USA to UK electrical converter

[jeroldharter]

I am going to England in August. I need to get a converter to recharge my Kindle, P&S camera batteries, etc.

What do I need?

[Riverman]

One of these

http://appparel.web.fc2.com/B000PQL7AQ.html

This adapter doesn't alter voltage though. That should not be a problem for camera/laptop/phone batteries etc where the recharging unit is usually good for 110 or 240 voltage.

However, if you're taking any other larger appliances (unlikely) - maybe a guitar amplifier or a coffee machine! you'll need to get a step-up voltage transformer.

http://www.threedoubleyou.com/convertpower.htm

Where will you be in England. Taking your camera?

[jeroldharter]

Thanks. That answers my unexpressed question: can I get just a plug adapter or do I need a voltage transformer as well. Sounds like I could just get the cheap plug converter?

We will be in and out of London, go to Oxford, visit a castle, and stay near the lake district. It is mostly a family trip, not a photo trip. But I will be "sneaking" my 8x10 outfit along!

[Riverman]

Thanks. That answers my unexpressed question: can I get just a plug adapter or do I need a voltage transformer as well. Sounds like I could just get the cheap plug converter?

We will be in and out of London, go to Oxford, visit a castle, and stay near the lake district. It is mostly a family trip, not a photo trip. But I will be "sneaking" my 8x10 outfit along!

Sounds like a great trip. As a Tab man myself I'd encourage you to visit Cambridge over Oxford ;-) Far, far prettier and only 45 minutes from Central London by train from Kings Cross. A walk along the 'Backs' presents you with some of the finest scenery in all of England imho. Wren's library at Trinity College, King's College Chapel and the gardens at Clare. An even better way to see the backs is by punt - though that might present stability issues for an 8x10 shooter!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Backs

I first discovered photography during my first year at Cambridge.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/sbk21/4471302399/in/set-72157623068891708

[Ash]

Don't use those basic little ones. Go straight to a Maplins or Currys store in the UK and buy a proper voltage converter, or it will be an expensive trip when you have to replace all your toys.

I live about an hour from Oxford so if you're around for long enough (and I have a day off) we can meet for a drink. Or if it's when I have time off then we could meet in London.

[jeroldharter]

Riverman,

Thanks for the tips. My wife is the planner for this trip so I am along for the ride. Apparently you can stay in the dormitories at Oxford so we will be doing that.

I usually do a lot of planning but I am taking a paradoxical approach to this trip and just showing up with my camera to see what I can find. My biggest worry is taking enough film! Anticipate blowing through a significant pile of TMY2 8x10.

Ash,

Looks like we will be in Oxford August 9-10.

[Bob Salomon]

Look at the input on your chargers. Are they dual voltage or 100-120V only? If dual voltage then you only need plug adapters. If not you need a converter. Or you can get a universal charger like the Ansmann that will charge any 3.6 to 7.2V LiOn battery as well as AA and AAA NiCad and NiMh cells on any voltage including 12V car outlets.

[rdenney]

Bob has it right.

First, the voltage in England is 240 volts AC, 50 Hz. The voltage in the U.S. is 120 volts AC, 60 Hz. Anything that uses AC directly, which includes plug-in clocks and motor-driven appliances, will not work at all. Not only will the voltage be wrong, but the frequency will also be wrong. A power drill with a voltage converter might work, but it will not work efficiently at 50 Hz.

But most of the stuff we use runs on DC, not AC, and the power bricks that come with those items convert AC to DC. For them, the frequency is not nearly as important. This includes anything that uses a power brick or a wall transformer.

To see if those will work with a simple plug adapter, look at their labels. Most computer power bricks are designed for international use, and have labels that will say "Input: 100-240 V, (some number of milliamps), 50-60Hz" (I just read this from my Dell laptop's power brick.) Anything that says "100-240V" and "50-60 Hz" in the input description will work fine with a simple plug adapter. These are transistor-controlled switching power supplies that are not sensitive to input AC voltage in producing the required DC output voltage. Another example is the battery charger that came with my Leica D-Lux digicam. It says, "Input: 110V-240V ~ 50/60Hz..." This will work with a simple plug adapter.

But I also have a wall transformer for a hand-held radio here at my desk, and that one reads "120V 60Hz" in the input section of the label. This does not include 240V and 50Hz, and it will NOT work without a voltage transformer at least.

Fortunately, most electronic devices are designed for international use and will cover the required voltage range.

