lightest most compact 4x5 rail view camera

[stradibarrius]

I currently have a calumet cc-400 with good movement and a rotating back.
I am thinking about something that is a bit lighter and packs up a little better...if there is such a thing.
If you were buying a rail camera that is reasonably priced what would you get and why?

[IanG]

Cambo (Calumet) Cadet.

Ian

[vinny]

toho. look on badgergraphic.com

[stradibarrius]

Does the Cambo SC have extension rails? Or is it difficult to remove the rail and re-install it?

[Dan Fromm]

Does the Cambo SC have extension rails? Or is it difficult to remove the rail and re-install it?
No. But and however, all sizes of SC use a 1"x1" rail. If you ask Google to find 80/20 t-slotted aluminum extrusion, it will find you vendors who'll sell you the stuff in, IIRC, lengths up to 8'.

I have a Baby Bertha that incorporates a 2x3 Graflex RB Ser. B and a 2x3 SC. At the moment the longest rail I have for it is a 4' length of 1"x1" (IIRC, they call it 1010 section) 80/20 that I bought from 80/20's surplus sales operation via Amazon.com.

Getting some, not all, SC standards -- I have 4 -- on it can be a tussle, but that's true of Cambo's own rails too.

FYI, Cambo's own rails have a spring-loaded stop at each end to make it hard to run a standard off the rail unintentionally. With a length of t-slotted extrusion one has to pay attention ...

If you want a really light 4x5 monorail, go, as you've already been directed, to Badger Graphics' site and look, as you haven't been told, at Toho cameras.

[stradibarrius]

I finally found the specs. on the SC and compared them to my cc-400. My cc-400 is actually about half a pound lighter??? 8.9lbs. for the SC and 8.5 for the cc-400. I do like the graduated markings on the Cambo the my cc-400 doesn't have.

[Peter York]

Kerry Thalmann has a great review of the Toho here: http://www.thalmann.com/largeformat/toho.htm

I love mine but it is really designed for ultralight situations, like backpacking. You may be able to find a rail camera with more flexibility (and greater weight) that meets your needs.

[jeroldharter]

Gowland Pocket View is smaller than a Toho but not as user friendly, e.g. Using an Allen wrench to tighten rather than knobs.

[cyrus]

The screws on the Gowland can be easily swapped out for knobs.

[jeroldharter]

The screws on the Gowland can be easily swapped out for knobs.

Do you have a link/source for the knobs?

I have seen pics of that but have not found any.

[Oren Grad]

The Gowland cameras varied quite a bit over the years. The two later ones that I've owned had knobs for all but the mounting of the rail(s) to the tripod block. Even with knobs, though, they're still pretty fiddly.

[Heespharm]

lowe's sells knobs with the same threading in their screw department

[Cor]

The screws on the Gowland can be easily swapped out for knobs.

True, although in Europe these inch sized threaded knobs are hard to find (it's all more logically over here with metric sizes..;-)..)

That said, with the back standard I switched back to the Allen screws, it's jut too hard to tighten knobs on the back, since you have to apply some force to open the back to insert the holder..frequently the position of the back is moved than, with these Allen thingies (screw? bolt?.."inbus bout") you can tighten them better..

It's a very light and small set up, but it not without drawbacks (search the forum) although I took it along on 2 holidays next to all the other luggage a family of 5 needs and came back with quite a few (to me ) pleasing images, at least all of them were not inhibited by the finicky operation of the Gowland.

Best,

Cor

[Robert Jonathan]

The Toho is a nice little camera, but why would you really want a light weight LF camera, besides for backpacking?

There's already so much stuff you can screw up in 4x5, a shaky camera is not another thing you should have to worry about.

