View Full Version : Linhof Technika recessed lens board and fresnel question.
Hi all,
I finally had my new bellows, ground glass and fresnel screen installed in the Technika V I'm doing up. All looks great and the new accessories are making the world of difference to the camera's usability and feel. I have also acquired a recessed lens board for my 90mm SA F8 and had the lens mounted in it.
But...
I have two questions regarding these items that might or might not have obvious answers, so here goes...
1: When my S.A. is mounted in the recessed board, it is very difficult to open and close the lens for preview and picture taking. In fact it's a real mission as my lens, which is mounted in a Compur 0 shutter, only has a little metal switch much smaller than the big plastic switch on my Nikkor W with Copal 0 shutter. How do people get around this? Or is my lens missing a part? It's almost like I'll have to use my car keys to switch between settings as my fingers are just too big to operate it without fear of moving the front standard. Are there any tips to deal with this if it's a normal "problem"?
2: The new fresnel and ground glass is much brighter and finer than the stock parts I received with the camera. My only concern is that the fresnel bows out slightly from the ground glass the further it gets from the clips that hold it in. I'd say it's only bowing a maximum of a millimeter each side, probably less, but it's noticeable. Is this a problem or is it normal? I expected both parts to sit exactly flush like on the Horseman 45FA. The ground glass is sitting perfectly, it's just the fresnel I'm concerned about.
As a side note, the bellow I ordered of a Chinese seller on ebay seem to be of very high quality and the technician that installed them said they have four rather thick layers of material vs. less (I think he said three?) on the original Linhof bellow. Due to the extra thickness of each fold, the camera is difficult to fold up and will require breaking in. He said he's installed the same bellow before and it took some time to break in but eventually began to sit and fold properly.
Thanks,
Tim
Hi all,
I have also acquired a recessed lens board for my 90mm SA F8 and had the lens mounted in it.
1: When my S.A. is mounted in the recessed board, it is very difficult to open and close the lens for preview and picture taking. In fact it's a real mission as my lens, which is mounted in a Compur 0 shutter, only has a little metal switch much smaller than the big plastic switch on my Nikkor W with Copal 0 shutter. How do people get around this? Or is my lens missing a part? It's almost like I'll have to use my car keys to switch between settings as my fingers are just too big to operate it without fear of moving the front standard. Are there any tips to deal with this if it's a normal "problem"?
Hi Tim,
I am exactly the same position as you. Just last week I mounted my 65mm SA ( Compur) in a Shen Hao recessed board, to switch the lever is a big nuisance (closing it I do by pressing the shutter). I resort having a small thin pen with me, so I can flip it open. I guess a Copal which has a bigger switch will work less difficult. This weekend I was shooting with some friends, and one of them showed me the Linhof recessed comfort board, this board has a few clever solutions with an extra pointer/lever for the f stop and an "extension" to open and close the lens. These boards are not cheap though, so I would also be interested in an solution for this problem without spending a lot of money on a lens board.
Best,
Cor
Thanks, Cor. Good to know I'm not alone here. I've heard the comfort board mentioned but have noted it's high price – more than a lens in some cases!
Out of interest, are there any other simple accessories I don't know about to help with access to the switch when using the recessed board? Seems a pretty massive design oversight.
Bob Salomon
13-Oct-2011, 04:53
Out of interest, are there any other simple accessories I don't know about to help with access to the switch when using the recessed board? Seems a pretty massive design oversight.
No.
Bugger...
Anyone experienced the fresnel bowing slightly as I described above?
Bob Salomon
14-Oct-2011, 04:42
Sounds like the Fresnel may be a fraction too long. What brand Fresnel did you buy? Is it under the two screwed down black holddown clips or correctly installed under Linhof's old flip-up Fresnel Clips or the current Linhof swing away Fresnel Holders? Both of those systems are designed so the Fresnel can be removed at will by the user without any tools. They also apply no pressure like the screwed down gg hold down clips do.
It's a genuine Linhof fresnel, bought from Linhof & Studio, UK. I had a technician install it at the same time as a new groundglass. It's held in place by two flip up clips.
Sounds like the Fresnel may be a fraction too long. What brand Fresnel did you buy? Is it under the two screwed down black holddown clips or correctly installed under Linhof's old flip-up Fresnel Clips or the current Linhof swing away Fresnel Holders? Both of those systems are designed so the Fresnel can be removed at will by the user without any tools. They also apply no pressure like the screwed down gg hold down clips do.
Bob Salomon
14-Oct-2011, 15:26
It's a genuine Linhof fresnel, bought from Linhof & Studio, UK. I had a technician install it at the same time as a new groundglass. It's held in place by two flip up clips.
That is an older type of holder. Why not ask them to out on a pair of the newer swig-away clips? And have them check the fit of the Fresnel at the same time.
