]

Nice work. If you were to back up 40 years this group of portraits could be depicting the de-institutionalization of state psychiatric hospitals.


What a bunch of garbage. At least it is digital and they are not wasting film on it. Like an opotheosis of a Diane Arbus freak show.


What vile comments. I presume, if you were to back up more than 40 years, you'd find the 'doctors' who were more than willing to lock those people up in the first place, perhaps based on no more than the prejudice of how they looked, compared to how someone supposed they should look. Maybe some other prejudices as well, shape of a skull, for example. Wouldn't it be great to be able to go back to the good old days, for tips on how to deal with this 'garbage'?

I thought this was a photography forum? Nice series of pictures Ari, I just don't get how someone could make such a withering condemnation of the people in them, individually, or as a group, and particularly on a photography forum, where a level of sophistication in viewing pictures might be expected. Although you seemed to give the comment a tacit approval...

I'd be less likely to post portraits online, if I thought the sitters were to suffer personal abuse in this manner. Criticize the photography, fine, but comments like those above are disturbing. It would be terrifying if someone like that had the power to commit people, based on this level of judgement.

I should set out to take a few pictures of our own little occupation on Dame St. ...

[Ari]

No, Joseph, no tacit approval, but perhaps my response was not clear.
I read "What a bunch of garbage" and responded with "I think he did a pretty good job"; I just ignored the Arbus comment.

To give approval, tacit or otherwise, of such a comment (the "freak show"), would be shooting myself in the foot, and disrespecting the people who helped me make my own photographs.

But don't let naysayers stop you from posting anything; there are rude people everywhere, as much on the street as on internet forums.

[jb7]

Thanks for the clarification Ari, sorry, I'm not good at deciphering smileys... well, except for the actually smiley ones-

Your pictures do show a great deal of respect and they portray a sense of dignity- however, I can't understand why anyone would want to make the comments I quoted- even if they actually believed them...

[Ari]

Your pictures do show a great deal of respect and they portray a sense of dignity- however, I can't understand why anyone would want to make the comments I quoted- even if they actually believed them...

Thanks, Joseph; as to why, I don't know.
Some don't know the difference between constructive criticism and jackass-ery.

[onnect17]

What a bunch of garbage. At least it is digital and they are not wasting film on it. Like an opotheosis of a Diane Arbus freak show.

DITTO. Dios los cria y el diablo los reune.

[jeroldharter]

I wasn't talking about Ari's photos. I was talking about the links that r.e. posted. I did not make that clear, although I doubt that would make a difference. This in regard to my "garbage" comment.

I would contrast John Sexton's Places of Power photographs with the street photos of the pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle "occupiers" with incoherent personal statements that l loosely translate as socialist/anarchist nonsense. Sexton's photos depict the greatness of man, the photos on the link depict the baseness and regression of man. I suspect the the linked occupy photos won't result in many coffee table books. But maybe they could be burned in trash cans for heat.

[jeroldharter]

What vile comments. I presume, if you were to back up more than 40 years, you'd find the 'doctors' who were more than willing to lock those people up in the first place, perhaps based on no more than the prejudice of how they looked, compared to how someone supposed they should look. Maybe some other prejudices as well, shape of a skull, for example. Wouldn't it be great to be able to go back to the good old days, for tips on how to deal with this 'garbage'?
.....
Criticize the photography, fine, but comments like those above are disturbing. It would be terrifying if someone like that had the power to commit people, based on this level of judgement.

...

I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.

I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities.

I am not sure you understand our current commitment laws. No person can be committed on another's whim. Commitments, unlike occupy protestors, are governed by laws and always subject to judicial review. Full commitments are relatively rare, uncommonly exceed 6 months, and are mostly out-patient.

[r.e.]

Yesterday, The New Yorker published this piece on how Occupy Wall Street happened, from its beginnings in Vancouver and Berkeley, and especially the role of the magazine Adbuster, to the takeover of Zuccotti Park. It's from the New Yorker's new issue, but is unlocked and can be read in its entirety: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2011/11/28/111128fa_fact_schwartz

I don't know how many people know this, but Brookfield Properties, which owns Zuccotti Park and which has its office tower directly across the street, is not an American/Wall Street company. It is an old Canadian company, based originally in Montreal and now headquartered in Toronto and New York. It got its start in hockey, having built Toronto's Garden's Arena and the Montreal Forum. It owned the Montreal Canadians Hockey Club until 1976. For more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brookfield_Office_Properties

[r.e.]

