Jobo choice: CPE-2 vs CPP-2 for B&W 4x5 shooter?

[Laszlo]

I am mostly shooting 4x5 BW, currently developing in a Combiplan tank. I am interested in buying a Jobo processsor, but have never used one. What do I lose if I go with a CPE-2 as opposed to CPP-2? Thanks.

[sanchi heuser]

You lose the possibility of using the Jobo expert drums
cause these drums are too big for the CPE2.

There were a lot of threads here about the expert drums for getting better, more even developed
black & white negatives. For color the CPE 2 and the smaller drums of the 2500 series are perfect.
But good CPA 2 or CPP 2 (especially later versions with better motors) and the expert drums
especially the 3010 and 3005 are expensive!


Andi

[Ivan J. Eberle]

I've had the CPP2 for quite a few years and can well recommend as it can handle more tasks (particularly useful for E6 with it's six bottle slots and very close control of temperature).

Never used the CPE2 but with it you give up fully automated temp control, processor tray length and a couple of processor slots for bottles. From memory, the longest tube you can use with the CPE2 is a 14" (or is it 16"?); I'm sure that the CPP2 handles 20" long ones, including the Expert drum that will do 20x24's (if you can yet find one).

If all you do is B&W and never intend to exceed the print size of the CPE2, it might be a better value.

Either will take the Lift Accessory, which I also recommend if you do much volume of printing, or ever want to process color film.

[Roger Cole]

CPE2 is ok if you never plan to do larger than 4x5. Temperature control isn't digital but once you calibrate it (check bath temperature with an accurate thermometer, adjust as needed until it's right, then put a fine mark on the knob) it's repeatable and plenty accurate enough.

I never had any problem doing six bath E6 with it either. There are four bottle slots plus four graduate slots. You could, if you wanted, have up to eight different chemicals tempered.

All that said I'd love to have one of the larger ones some day. But while my CPE2 works, I'm not in a hurry and need other things worse. If it died tomorrow I'd be shopping for a CPA or CPP the same day.

[Greg Blank]

CPP2&CPA machines circulate the water, CPE machines do not. CPA & CPE machines use a mechanical rheostat to adjust the temperature, the CPP2 using a series of comparator IC chips to calculate heating and cooling.

[SeanEsopenko]

I got the CPA-2 so I could specifically use the 3063 drum. I got my own jobo on Friday and once I work out some minor snags I'm having (learning RA4 at the same time) I plan on producing large 20x24's from this guy. Well at least large for me. Maybe in a year or two I'll be printing 30x40?

[Greg Blank]

Be careful with the CPA and large volumes of chemistry. Any serial number lower than 22,000 has and old style motor and can be burned out or the circuitry supporting can be. If you are using a big drum and more than 500 ml of chemicals consider two increments of time instead of using more chemistry for less time. Lots of experience seeing burned out motors.


I got the CPA-2 so I could specifically use the 3063 drum. I got my own jobo on Friday and once I work out some minor snags I'm having (learning RA4 at the same time) I plan on producing large 20x24's from this guy. Well at least large for me. Maybe in a year or two I'll be printing 30x40?

[Eric Brody]

I've had both the CPE and the CPA. The CPA (or CPP) is much more sturdy. But the deal breaker for most people, and the reason I sold my CPE, is to be able to use the Expert drum. The Jobo Expert drum expensive as it is, produces the most even development I've ever seen for 4x5. Many famous experts, John Sexton comes to mind, agree. The CPA does not have the water cooler or digital control of temperature, but for black and white, there's no real reason to spend more for the CPP over the CPA.

[Sirius Glass]

I bought a CPA without bottles or tanks.
Less than a week later I bought a CPP 2 with graduate, bottles and one tank for $50US more.
Sold the CPA because I wanted to do color film and color prints too and the temperature control appealed.
Then bought the 3010 Expert Drum for 4x5s. I never know that the CPE and maybe the CPA could not take the 3000 series drums.
I am a happy camper.

Steve

[Bob McCarthy]

I read a post recently that a Cpe user claimed "one" of the expert drums would work. I bought a Cpe w/o the understanding that expert drums not apply.

Is that true, that one of the expert drums is small enough?

Been looking for a 2500 series and reels!!

Bob

B

[Greg Blank]

They might fit, but the motor in the CPE and CPE2+ is dinky compared to the CPP2 and CPA. The older versions of the CPA and CPP2 motors had three revisions prior to the final version which was devised to make the motor suitable for Expert drum use.

In order for an Expert drums to fit the lift of any processor their must be about 5 1/4 inches clearance measured from the bottom of the trough to the middle of the upper spout. Now even if the Drum does go onto the CPE-CPE2+ lift, its only a matter of time until the motor will quit.



I read a post recently that a Cpe user claimed "one" of the expert drums would work. I bought a Cpe w/o the understanding that expert drums not apply.

Is that true, that one of the expert drums is small enough?

Been looking for a 2500 series and reels!!

Bob

B

[Jeremy Moore]

...its only a matter of time until the motor will quit.

Isn't that every motor? :D

I have an early CPA I've used with Expert drums for 4 years now and it was used with Expert drums for 3 years before that (I believe)... at some point I fully expect it to die, but until then....

[Greg Blank]

Yes, until then you be considering your next purchase, a digital P&S. :D


Isn't that every motor? :D

I have an early CPA I've used with Expert drums for 4 years now and it was used with Expert drums for 3 years before that (I believe)... at some point I fully expect it to die, but until then....

[Cor]

my 2 cents..(again, since my post got lost in the crash it appears..)

Have a CPE and the 2509n reels to process B&W 4*5 for years now. Only very recently I could borrow a Jobo 3010 Expert drum (Thanks friends!).

The combination 2509n, EFKE IR and PyrocatHD give almost constantly strange artifacts along the long dimensions of the negatives: underdevelopment, surge marks, and imprints of the little plastic thingies that hold the negatives in the reel.

Less so on Fp4+ in Xtol

After the first trails with the Expert 3010 and a Simma Sinus roller (the wheels of that roller are a tad to wide apart to realy nicely roll the drum, they should be a bit closer together, ideas?); perfectly processed negatives!

Best,

Cor

[Greg Blank]

Hei Lähetän kuvan siitä, mitä puhumme. :)



After the first trails with the Expert 3010 and a Simma Sinus roller (the wheels of that roller are a tad to wide apart to realy nicely roll the drum, they should be a bit closer together, ideas?); perfectly processed negatives!

Best,

Cor

[Greg Blank]

Seemly-Less arrogant now :)

Any motor can be fixed, I have taken apart motors an have cleaned them up to where they work again. Is all a result of using patience versus needing to have an immediate conclusion.



Yes, until then you be considering your next purchase, a digital P&S. :D

[Cor]

Hei Lähetän kuvan siitä, mitä puhumme. :)

I am not from Finland, but what do you mean by:

"Hey, I am sending a picture of what we are talking about"..?

You sound like those spam mails, not sure if I want to see your picture...:D


Best,

Cor

[SamReeves]

I think it all depends on your budget. If you can splurge, the CPP-2 and expert tanks are a very nice option. Otherwise the CPE-2 and 2500 series tanks will do the job too. Whatever you do, get a lift!!!