You can also get plug-in transformers, but be careful of their power ratings. They will not run high-power appliances, including ANYTHING with a heating element. They are only good for small electronic items. I have several and they all work fine for that purpose.

Leave the hair dryer at home. Buy one when you get there if you must have one and your hotel doesn't provide one. Likewise an electric shaver, though most of those are DC now and will work (read the label).

Note that electrical outlets in England have changed standards in the last few years. Nearly all recent ones conform to the current standard, which is a three-prong plug with a wide stance in comparison to U.S. plugs. In outlets designed for that standard, you often must have the third prong or the plug will not allow you to make the connection. The travel plug-in transformers often only have phase and neutral with no safety ground, and will provide a plastic prong for the third opening on the outlet. These can only be used for small items that are double-insulated and do not need a safety ground. England also has older outlets without the third prong, but with the wide stance, and I seem to recall an even older design that is a different shape altogether.

I have traveled in some countries that provided 110V outlets for American travelers using a standard US-style two-prong outlet. Use only if labeled clearly enough that you have no doubts. I don't recall seeing these in England last time I was there, but I have seen them in parts of the world that did use English electrical standards for some things (and that cater to British ex-pats), such as Dubai.

Rick "who has never seen a computer power brick that did not accept up to 240VAC input" Denney

[jeroldharter]

Thanks everyone for the thoughtful replies. Very helpful.

[Tobias Key]

Note that electrical outlets in England have changed standards in the last few years. Nearly all recent ones conform to the current standard, which is a three-prong plug with a wide stance in comparison to U.S. plugs. In outlets designed for that standard, you often must have the third prong or the plug will not allow you to make the connection. The travel plug-in transformers often only have phase and neutral with no safety ground, and will provide a plastic prong for the third opening on the outlet. These can only be used for small items that are double-insulated and do not need a safety ground. England also has older outlets without the third prong, but with the wide stance, and I seem to recall an even older design that is a different shape altogether.



The three prong plug has been standard in the UK since 1947

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363)

There has definitely NOT been a change in standard recently.

[davemiller]

You are now unlikely to come across any other than the 13amp socket here, these have 3 rectangular pins as the adaptor in Riverman's post. Rdenney's advice is also good.
I don't know how you are planning to get around but there is a good train service between Oxford and London also a slower and cheaper coach (bus). Taking a car into London is not a good idea. If you go in by train you can buy a combined rail and underground ticket called a Travelcard that will allow unrestricted travel on our underground train network for a day and is good value. If you buy your tickets in advance you can save money.
Enjoy your visit.

[rdenney]

The three prong plug has been standard in the UK since 1947

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BS_1363)

There has definitely NOT been a change in standard recently.

Have they always been shuttered? I can look up NEMA standards but not BS standards, so I don't know. I sure saw lots of appliances such as lamps that did not have the third prong.

I also saw plenty of round-pin BS546 outlets in the hotel where I stayed on my last visit to London. Of course, that hotel (a few blocks from the Goodge St. tube station) was built in the late 1700's. Who knows when it was retrofitted for electricity? Maybe 1947 is "recent" in some parts of the UK, heh. Point being: You might run into old stuff--it's an old country. It's the same in the U.S.--the phase and neutral prongs of the standard NEMA 1-15 plug have not changed since a long time before 1947, but the addition of polarity and the safety ground has changed (making the NEMA 5-15 plug), and there are many places built as recently as the 1960's where one might have to use an adapter to plug a polarized two-prong or a three-prong plug from a computer power brick into a non-polarized two-prong outlet.

And in the UAE, where this plug is also supposedly a standard, I saw many variations.

Rick "who used his computer and kept all batteries charged with relative ease in London" Denney

[Steve Smith]

First, the voltage in England is 240 volts AC

230 actually.


The three prong plug has been standard in the UK since 1947

There has definitely NOT been a change in standard recently.

The standard 13 amp plug, although originally designed in 1947, didn't really become popular until the mid 1960s when it started to replace the 3 amp and 15 amp round pin sockets. It is still the standard (and only) domestic power outlet socket in the UK.


Steve.

[Ash]

The two pin connections are only for shavers and electric toothbrushes. You'll see them in hotels but rarely in homes. We don't use them unless we have to.

[rdenney]

230 actually.

Yeah, I should have liberally thrown in the word "nominal". Standard voltages used to be 110VAC in the U.S., and then 115VAC, but now the standard is 120VAC, even though all those values get thrown around interchangeably. And out on the end of any given string, it might be anywhere in that range. But I have 240 wired in the brain--it's what you get across the split-phase positives of single-phase service in the U.S., each leg providing 120VAC in opposite phase to the other.