I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.

I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities.

I am not sure you understand our current commitment laws. No person can be committed on another's whim. Commitments, unlike occupy protestors, are governed by laws and always subject to judicial review. Full commitments are relatively rare, uncommonly exceed 6 months, and are mostly out-patient.

Jerold, when you ask Joseph, from Ireland, whether he has visited many of the US's larger cities lately, which ones are you talking about? The town where you live, population 25,000? The biggest city in your state, population under 600,000?

More importantly, how much time have you spent in Zuccotti Park? Given what you say about the people who were there, and by extension the thousands of New Yorkers who protested the eviction, it's important to know whether you are talking from personal experience.

The reason that I ask is, I spent two days at Zuccotti, and spoke to a lot of people there, and if you went there, we had completely different experiences.

So let me repeat my question. Were you at Zuccotti during the occupation (a simple yes or no will do) and, if so, what led you to the assertions that you make about the people who were there?

Or are you getting your facts from Fox?

[jeroldharter]

No. I was not in New York.

I was recently in San Francisco. I spent some time in Manhattan this summer.

Without impugning Fox, just read the one liner quotes from the occupiers on the links that you posted. Read the text from the article from the New Yorker that you posted.

Just read anything that the Occupy crowd writes or says. They are anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart. It would appear that most are unemployed or else comfortable enough under the currently "unfair system" to take large amounts of time off of from their exploitative jobs to protest.

Interesting that you mention "eviction." Eviction implies legal tenancy which of course never existed. The occupiers were not evicted. They were a mob disbanded. Odd too that a group that denounces the notion of private property would even consider themselves "evicted." I guess they were liberated instead.

[r.e.]

No. I was not in New York.

I was recently in San Francisco. I spent some time in Manhattan this summer.

Without impugning Fox, just read the one liner quotes from the occupiers on the links that you posted. Read the text from the article from the New Yorker that you posted.

Just read anything that the Occupy crowd writes or says. They are anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart. It would appear that most are unemployed or else comfortable enough under the currently "unfair system" to take large amounts of time off of from their exploitative jobs to protest.

Interesting that you mention "eviction." Eviction implies legal tenancy which of course never existed. The occupiers were not evicted. They were a mob disbanded. Odd too that a group that denounces the notion of private property would even consider themselves "evicted." I guess they were liberated instead.

In other words, not having spoken to a single person involved in the Zuccotti Park occupation, you have labelled August Bradley's photographs as "garbage" because they are "like an opotheosis [sic] of a Diane Arbus freak show", you have asserted that the people who occupied Zuccotti Park, whom he photographed, are "mentally ill", and that Zuccotti Park happened because the US will not institutionalize mentally ill people.

The balance of your post mostly demonstrates, if you have read the New Yorker piece as you claim, that you do not understand how the occupation was accomplished, nor what the article says about why these mentally ill people chose Zuccotti Park. If you read the article, it should have been perfectly obvious that the occupiers had some very good legal advice, no doubt, on your view of the world, from lawyers who are also mentally ill.

The alternative possibility is that you are pontificating from Stevens Point, Wisconsin (population 25,000), and not only have no idea what you are talking about, but are exhibiting the kind of thinking that leads to jackboot terrorism.

[Brian Legge]

I went out to Occupy Seattle last month, October 7th I believe. I shot a series in an attempt at documenting the diversity of people there.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6104/6234252153_c979d9a3d5_b.jpg
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6161/6234771970_e9cc51ba70_b.jpg
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6180/6234774296_c225ca1b22_b.jpg
http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6179/6235022988_10b80d7f29_b.jpg

The rest of the series is here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/cannelbrae/sets/72157627965203598

Not all of the photos are excellent but I shot the 12 frames with a specific as a series and decided to post everything.

[jeroldharter]

Sorry about the misspelling. My iPad sometimes takes over.

I realize that we small town bumpkins are stupid and have no valid views unless we are personally present at world events but what can I do? I can't afford the taxes in New York especially with all the police overtime to deal with the occupiers. Maybe I could just camp in someone's back yard and say I am oppressed? Better get some good legal advice first.