I have a Sinar P and a Horseman LS. Both are extremely heavy, the Horseman being even more heavy and solid than the Sinar, and even those cameras can be wobbly if you don't handle the film holder insertion/removal process with care... and this is with the rails directly on Gitzo G1500 Aluminum tripod legs, with no tripod head. :)

[Emmanuel BIGLER]

lightest most compact 4x5 rail view camera

So far, I did no read the keyword "BUDGET" in this discussion :D

(hence should I dare to suggest : Arca Swiss misura ?)

[Bob Salomon]

Tk45s

[Frank Petronio]

Something like a Linhof Technikardan or an Arca-Swiss Discovery or F-Line Classic can be found in the $1000-plus range. They are by no means the smallest and lightest but they are compact and lightweight relative to their capabilities - very solid, studio-capable, all-around fine cameras - more "usable" than the ultralights mentioned above.

On the tighter budget side, there are a lot of possibilities and there are even more if you would be willing to take a hacksaw to your monorail and chop off the extra rail you don't need ;-p

My advice isn't often heeded but I keep coming back to keeping it cheap and simple: Get an inexpensive $200 to $500 Crown Graphic or other folding box type camera with a 135mm lens and use that out hiking about and in the rain, rough conditions, quick duty without a lot of futzing around with movements or being super-precise. And also get an inexpensive metal studio monorail for using closer to the car and home, indoors, anywhere you don't have to worry about a little extra bulk. Your old Calumet can be fine, but for $300 to $600 you can pick from a lot of great cameras, from Linhof Kardan variants to Sinar Normas to the Cambos with geared movements, Horseman, Toyo G, etc. These will be far more precise, stronger, and really a joy to use for every other reason but their bulk.

For the cost of one $1000 compromise you can have the best of both worlds.

[KyledeC]

You may want to check out Arca Swiss.

badgergraphic.com sells numerous models as well as accessories.

[ic-racer]

I think the Graphic View would be what you want. They are very inexpensive and much more lightweight than the Calumet you have.

http://graflex.org/articles/graphic-view/GraphicViewII.html

[Jim Noel]

Gowland Pocket View is smaller than a Toho but not as user friendly, e.g. Using an Allen wrench to tighten rather than knobs.

Later models had knobs.

[John Schneider]

For knobs, try the usual suspects: McMaster-Carr and Reid Tool Supply. They have dozens of varieties.

I've owned all four of the superlight 4x5 rail cameras, the Toho (both the FC-45 and FC-45X), Gowland Pocket View, and Galvin. The Gowland was fiddly and I hated the friction drive focusing, so I quickly sold it. The Toho cameras are lighter and more rigid, but idiosyncratic (more so the 45X). Although a bit heavier, I preferred the earlier 45 version with the big rectangular rail. The Galvin may be a tad heavier than the Toho, but it is set up like a "typical" monorail, just lighter. For just a little bit more weight, you get (IMHO) quite a bit more ease of use and quicker setup than the Toho. However they are very rare and hard to find.

[Vaughn]

Another vote for the Gowland (I have an early version sold by Calumet, no knobs except focusing). It is a camera one either loves or quickly gets rid of! LOL! Later models weighed more but came with knobs, with backs that could go vertical or horizontal, and more back movements.

About a kilogram with a Caltar II-N 150/5.6 attached. Folds flat nicely, but can be kept on the pod all day. I see it as a monorail field camera, not as a studio camera.

[Jeff Keller]

It's not a rail camera but you should look at a Canham DLC45. Very little limitation on movements and field friendly.

Jeff Keller

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Do you have a link/source for the knobs?


It's not a rail camera but you should look at a Canham DLC45. Very little limitation on movements and field friendly.

In fact, the T-knobs used on the Canham DLC fit the Gowland Pocket View perfectly. I retrofitted my Pocket View with T-knobs from Canham in place of the hex screws. Made it MUCH eaiser to use and added somewhere around 1/4 - 1/2 ounce of weight.

Kerry

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

Tk45s

No!

The OP is looking for something lightweight and reasonably priced. The TK45S is a great camera, but it's the heaviest, most expensive 4x5 camera I have ever used.