I didn't have a DVM with me in London, heh.

It takes a while for standard to work their way through a durable infrastructure. I still carry a NEMA 5-15 (three prong) to 1-15 (two-prong) adapter in my briefcase--and I've had to use it even in state office buildings I visit.

Rick "the good thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from" Denney

[Steve Smith]

it's what you get across the split-phase positives of single-phase service in the U.S., each leg providing 120VAC in opposite phase to the other.

We have three phase power with phases spaced at 120 degrees rather than 180. Each of the three phases supplies 230 volts with respect to neutral or 415 across two phases. Unlike the US where high power appliances are sometimes connected across both phases, we either use single phase to neutral or all three phases for industrial machinery. It is very rare to have all three phases domestically.

We used to be at 240 volts and the rest of Europe was 220 so we standardised half way at 230. I suppose that for a while, our light bulbs were a little bit dimmer whilst those in the rest of Europe didn't last quite as long!


Steve.

[rdenney]

We have three phase power with phases spaced at 120 degrees rather than 180. Each of the three phases supplies 230 volts with respect to neutral or 415 across two phases. Unlike the US where high power appliances are sometimes connected across both phases, we either use single phase to neutral or all three phases for industrial machinery. It is very rare to have all three phases domestically.

We used to be at 240 volts and the rest of Europe was 220 so we standardised half way at 230. I suppose that for a while, our light bulbs were a little bit dimmer whilst those in the rest of Europe didn't last quite as long!

Our commercial and industrial situations are also wired with three-phase power, spaced at 120 degrees. Homes are not.

Of course, the value in the higher voltage is that it requires less current to achieve the same power, and wire is sized for current rather than power. Thus, at 120VAC, some of our appliances would require such thick cable that it isn't practical. So we wire those at 240 using both legs of the split single-phase service. Europe's electrical power development took a different path and was able to commit to the higher voltage earlier. If our houses were wired for 240VAC (okay, nominal) for all outlets and appliances, we would not need the split-phase service.

Despite the above, it still seems that wiring in the UK uses much larger wire than in the U.S. Do you guys really use 2.5mm^2 wiring to feed 13-amp receptacles? We typically use 14-gauge (a hair over 2mm^2) for 15-amp protected circuits that allow 15-amp receptacles. Of course, 13 amps at 230VAC will provide a lot more power (3000 Watts) than 15 amps at 120VAC (1800 Watts).

We end up with power panels that have 0 phase on even-numbered taps in the panel, and 180-degree phase on the odd-numbered taps. So, 240VAC appliances are fed from a circuit breaker that uses adjacent taps, with a separate neutral. It's really goofy--but it's a holdover from the days of Edison.

Rick "whose water well pump, dryer, range, and water heater, welder, and amateur radio amplifier run at 240VAC" Denney

[Paul Ewins]

We've just returned from two months in the UK and Europe which required two adapters for our Australian plugs (another "standard" again). Because we have multiple devices we normally buy a cheap powerboard (i.e. four outlets in a plastic case with a short length of flex) and plug that into the converter and then the devices into the powerboard. At the end of the trip it goes into the hotel wastebin so we have more room for purchases.

[Helen Bach]

Despite the above, it still seems that wiring in the UK uses much larger wire than in the U.S. Do you guys really use 2.5mm^2 wiring to feed 13-amp receptacles? We typically use 14-gauge (a hair over 2mm^2) for 15-amp protected circuits that allow 15-amp receptacles. Of course, 13 amps at 230VAC will provide a lot more power (3000 Watts) than 15 amps at 120VAC (1800 Watts).

One of the very first things I learned about using lights when I came to the US from the UK was that I wouldn't be able to draw the maximum current from each of two sockets (receptacles) on the same circuit. 30 A or 32 A, 230/240 V ring "mains" (common for 13 A socket circuits in the UK) really come in handy when you are using 2000 watt (sic) fresnels - though I never connected three to a single circuit, two were usually no problem.

Best,
Helen

[Steve Smith]

Despite the above, it still seems that wiring in the UK uses much larger wire than in the U.S. Do you guys really use 2.5mm^2 wiring to feed 13-amp receptacles?

Yes. 2.5mm is the standard for sockets but we run a stupid system called a ring main. There might be four or five sockets where the cable runs from the consumer unit (fuse box) to the first socket, then to the second and so on. Then at the last socket, it runs back to the consumer unit to form a loop (or ring).