The mentally ill and de-institutionalization comments were half joking, but just half. Have you ever been to a state psychiatric hospital? (that is rhetorical.)

I suppose I can read adequately. Per your references, the core of the occupy movement is openly proud to be anti-capitalist, socialistic anarchists whose goal is to destroy our economic system and disrupt the lives of everyone who disagrees. That seems pretty obvious. The ground troops of the occupy movement are not exactly the A-team and the photos that seem to glamorize them (garbage to me, art to some) miss the point.

[Brian Legge]

For reference, I went out to the event above mostly skeptical about the movement.

Most of the people were frustrated with how corporations had as much power as individuals. Many were anti-Obama. Most were upset with how the bailouts were handled and believed companies should have been allowed to go under. Many were speaking against the Federal Reserve and were closer to Ron Paul supporters in rhetoric. My gut reaction was that the protesters actually aligned (for different reasons) with the tea party. Different reasons but a lot of the same actions being discussed.

Yes, there were open socialists there - as well as some homeless and mentally disturbed but many of those people could be found at the same plaza any day. With the protest going on they were getting donating clothes, food, etc. There were also a lot of proud but frustrated Americans who felt like neither political party represented their views and that special interests held more sway than they believed was right.

[Brian C. Miller]

Just read anything that the Occupy crowd writes or says. They are anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart. It would appear that most are unemployed or else comfortable enough under the currently "unfair system" to take large amounts of time off of from their exploitative jobs to protest.

So what? They aren't a waste of film.

Graflex Super Graphic, 135mm Optar, Delta 100, hand-held.

[Brian C. Miller]

And a couple more.
Graflex Super Graphic, 135mm Optar, Delta 100, hand-held.
This is Denny "Park," such as it is. It's a plaza, and the Occupy Seattle movement moved over to Seattle Community College, and they've been now told to go away.

A few of these came out good, and some didn't. I didn't have a tripod with me because it would have been too much on the bus.

[Ari]

I, too, went with a skeptical eye, but an open mind.
Yes, there were hangers-on, homeless people along for the ride and other non-protesters.
But there were also some thoughtful, well-meaning people who had been camping out in the cold, who never made the news, because they weren't a "good story".
I wish they had a clearer, more focused agenda; there are many reasons today to protest, to take over a park, and to speak out, but unless a clear thought emerges from this movement, I think it will self-destruct.
And I don't think that's a good thing.

[MIke Sherck]

Love your portraits, Brian! Sensitive and interesting. Thanks for sharing!

Mike

[redrockcoulee]

On this thread and else where on the net there has been not only photos showing the diversity of the people at those occupy sites but a great diversity of styles of photography as well. I thank those who have posted their images. I live in a small city that does not have as much diversity of people as the larger centres as well does not have the diversity of ilks that plague other places.

[Edwin Beckenbach]

A few from last week. All from 4x5 Portra 160.

[onnect17]

Back from "Occupy Boston". Got the digital to take a couple of images. Nothing worth turning the camera on. Not even a small British flag (ironic) or the "FU Bitch" graffiti style written on one of the tents.

[jb7]

Some more good pictures going on there- particularly like those dangerous looking socialists in the 'Global Revolution' one... and the family too. Happy thanksgiving...



I would contrast John Sexton's Places of Power photographs with the street photos of the pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle "occupiers" with incoherent personal statements that l loosely translate as socialist/anarchist nonsense. Sexton's photos depict the greatness of man, the photos on the link depict the baseness and regression of man. I suspect the the linked occupy photos won't result in many coffee table books. But maybe they could be burned in trash cans for heat.


Why would you do that? So now you're a book burner too? Figures...

That Sexton thing, a non sequitur, apropos of nothing.
Photography can do more than glorify achievement, and its end result does not have to be as part of a stack of books on a coffee table, no matter how comforting that world might be for you. Aspirational fairy tale books have their place, but having a place to put a coffee table might be equally aspirational. Regarding the baseness of man, aren't the majority of people only one paycheck away from the streets? Just what is capitalism doing for those that have no capital? How can you expect people with no capital to stand up for the system that makes you rich? Do you also think they should put your self interest in front of their own?

There are no people in that book you mentioned. Rather, they've all moved aside so the picture can be taken. Tidier like that, I suppose.




