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ThePenguin
12-Oct-2011, 00:40
How do I know which lenses that covers 8x10?

I have the info-list from this site, but that's only a limited number of lenses listed there.

I'm looking for a 210-240mm (8-9"), 300-360mm (12-14") and a longer 500mm (20")

Do I have a lot of options? As said I allready seen the lenses listed in the 8x10list, what other options are there? I shoot a lot of still life.


Thanks!

Leigh
12-Oct-2011, 01:06
The critical parameter for covering any format is the diameter of the lens' image circle. It must be greater than the film diagonal (~325mm for 8x10).

The larger the image circle the better. Having an IC much larger than the film diagonal enables you to use movements like rises/falls and shifts, which are quite common with LF photography.

The second significant parameter is the Flange Focal Length (FFL) of the lens. This is the distance from the front of the lensboard to the film when focused at infinity. With long lenses the FFL is usually shorter than the optical focal length.

The FFL tells you whether or not you can use the lens on a particular camera. Your bellows draw much be greater than the FFL if you expect to focus at infinity, and much longer if you plan to do any closeups.

Both the IC and the FFL are given on the manufacturers' data sheets for modern lenses. Finding those values for vintage lenses may be more of a challenge.

- Leigh

Daniel Stone
12-Oct-2011, 01:08
if you're not planning on shooting at infinity focus at all, Artars and dagors should fit your "to buy" list quite nicely :). I have a 24" Artar for 8x10, but most of my work is at infinity, or close to it. I occasionally do "close ups" with my 8x10 camera, sometimes 1:1. When doing 1:1, remember tha a 12" lens(~300-305mm) will need AT LEAST 600mm(24") of bellows. I use a 300 Fujinon-W. Works great, nice and sharp.

Lenses DESIGNED for 1:1 are usually called "process" lenses, such as Artars, Ronars, etc... They're all great lenses, but don't have HUGE image circles b/c they're usually used at 1:1 or greater magnifications, so the coverage increases exponentially.

-Dan

Leigh
12-Oct-2011, 01:24
Hi Dan,

I agree regarding the Artars. I've never used one, but I understand that they're optimized for 1:1 (roughly), so probably not a first choice for general use.

I must disagree regarding the Dagors. I have a Swiss-made Gold Dot Dagor that's extremely sharp at all distances. In fact I almost never do closeups.

YMMV :D

- Leigh

Daniel Stone
12-Oct-2011, 01:37
Leigh,

Artars: I have 2(a 24" and a 16.5"). Both Red-Dot. BOTH are super good at ALL distances, infinity and close up.
Dagors: I didn't say they don't work well at close distances. Just like Artars, they work well at pretty much all distances in my experience.

-Dan

Michael Graves
12-Oct-2011, 04:39
Like Daniel, I have Artars. Both my 14" and my 19" cover 8x10. The 14 does not give me a whole lot of flexibility for movements. Maybe and inch of rise or fall. The 19 is much more forgiving. These lenses are easily my sharpest lenses. They visibly outperform my 300mm Fujinon in situations where razor sharp edges can be discerned. I don't currently have it at my fingertips, but I have a 5x7 negative of an old paper mill photograghed with the 14" Artar from a distance. On magnification, the texture of individual bricks and the wood grain of the door is easily discerned.

Michael E
12-Oct-2011, 13:05
Maybe this list helps:

http://www.graflex.org/lenses/lens-spec.html

Michael

John NYC
12-Oct-2011, 13:37
What exactly are you looking for in a lens that is not covered by one of those listed in the two lists on the forum? Price? Period style performance/construction?

ThePenguin
13-Oct-2011, 00:51
Mainly price, and also I want to know my other options.

Ken Lee
13-Oct-2011, 06:59
The Fujinon A series are corrected for 1:5 if I recall correctly, which makes them quite good for close work as well as infinity for landscapes.

Because they open to f/9, they are comparatively small and light. At the same time, they cover a rather large area, being of a modified plasmat design, rather than the Dialyte design we find in process lenses.

The 300A, if you can find one, covers 420mm, enough for 11x14. You can read more about it and see some sample photos here (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/index.php#300A).