Kerry

[Ken Lee]

When we consider the overall weight (and size) of a kit, we should keep things in perspective. A few pounds one way or the other for the camera, will represent only a fraction of the overall weight. Size is a similar consideration. Given that the camera is the most important tool of all, it may make sense to economize elsewhere.

For example, the last time I weighed my 4x5 travel kit, I found that 3 film holders weigh around 1 pound. A bunch of them can easily out-weigh many lightweight field cameras.

We can also save weight by carrying a lighter dark cloth, fewer filters, and fewer (and lighter) lenses.

Unless we plan to enlarge a lot, we can crop our images a bit and mimic the effect of longer lenses. Granted, it's not the same as experience as composing the final image on the ground glass, but it can save a lot of weight. For example, a 150mm and 300mm lens can serve as a 150/225/300/450/600 quite effectively, if we limit our print size.

Another way to save weight is by not using a "photo" backpack, if a simple gym bag will do. It has the additional advantage of giving the impression, while sitting unattended, of nothing more valuable than a collection of dirty laundry. :) It's likely that one could safely leave such a bag of equipment in the back seat of a car - with some old running shoes next to it, and a pair of socks - and run a very low risk of break-in. If the socks look soiled, then it will probably deter a thief.

[Cor]

In fact, the T-knobs used on the Canham DLC fit the Gowland Pocket View perfectly. I retrofitted my Pocket View with T-knobs from Canham in place of the hex screws. Made it MUCH eaiser to use and added somewhere around 1/4 - 1/2 ounce of weight.

Kerry

Kerry,

that is an interesting option! I can see that these knobs allow you to apply more force when tightening the standards and rails. were could one buy these knobs (on line) ?

Thanks,

best,

Cor

[Really Big Cameras]

Kerry,

that is an interesting option! I can see that these knobs allow you to apply more force when tightening the standards and rails. were could one buy these knobs (on line) ?


The only place I know to buy them is directly from Keith Canham. His phone number is: 480-250-3990.

Kerry

[Kerry L. Thalmann]

When we consider the overall weight (and size) of a kit, we should keep things in perspective. A few pounds one way or the other for the camera, will represent only a fraction of the overall weight. Size is a similar consideration. Given that the camera is the most important tool of all, it may make sense to economize elsewhere.

This is true. However, if you start with a smaller, lighter camera, the weight savings snowballs from there. For example, with a 2 - 3 lb. camera (like the Gowland or Toho) instead of a 6 - 7 lb. camera, you can use a lighter, more compact tripod and ballhead.

For example, when I was shooting with a Linhof Technikardan TK45S, the absolute minimum support system I would use was the Gitzo 1325 (4.5 lb.) with an ARCA-SWISS B1 ballhead (1 lb. 10.5 oz.). That combination weighed 6 lb. 2.5 oz. and the TK45S weighed 7 lb. 8.25 oz. With the lighter Toho (2 lb. 12.5 oz.), I can go with a lighter ballhead (in the 10 - 12 oz. range) and a lighter, more compact carbon fiber "traveler" style tripod (in the 2.2 - 2.5 lb. range). So, not only do I save almost 5 lb. in camera weight, but I also saved an addition 3 lb. on the tripod and head.

And, because the lighter camera and tripod are also much more compact, they fit in a much smaller lighter daypack. saving a couple more pounds. Of course, I also reduce the size and weight of other items in my backpacking kit. My lightmeter went from 8 oz. to 1.5 oz. I carry a 3 - 4 lens lit with a total weight of 1 - 1.5 lb (compared to a six lens kit that weighs about 4.5 lb. for general purpose use), fewer (4 vs. 6) and smaller (52mm vs. 67mm) filters with stack caps instead of a filter wallet, etc. But, it all starts with a smaller, lighter camera and the majority of the weight savings (about 10 lb.) comes from the camera, tripod/head and pack.

Kerry

[Ken Lee]

Excellent !