I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.



Is there something in your training that provides you with the insight to be able to identify, from a photograph, a homeless mentally ill person? Or is it just innate prejudice, because it's quicker? I'd love to be able to catch a glimpse of the results of your Rorschach test, maybe they would flag a few more of your time savers. By the way, are the conditions mutually inclusive? That is, if you saw someone from one of those photographs, would you make the double assumption that they were both homeless and mentally ill?




I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities. …




Just read anything that the Occupy crowd writes or says. They are anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart. It would appear that most are unemployed or else comfortable enough under the currently "unfair system" to take large amounts of time off of from their exploitative jobs to protest.



Just what are you trying to say? Now you have me confused. First you say "the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people" and you go to a lot of trouble to depict photographs of the protesters as being of garbage, freak shows- impossible to distinguish from evictees from asylums- (no, you don't need to legally occupy to be evicted from somewhere). Then, in your very next thought, you decide that they're "anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionaries at heart." So which is it, or is that less important than spreading the fear and the hatred?
How about joining up all your thoughts, and calling them homeless, mentally ill, anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionary, pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle "occupiers" with incoherent personal statements? Except now I feel more sorry for them than scared…

I did make it over to America in the summer, but had to leave after a couple of days, due to a bereavement. I had been scheduled to visit NYC, Austin TX, Albuquerque NM, as well as touring NY and New England. Next time. I've previously visited NYC, Chicago, LA and Vegas. And Mexico City, but that was a few years ago now. So I have an idea what a big city is.

As a tourist, I can't say what my reaction would have been, but we have the obscenity of homelessness here too- in Ireland of all places- an obscenity because the Irish people now own all the properties that those giants of Capitalism, the Speculators and the Banks, used to bankrupt the country. Billions locked up in buildings and on deposit, and people sleeping on the street.

We're still being shafted by the EU, they'll get their money back, with interest, and our own government will collaborate by facilitating the smooth transfer of funds from the austerity imposed on the people (who didn't cause this problem, didn't gamble or piss it away) into the coffers of the Banks and Big Business. The Ratings agencies, the same ones who gave us a clean bill of health at the height of the bubble, those gangsters and crooks, are still there, creaming off the same vig. The Markets, that playground of capitalism, are always the winners, taking the cut, going up or going down.

Those homeless mentally ill people? They have as much right as anyone to be on the streets protesting, maybe more- not that I want to over-simplify, but the anti-psychotics sold by 'Big Pharma' don't really do them much good, they're more about controlling the patient than curing- not that those in the caring professions care much about those with no means to pay. Psychiatry doesn't need to find a cure, after all. On the contrary, it probably contributes to the problem, to mentalism, probably always has.

Your comments on the photographs, to give you the benefit of the doubt, are ambiguous- less charitably, careless. In my gut I can't help but feel that it is the people you regard as the garbage, the freak show. Having an alternative view leaves me open to being loudly rubbished as that most base animal, a liberal. Naive, at that. Fill your boots. I would hate to have someone sneer at the subject of a picture that I posted on the internet, I'd feel that I'd failed the subject- unless I'd obviously expected to elicit such a reaction, for some reason- I'd feel I'd let them down.

So, what would you call someone who is 'obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices, especially one exhibiting intolerance, and animosity toward those of differing beliefs'? Might it be a psychiatric disorder? Or is it just normative behaviour...


Apologies for the lengthy post- next time i'll just post a picture.


joseph

[jeroldharter]

That was a bit long...

"What is capitalism doing for people with no capital?" People with no capital? Is that not the goal of the occupiers anyway? The assumption that any private property is an ill-gotten gain at the expense of another. If they have no capital they should rejoice in their achievement rather than clamoring to take the capital of others. Interesting that you ask if they should subjugate their self interest to that of another. Of course not, but the basis of their ideology is that self interest is inherently wrong. I am not sure why you think I am rich. I am not, but have worked to save money, invest in free markets, and made short term sacrifices for long term gains. Certainly not "occupy" ideals but traditional American values. I don't know why you imply that I don't care about poor mentally I'll people. I spent all Thanksgving day doing just that.