I don't like this system because you will never know if there was a break in one of the wires as it will still be connected by the other half of the loop and it would be possible to overload the remaining working section of the ring.

A single socket on a spur can be run from 1.5mm cable but it is nearly always connected with 2.5mm.

Lighting circuits are 1.5mm or 1.0mm.


Steve.

[Steve Smith]

Our commercial and industrial situations are also wired with three-phase power, spaced at 120 degrees. Homes are not.

So does the US have separate distribution systems for industrial and domestic?

We just have the three phase system. Houses are given one phase and neutral and factories are given all three.

It seems a bit too overcomplicated to run a three phase and a two phase system.


Steve.

[Marc B.]

Jerold,
Wait until you are in the UK to buy your converter. You will get a superior product, at a competitive price, from sellers that are far more experienced in the idiosyncrasies of converters, "over there," rather then electronic store staff here.

[Frank Petronio]

Why we didn't fix this issue when we owned the world really bugs me. Stupid Harry Truman. It's so inconvenient.

[Steve Smith]

Why we didn't fix this issue when we owned the world really bugs me. Stupid Harry Truman. It's so inconvenient.

But you're the only country with a strange low voltage (possibly Canada as well).

p.s. When did you own the world? I thought that was the British Empire!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mains_electricity_by_country


Steve.

[rdenney]

So does the US have separate distribution systems for industrial and domestic?

No. All distribution is run in three-phase, except from the distribution transformer to a house. The voltage across each leg is 240 volts. A transformer for a residential application provides a center tap with two legs of the three-phase service attached to the outer taps. The center tap is grounded (earthed) to provide a neutral, against which the other two taps are 120VAC in opposite phase. So, the service is really single-phase 240 volts with a center earth, allowing some appliances to run at 240 volts and some to run at 120 volts depending on which tap they use. Again, it derives from the old Edison system.

Of course, voltages in most parts of the distribution system are much higher, and they are stepped down as needed. It is quite typical for an industrial/commercial user to get 480V three-phase from the same distribution lines, from which all of the above can be derived.

There is no question that 240 volts is a superior voltage for household use. It provides more power with less copper, and if you touch it the voltage will throw your hand away rather than grab you.

Rick "recognizing that standards move slowly when applied to a durable infrastructure" Denney

[rdenney]

But you're the only country with a strange low voltage (possibly Canada as well).

It didn't seem so strange back in the day.

But 120 volts (nominal) is used not just in the U.S. and Canada, but also in the remainder of North America and a large part of South America. Travel to Brazil if you want confusion on which adapters to bring--they usually provide several in any given hotel room, sometimes with little indication of what is actually provided on them.

A bigger problem than voltage is frequency. The difference between 50 Hz and 60 Hz may seem esoteric, but it is responsible for a lot of diverging derivative standards. It's one reason that NTSC and PAL were never compatible, for example.

Rick "noting that the U.S. has no monopoly on 'strange' standards" Denney

[Bob Salomon]

It didn't seem so strange back in the day.

But 120 volts (nominal) is used not just in the U.S. and Canada, but also in the remainder of North America and a large part of South America. Travel to Brazil if you want confusion on which adapters to bring--they usually provide several in any given hotel room, sometimes with little indication of what is actually provided on them.

A bigger problem than voltage is frequency. The difference between 50 Hz and 60 Hz may seem esoteric, but it is responsible for a lot of diverging derivative standards. It's one reason that NTSC and PAL were never compatible, for example.

Rick "noting that the U.S. has no monopoly on 'strange' standards" Denney

And in Japan as well.

[Steve Smith]

No. All distribution is run in three-phase, except from the distribution transformer to a house. The voltage across each leg is 240 volts. A transformer for a residential application provides a center tap with two legs of the three-phase service attached to the outer taps.

That makes more sense.


Steve.

[Justin Cormack]

And in Japan as well.

Japan has two frequencies, which is very odd - they bought half their equipment from Europe and the other half from the US.

Talking of electricity and large format, I really like Christopher Payne's book of New York substations http://www.chrispaynephoto.com/substations.html

[Steve Smith]

A bigger problem than voltage is frequency. The difference between 50 Hz and 60 Hz may seem esoteric, but it is responsible for a lot of diverging derivative standards.

At work, we made some equipment for our American parent company. They sent us the control PCB and power supply to test it with. I connected it to a transformer to drop the voltage to 115v but it didn't work.