Cool, thanks. I didn't know there was a newer clip system to keep it in place. Will check this week.
Len Eselson
16-Oct-2011, 13:09
No.
Au contraire. Secure a chop stick from your favorite oriental restaurant, cut it down to a convenient size and easily access all the gizmos of your lens. Cheap, durable, effective,...can anything in the Linhoff catalog match this.
Len Eselson
Bob Salomon
16-Oct-2011, 13:27
Au contraire. Secure a chop stick from your favorite oriental restaurant, cut it down to a convenient size and easily access all the gizmos of your lens. Cheap, durable, effective,...can anything in the Linhoff catalog match this.
Len Eselson
Len, There is no Linhoff catalog. Linhoff is a camera repairman in Michigan.
Linhof is a photogrphic manufacturer in Munich and does make cameras and their recessed lensboard also has a cable relese quick socket, surface mounted aperture scales as well as the aperture lever and the press focus control on the face of the board. I don't think the chop sticks will tell you what aperture you selected. It also won't tell you if the press focus is open. But the current Linhof 001015 recessed lens board does.
Len Eselson
16-Oct-2011, 15:31
Len, There is no Linhoff catalog. Linhoff is a camera repairman in Michigan.
Linhof is a photogrphic manufacturer in Munich and does make cameras and their recessed lensboard also has a cable relese quick socket, surface mounted aperture scales as well as the aperture lever and the press focus control on the face of the board. I don't think the chop sticks will tell you what aperture you selected. It also won't tell you if the press focus is open. But the current Linhof 001015 recessed lens board does.
Bob, most abject apologies for misspelling the name of the company. I'll promise to try to do better on the next test. By the way, I have heard that Linhof is a 'photographic' manufacturer in Munich, not a 'photogrphic' one and....
In any case, for 485.95 + shipping (B&H price) I'll continue to peek towards the front of the camera, push things with my chop stick, and take exactly the same picture.
Different strokes for different folks. Peace
Len Eselson
E. von Hoegh
17-Oct-2011, 06:57
Bugger...
Anyone experienced the fresnel bowing slightly as I described above?
Yes. I took it off and gave it away. Haven't used one since about 1988.
I'm getting this way myself. I haven't tried using the fresnel with my 90mm lens yet, but with the 150mm the increase in brightness seems small, maybe half a stop at most.
I didn't realize how much effort LF cameras demand in terms of getting your setup just right for its intended use. It has kind of been driving me crazy! I'm getting there though, soon it will be easy and intuitive shooting like I'm used to.
Yes. I took it off and gave it away. Haven't used one since about 1988.
I have taken a closer look at the fresnel on the camera and it doesn't seem to be sitting flush against the ground glass. The GG is held tightly in place by two brackets and the fresnel is held on top of it by two U shaped clips. Problem is it doesn't sit flush against the GG because of the brackets. To explain, the fresnel is a millimeter or so longer than the space between the brackets so one side naturally sits against the GG while the other sits atop of the opposite bracket. This means there is some distortion, plus I'm thinking the extra space between the GG and fresnel on the raised side makes focusing with the loupe harder. To cut a long question short (sorry for the rambling description!) should all of the fresnel be sitting against the GG or is what I'm describing normal? Hopefully you understand what I'm asking! I'm definitely going bananas!
E. von Hoegh
19-Oct-2011, 06:40
It should be flat and against the GG. Bob Salomon is probably the best guy to tell you precisely what parts you need for the Linhof.
Bob Salomon
19-Oct-2011, 07:07
I think what needs to be done is to take the camera to Linhof in the UK and have them make sure everything is installed correctly.
jan staller
19-Oct-2011, 11:44
I had used an earlier recessed board for a 150mm Symmar, but when I bought the new APO Symmar L, the rear element would not clear the lens board and I had to find a replacement. Bob convinced me to get the Comfort Board, which at near $500.00 was painful, but now that I use it, does speed things up considerably. Compared to using my 80mm lens on an older board, the front mounted aperture markings are very convenient. Everything Linhof is priced like sailboat fittings- if you buy a boat, you have to buy the parts for it. Linhof prices strain the imagination (check out their compendium lens shade), but the utility of their products is unbeatable.
jan staller
19-Oct-2011, 11:52
As for the fresnel lens, I found that I had to remove it for accurate focusing. What have other fresnel users found in their practice? If it isn't a super angulon lens, I don't use a fresnel. The ground glass image of the 80mm Super Symmar is bright and easy to see.
E. von Hoegh
19-Oct-2011, 12:02
I dislike fresnel gadgets. See my post #14, this thread.
Why would you need a recessed board for a 150mm Symmar??
Bob Salomon
19-Oct-2011, 13:52
I dislike fresnel gadgets. See my post #14, this thread.
Why would you need a recessed board for a 150mm Symmar??
First, a Fresnel spreads the light out evenly across the ground glass, if it is a correct one and not something someone modified.