I guess there is something in my training that I can identify hopelessly mentally I'll people with some reliability. For example, a man covered in filth, shirtless, unshaven, mumbling to a garbage can while digging for cigarette butts next to his shopping cart filled with random junk are subtle clues. Similar to the stigmata of liver failure. Does not take much to pick an end stage alcoholic out of a crowd.

I can't say much about the Irish economy except that the E.U. has always been a bad idea. If your banks are like ours, they are not exactly doing well. If you think they are then invest in them.

Your understanding of psychiatry appears limited. Say what you want about "big Pharma" ( should we aspire to little Pharma?). They are responsible for huge improvements in the treatment of mental illness, especially psychosis. The homeless psychotic people you see are rarely medication failures. They are the consequences of strict commitment limitations and the patient's own refusal to accept treatment and/or persuit of drug abuse. You might be surprised how many people accept disability payments for psychiatric disability while refusing to treat it, and then accept public assistance to pay for their inevitable hospitalization and sundry life travesties.

Just to be clear, again. I was not commenting on any of the photos posted here. I was referring to the photos in the links. But I am surprised that you are offended by my "protest" of those photos! I thought protesting was all the rage.

[redrockcoulee]

I was referring to the apparent failure of deinstitutionalization given that many of the photos could just as easily depict the homeless mentally ill crowd as they could an "occupy" protest if not labelled as such.

I don't know if you have visited many of our large cities lately, but the downtowns are filled with homeless mentally ill people. These are the same people who would have been hospitalized years ago when treatments were not very effective or well tolerated. But commitment laws and resources are different now, so they wander aimlessly or mischievously around our cities.

I am not sure you understand our current commitment laws. No person can be committed on another's whim. Commitments, unlike occupy protestors, are governed by laws and always subject to judicial review. Full commitments are relatively rare, uncommonly exceed 6 months, and are mostly out-patient.

And those photos could have just as easily been of the tradespeople and research scientists or even soldiers where I work. They are truly lovely portraits, I wished mine turned out as well but then I am more of a landscape photographer with no people in them. But that does not mean I cannot appreciate other types of images, especially ones of what I hope turns to be an important time.

But you are right, we do not have the resources anymore for the mentally ill or anyone else who needs them now a days. Nor the tolerance for them either.:(

[kev curry]

Great post Joseph, very clear. It was transparent from the start that deep ideological opposition to the Occupy movement lay behind the attack on the work of Bradley.

[jb7]

I guess there is something in my training that I can identify hopelessly mentally I'll people with some reliability. For example, a man covered in filth, shirtless, unshaven, mumbling to a garbage can while digging for cigarette butts next to his shopping cart filled with random junk are subtle clues. Similar to the stigmata of liver failure. Does not take much to pick an end stage alcoholic out of a crowd.

[...]


Just to be clear, again. I was not commenting on any of the photos posted here. I was referring to the photos in the links. But I am surprised that you are offended by my "protest" of those photos! I thought protesting was all the rage.


No, still can't find those pictures, here or in the links. Guess your special training is quite 'special'. Strange, because your comments read like you're talking about a whole swathe of people in the photographs. Care to point them out for us?

Right, I'm done here. You're right, my knowledge of psychiatry is quite limited, thank god. I'm confident of one important fact, however, the knowledge that someone like you is writing psychiatric reports on people makes my blood run cold.


joseph

[Rick Tardiff]

people are scarce around rural Maine, I did manage to find two people. I used my ebony rw45, 150mm lens, tmax400 processed in ilford chemicals. Scanned with epson V700.

[jeroldharter]

http://lens.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/11/16/faces-and-voices-from-zuccotti-park/

http://www.99facesofoccupywallst.org/#2277666/by-August-Bradley

I will invoke my special powers that make your blood run cold and repost the links of the photos for you.

[jeroldharter]

Great post Joseph, very clear. It was transparent from the start that deep ideological opposition to the Occupy movement lay behind the attack on the work of Bradley.

As opposed to the "deep ideological" sympathy toward the movement that leads to such admiration of relatively basic photos?

Some photographers are like politicians, racing to any disaster or crisis to find poster children for their political causes. Sorry if I don't see the genius in that.

[r.e.]

As opposed to the "deep ideological" sympathy toward the movement that leads to such admiration of relatively basic photos?

Some photographers are like politicians, racing to any disaster or crisis to find poster children for their political causes. Sorry if I don't see the genius in that.