The 240A also covers 8x10, and like the others in the A series, it's small, light, and sharp. The 360A - if you can find one - is also a top performer and well-suited for 8x10.

Not mentioned are the APO Nikkors, which come barrel-mounted only. That's no problem if you have a camera which will take a Sinar Copal Shutter (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/index.php#SinarShutter). I have a 610mm APO Nikkor which is sharper (http://www.kenleegallery.com/html/tech/Nikkor610Test.html) than I can handle, and was very affordable. If you get a Sinar shutter you can shoot with barrel-mounted lenses which are much cheaper than shutter-mounted lenses. The Sinar Shutter pays for itself, so to speak, very quickly.

John NYC
13-Oct-2011, 09:40
Mainly price, and also I want to know my other options.

If you hunt around around and are not picky on focal length, size, weight or f/stop, you should be able to find something from one of those lists for $250-$350 with good glass but maybe "user" condition otherwise. You could post of WTB with a description like this in the for sale section and see what people come up with for you.

Alan Gales
13-Oct-2011, 16:18
Scott Davis has a Fujinon 250mm f6.7 lens listed in the forum's for sale section for $300.00 on lens board or $275.00 unmounted if you are interested.

John Kasaian
13-Oct-2011, 17:37
IMHO a 9-1/2" Dagor will do a superb job with b&w still lives

John NYC
13-Oct-2011, 19:08
Scott Davis has a Fujinon 250mm f6.7 lens listed in the forum's for sale section for $300.00 on lens board or $275.00 unmounted if you are interested.

I just bought one of these and it is excellent.

ThePenguin
14-Oct-2011, 01:24
Thank you for your help! So far I've bought a Fujinon W 210, I scan ebay every day and will post a WTB on the other focal-lenghts aswell.

E. von Hoegh
14-Oct-2011, 07:32
IMHO a 9-1/2" Dagor will do a superb job with b&w still lives

Plus, it's a damn fine moderate wide on 8x10. A little movement, not much.
I have two, about the same age, one from Berlin and one from NYC. The German one is in a barrel, but might just cover 11x14 well enough for contacts.

John Kasaian
14-Oct-2011, 08:51
I'm a lens snob!
Don't settle for cheap, you might get baaaad! This isn't to say you have to spend a ton of $$ to get a good lens (I don't) but settling for just cheap is false economy---you're spending plenty of time and money on film and chemicals and printing. Don't have to spend more money replacing a poor lens with one you should have started out with---or worse, get discourage when your negs repeatedly lack the 8x10's "sparkle" and throw in the towel.
8x10 is a great format with the potential to make negatives with mind-blowing detail (or dreamy swirlies if thats your goal) and your lens is a prime element in the equation.

I'd prefer using a pinhole to a bad piece of glass.

Any of the usually recommended 8x10 lenses in sound condition will be a massive improvement over anything else you've probably experenced. The time to experiment with POS glass is after you've found a good lens and are feeling experimental, IMHO.

E. von Hoegh
14-Oct-2011, 09:42
Thank you for your help! So far I've bought a Fujinon W 210, I scan ebay every day and will post a WTB on the other focal-lenghts aswell.

By the way, there are at least two versions of this lens. They don't all cover 8x10.

One has a 300mm~ IC, another about 350mm~. You need 312mm IC for 8x10 without movements.

John NYC
14-Oct-2011, 12:30
By the way, there are at least two versions of this lens. They don't all cover 8x10.

One has a 300mm~ IC, another about 350mm~. You need 312mm IC for 8x10 without movements.

Indeed I am surprised penguin found one of these in good shape and from a reliable source as I have been looking several times a day for a month or more. They are like dodo birds.

ThePenguin
14-Oct-2011, 13:22
According to the seller, this has a IC of 352mm, so I should be allright

E. von Hoegh
14-Oct-2011, 13:55
Nice WA for 8x10.

John NYC
14-Oct-2011, 14:00
According to the seller, this has a IC of 352mm, so I should be allright

That's great!!! Score!

ThePenguin
14-Oct-2011, 14:17
and the price of 340usd seems fair, in a seiko shutter

John NYC
14-Oct-2011, 14:35
and the price of 340usd seems fair, in a seiko shutter

That was the German eBay one? That looked very good, but I want a Copal, for no good reason really.