It easily allows one to see into corners of the gg. Something that can be difficult to do without a fresnel.
Second, a recessed board is used with a 150mm on a Technika so the lens can be left on the camera when it is folded for transport.
E. von Hoegh
19-Oct-2011, 13:53
First, a Fresnel spreads the light out evenly across the ground glass, if it is a correct one and not something someone modified.
It easily allows one to see into corners of the gg. Something that can be difficult to do without a fresnel.
Second, a recessed board is used with a 150mm on a Technika so the lens can be left on the camera when it is folded for transport.
Funny. Mine's on a flat board and it folds up just fine.
Adrian Pybus
19-Oct-2011, 14:19
On the preview switch problem. I use a small wooden ice-cream stick.
Bob Salomon
19-Oct-2011, 15:04
Funny. Mine's on a flat board and it folds up just fine.
That's fine for you but the factory recommendation for modern 150mm lenses is the 001015 recessed board and that has been the recommendation since I beag as Product Manager for Linhof in the USA since the late 70s. If you want to ask the factory in Munich please go right ahead.
I think what needs to be done is to take the camera to Linhof in the UK and have them make sure everything is installed correctly.
I live in New Zealand and the local Linhof "importers" (I use quotation marks because they haven't sold anything Linhof for quite some time) quoted me almost $800USD to send it to Munich. Knowing this, you may understand my desire to take things into my own hands.
I've double checked all settings and tried using it out in the field and am starting to get along with the camera now. I tried shooting with and without fresnel and the fresnel does indeed make a massive difference to brightness. At first I didn't think it was the case, but a quick test put an end to any doubt. Huge! My only real concern now is how to get the fresnel flat and if indeed what I am seeing is even a problem, considering it seems to be doing it's job and brightening the corners considerably.
As for the recessed lens board issue, I've taken to just setting the lens on bulb and using the shutter release lock to keep it open. No big deal in the end. I guess in the end LF cameras are a bit like girlfriends, you've got to get to know them before falling in love.
T
Bob Salomon
20-Oct-2011, 02:29
I live in New Zealand and the local Linhof "importers" (I use quotation marks because they haven't sold anything Linhof for quite some time) quoted me almost $800USD to send it to Munich. Knowing this, you may understand my desire to take things into my own hands.
I've double checked all settings and tried using it out in the field and am starting to get along with the camera now. I tried shooting with and without fresnel and the fresnel does indeed make a massive difference to brightness. At first I didn't think it was the case, but a quick test put an end to any doubt. Huge! My only real concern now is how to get the fresnel flat and if indeed what I am seeing is even a problem, considering it seems to be doing it's job and brightening the corners considerably.
As for the recessed lens board issue, I've taken to just setting the lens on bulb and using the shutter release lock to keep it open. No big deal in the end. I guess in the end LF cameras are a bit like girlfriends, you've got to get to know them before falling in love.
T
You can send the camera to Munich, or to any other Linhof distributor, yourself. It does not have to be shipped by your local dealer or distributor. I know that Marflex has serviced cameras sent to him by users in Australia. So NZ would not be an issue. The difference is that cameras from outside the US, purchased outside the US would not qualify for Warranty service in the US.
E. von Hoegh
20-Oct-2011, 08:02
That's fine for you but the factory recommendation for modern 150mm lenses is the 001015 recessed board and that has been the recommendation since I beag as Product Manager for Linhof in the USA since the late 70s. If you want to ask the factory in Munich please go right ahead.
No need to ask Munich. It's just the way they set it up when new.:)
Bob Salomon
20-Oct-2011, 08:15
No need to ask Munich. It's just the way they set it up when new.:)
No it isn't. The lift up Fresnel clips have not been used by Linhof for several years. They have been using silver colored rectangular hold downs that are attached to the middle screws and swing to the side to attach or remove the Fresnel screen.
I think I diagnosed part of the problem. The fresnel is only a small part of the equation in that because it's not perfectly parallel with the GG the image distorts more on one side than the other. This is more noticeable with my 90mm lens and much less with my 150mm. I'm guessing this is because of the increased angle of incidence of light hitting the fresnel lens with wides. Compound this with the fact that the front standards zero detent for swing was a little off. I hadn't noticed before because I'm not used to detents on swing and thought the little leaver was a lock. I'd set the standard to be parallel to the film plane, "locked" it and not realized it had clicked back into the detent. My technician friend is correcting this for me now. Gotta live and learn, I guess!
Finally! All is good in Technika land! The cause of the problem was a slightly bent GG retainer. The techinician managed to find tune the front standard detents so all is parallel to the film plane again while also rectifying the fresnel, which now sits flush with the GG. What a difference! No distortion and 100% sharp grain!
Thanks all for putting up with my silly questions. It has been a long road, but now I'm feeling at home with my V!
T
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