Jerold,

I provided the links to Bradley's photographs without comment. I think that his framework for these photographs is interesting, that the way he processed the images is interesting and that his web site, including the more technical aspects of the site, are worth looking at. I have come to no judgment about his work (I have some reservations about the way that they are processed), which is precisely why I offered the links without comment, and your suggestion that I have "deep ideological" sympathy toward the movement and "admiration" for Mr. Bradley's work are assertions that have no basis in anything that I said.

Here's what we have so far:

You have attacked all of the people in Mr. Bradley's photographs, and indeed all of the people engaged in the Occupy Wall Street movement, to borrow from Joseph's post, as "homeless, mentally ill, anti-capitalist, socialist, anarchist revolutionary, pierced, tattooed, unkempt, idle 'occupiers' with incoherent personal statements".

You have asserted that Mr. Bradley made his series of photographs because he also has an anti-capitalist, socialist, if not anarchist, revolutionary agenda, and that he used the people that he photographed as "poster children" to advance his agenda.

You have attacked me for offering a link to Mr. Bradley's photographs on the ground that doing so is evidence that I have "deep ideological sympathy toward the movement" that has led to "admiration" for Mr. Bradley's photographs.

Right.

Now, here's a question. How come you are attacking Mr. Bradley and the people that he photographed on these grounds, and me for providing a link to Mr. Bradley's work, but have made a point of saying that your comments apply to none of the many photographers who participate in this forum who have posted Occupy Wall Street photographs to this thread, nor to any of the photographs that they took?

[jeroldharter]

R.e.,

I never mentioned you personally. I was talking about the photos from the links themselves and my opinions about them. Sorry I gave you offense, especially since you have no opinions about them. I am not attacking you or anyone. I am offering my opinion about material discussed/presented here. I suppose you are as well (implicitly) by the information you provide even "without comment."

Don't you think that the photos involved offer a viewpoint? If not, how could they be of interest to anyone? I don't know why Mr. Bradley made those photos. How could I? But the same qualities of them that interested you enough to post the links interested me enough to comment on them.

I am not "attacking" anyone. I am calling the occupiers exactly what they call themselves. Read your own links about the organizers. They are proud to be socialist rabble rousers who live to destroy or at least disrupt our economic system and constitutional government. That is not really a secret at this point. My comments about mental illness in relation to some of the protesters were half joking-but clearly struck a cord. I meant no offense to the mentally ill, only the protesters.

[Ben Syverson]

Let's keep it apolitical, or this whole thread will go south.

[kev curry]

Mr Harter, I don't want to get into this primarily because I don't want to jeopardise this thread.
I will say this, I find your views and your attitudes abhorrent and even more disturbing given your profession. You provide further confirmation of my already dim view of psychiatry.

''The style is the man''

[onnect17]

Mr Harter, I don't want to get into this primarily because I don't want to jeopardise this thread.
I will say this, I find your views and your attitudes abhorrent and even more disturbing given your profession. You provide further confirmation of my already dim view of psychiatry.

''The style is the man''

I interpret Mr. Harter comments differently. He has a more accurate and compassioned view of the homeless than any of us, regardless of any political view. I also think it’s kind of “low” to use the homeless as a “filler”. So much for human values of the occupiers. Like they say: “Dime de que alardeas y te dire de que careces”

I'm waiting for the first snow storm. Then I'll bring the camera and a cup of coffee. I can't wait! :)

[r.e.]

João Canziani's 99 Portraits:

http://ninetynineportraits.com/#/ninetynine
http://lpvmagazine.com/2011/11/joao-canziani-99/

Quite a scene at Lincoln Center last night. Phillip Glass, Lou Reed and Laurie Anderson addressed Occupy Wall Street Protestors, and departing opera goers who crossed police barricades to join them, at the conclusion of a performance of Glass's opera Satyagraha:

http://www.therestisnoise.com/2011/12/the-satyagraha-protest.html
http://www.theawl.com/2011/12/at-satyagraha-and-occupy-lincoln-center

[Ari]

Not bad.
These guys were fortunate to have 99 photos from which to choose.
I went almost every day for 2 weeks, and got maybe 25 people in total.

[r.e.]

For those who might be interested, http://archive.org has just put out a call for material on the Occupy movement: http://blog.archive.org/