I had to make an inverter to produce 115 v at 60Hz to make it work as it wouldn't work from our 50Hz supply. I still have no idea why.


Japan has two frequencies, which is very odd

The US had two frequencies at one time (and DC). I have a book with reproductions of advertisements for Gibson guitar amplifiers (1940s - 1950s) and they had to be ordered for either 60Hz or 25Hz (or rather cycles per second) The 25c/s version must have had a much bigger transformer!


Steve.

[Bob Salomon]

At work, we made some equipment for our American parent company. They sent us the control PCB and power supply to test it with. I connected it to a transformer to drop the voltage to 115v but it didn't work. Steve.

In the US we have found voltages as low as 95V during the summer in NY City when there were brown outs and had auto switching flash equipment blow up when it could not find the proper voltage to latch on to. That was in the 70's and maybe things have gotten better but we had to import studio flash power packs specific to the voltage range in NYC.

[Steve Smith]

In the case I was referring to, it was the 50Hz instead of 60Hz frequency which was the problem rather than the voltage.


Steve.

[Bob Salomon]

In the case I was referring to, it was the 50Hz instead of 60Hz frequency which was the problem rather than the voltage.


Steve.

In our case it was voltage. The very low voltage caused the relay to keep latching between voltages trying to find the right voltage and overheated the board which then blew out. Not very nice with a $1500.00 power pack in the early 70s.

[E. von Hoegh]

At work, we made some equipment for our American parent company. They sent us the control PCB and power supply to test it with. I connected it to a transformer to drop the voltage to 115v but it didn't work.

I had to make an inverter to produce 115 v at 60Hz to make it work as it wouldn't work from our 50Hz supply. I still have no idea why.



The US had two frequencies at one time (and DC). I have a book with reproductions of advertisements for Gibson guitar amplifiers (1940s - 1950s) and they had to be ordered for either 60Hz or 25Hz (or rather cycles per second) The 25c/s version must have had a much bigger transformer!


Steve.

And bigger filter caps.

I remember talking to a tech who had worked in Saudi Arabia in the late 1970s at a place that used 50 cycle Diesel generators for power. The frequency regulation was poor, plus he needed 60 cycles. So he used a 800 watt solid state guitar amp, driving it with an audio signal generator and using a synchronous clock to set the frequency!
I was surprised that the amp would swing 120v, but apparently it did fine.

[Steve Smith]

I was surprised that the amp would swing 120v, but apparently it did fine.

A 800 watt amplifier would have a power supply easily capable of 120v ac output. Even a 100 watt amp would have a +/- 55 volt power supply so it could just about manage it. I don't think I have ever seen a solid state guitar amp rated as high as 800 watts though (unless that's its input power consumption rather than its output power).

I have a book written in the 1950s on hi fidelity sound reproduction. A UK company were touring the country giving demonstrations of record decks and amplifiers. To counter strange frequencies in various parts of the country they used a Quad valve (tube) amplifier with a 50Hz generator at the input and a modified output transformer to drive the record deck motors at the right speed.


Steve.

[tom thomas]

Gerald,
visit a Radio Shack before you go and check out their plug adapter kits, either just the plugs themselves or small transformers if your appliance only runs 110/120VAC. Also check Tuesday Morning (if you have them in Wisconsin), Belks. I've found the adapter kits in several places, often at cut rate prices. Even Wally World has them.


Or check out the shops the airport for the adapter kits. Be prepared to pay a premium though. Tax free means elevated price to cover monopoly lust.

For your laptop or item which has the 3-prong US grounded plug, get a 3 wire to 2 wire adapter as well or be prepared to cut off the ground plug on your AC cable. You'll find them in the tool section of hardware stores.

You may want to buy a low cost polarity checker as well. Older wiring doesn't always follow the rules so you can find the hot side riding on the shell of your laptop and other equipment. Some look like small screwdrivers with neon light in the handle. Just make sure they will check up to 240VAC.

Watch out using Ring Main connected outlets in hotels as well. They can run as high as 260-280 VAC depending on just how many factories are near your hotel and what they are doing at the moment. I lost an American TV running on a transformer back in the mid-70's in Banbury because the nearby factory cranked up the ovens to make Maxwell House instant coffee that evening. Lights dimmed, flashed, and so did the TV. And the resulting coffee dust from the chimneys would eat paint off cars too.

Incidentally, 3-phase power here in the US is typically 208VAC, not 240 VAC.

Tom